Fant4stic: Reborn! - - Part 21

[Zarex]

I still dislike trading Galactus and Surfer. Marvel wanted them back so they could be part of Infinity War. The main problem here is that Galactus works best when his first appearance is as a Lovecraftian planet eating abomination who's now up for eating Earth. We weren't going to get that. That and Marvel wanted the Badoon.

What Fox should trade would be the rights to Star Wars Episode IV, the merch rights for both the X-Men and Fantastic Four, the rights to the Badoon and Brood and an agreement to share the Shi'Ar in exchange for being able to cross over the X-Men and Fantastic Four and make an X-Men TV series.

You're mixing apples and oranges in this package. The rights to Star Wars are EXTREMELY valuable. I hate to say it, but that alone might be enough for Disney to give up X Men TV rights and allow Crossovers between the FF and the X Men.

Everything else you mentioned - X-Men and Fantastic Four merchandise along the rights to the Badoon and the Brood and co-ownership of the Shi'ar have pretty much no value.

Since Disney seems to be sitting out this negotiation, let's keep it simple:

Marvel maintains the TV rights, but allows FOX to do a TV show. FOX agrees to share the characters in the Silver Surfer contract, which includes Galactus and his Heralds, the Surfer and the Badoon.

Or

Marvel sells FOX the TV rights to the X-men character family. FOX agrees to revert the FF and Surfer character families at a date certain (2020?).

 

[metaphysician]

I loved Ang Lee's Hulk so if it's anything like that I'd be pretty juiced.

Sadly, I wouldn't count on it. Josh Trank is no Ang Lee, and the cast is nothing compared to the relative all-star squad Hulk had.

*ponders Nick Nolte playing Doom*

 

[Orba]

If anything Ang Lee went for a far less grounded and gritting take, instead going far more for a live action comic book. Been a while since I watched it but didn't he even use comic book panels in cuts and some scenes?

 

[metaphysician]

This is pretty much a faithful UFF adaptation.

Reed and Been get invited to the Baxter Institute by Franklin Storm, father of Johnny and adopted father to Sue, for a N-Zone experiment based on Reed's work Also present is Victor. During the experiment, something goes wrong, and young Reed, Ben, Johnny, Sue, and Victor get abilities


Sounds like UFF to me.

The only difference seems to be that, as opposed to building a straight forward portal to the N-Zone, they build a teleportation pod (ala The Fly ) to the N-Zone.

You know, I wonder if they did the "teleportation pod" set design because portal CGI would have been too expensive? t:

( P.S.: Stargate SG-1 is the best Fantastic Four TV show ever )

 

[metaphysician]

Who the hell wouldn't want to see a comic accurate Doom? Once we get there, then we can talk about a crossover.

Doom is arguably Marvel's greatest villain. My God, he could possibly be one of the greatest comic book villains ever on screen. Yet they for some reason don't want to show us that Doom.

Sadly, it looks like the closest to Dr Doom we will see any time soon was Khan in Star Trek Into Darkness. Cumberbatch hit the perfect balance of arrogance, confidence, and competence, that of the megalomaniac who is *almost* as good as he thinks he is.

 

[metaphysician]

The idea of watching Stark trying to puzzle out some Reed tech makes me happy.

It'd need to be a new Reed portrayal. None of the existing Reed portrayals have been anything Stark couldn't manage. Which makes me sad. Reed *should* be the benchmark by which all comic book geniuses are measured ( and come up short ). Instead, he's arguably the least impressive supergenius to appear in any Marvel-derived movie.

 

[Urich Leeds]

If anything Ang Lee went for a far less grounded and gritting take, instead going far more for a live action comic book. Been a while since I watched it but didn't he even use comic book panels in cuts and some scenes?

He did in fact. I love the visual style of that movie.

 

[Zarex]

It'd need to be a new Reed portrayal. None of the existing Reed portrayals have been anything Stark couldn't manage. Which makes me sad. Reed *should* be the benchmark by which all comic book geniuses are measured ( and come up short ). Instead, he's arguably the least impressive supergenius to appear in any Marvel-derived movie.

Maria Hill - When did you become an expert in (scientific mumbo jumbo)!

Tony Stark - Last night. Didn't anyone else do the homework?

 

[Dasher10]

You're mixing apples and oranges in this package. The rights to Star Wars are EXTREMELY valuable. I hate to say it, but that alone might be enough for Disney to give up X Men TV rights and allow Crossovers between the FF and the X Men.

Everything else you mentioned - X-Men and Fantastic Four merchandise along the rights to the Badoon and the Brood and co-ownership of the Shi'ar have pretty much no value.

Since Disney seems to be sitting out this negotiation, let's keep it simple:

Marvel maintains the TV rights, but allows FOX to do a TV show. FOX agrees to share the characters in the Silver Surfer contract, which includes Galactus and his Heralds, the Surfer and the Badoon.

Or

Marvel sells FOX the TV rights to the X-men character family. FOX agrees to revert the FF and Surfer character families at a date certain (2020?).

I don't feel like Galactus and Surfer are that valuable aside from appearing in Infinity War. Marvel would get far more mileage out of the Shi'ar.

And the merch rights aren't worthless. Marvel isn't creating any because they don't want to cannibalize their own profits by producing additional items where they have to share revenue. Marvel would be looking at a few hundred million for each of Fox's films.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

The Shi'ar are nothing. They could be replaced by several other alien races or Marvel could just make up a new one. There is no downside to Marvel not being able to use them.

Galactus can be the main focus of a whole phase, ala Thanos. Silver Surfer is even more valuable than that. He can carry his own solo franchise.

 

[craigdbfan]

I do want Silver Surfer and Thanos back at Marvel but I firmly believe Disney shouldn't allow conceding anything. That's counterproductive to their overall goal.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I do want Silver Surfer and Thanos back at Marvel but I firmly believe Disney shouldn't allow conceding anything. That's counterproductive to their overall goal.

If they can get a net gain out of it, I would consider doing it. It is something they would have to weigh the consequences of.

I would never concede anything if I was Marvel in return for something of limited value. Simply standing pat and not allowing Fox to make their TV show is a victory for Marvel in itself, just by doing nothing.

 

[Doctor Jones]

This sounds like something you'd expect with the X-Men, but I like the idea overall. Maybe not for the FF, but it sounds like a very interesting concept. It is not an unheard idea either.

It is. It really is interesting. So why couldn't they have applied these interesting concepts to a more faithful adaptation combined with the already inherent uniqueness of all things Fantastic Four?

Yes, I think you probably are.

Don't shoot the messenger, but I'd put something like 10:1 odds this will get a sequel for three basic reasons:

1. The budget is low.
2. Despite what many here seem to believe, the FF is still a big, well known, well liked name and there are a lot of people who want to see a Fantastic Four film.
3. There's no such thing as bad publicity.

It doesn't matter if the film is good or bad. It doesn't matter if it features anything that really resembles the FF or not.

Enough people will show up on the first weekend of this film, almost guaranteed, to cover Fox's minimal investment in production and marketing (because of points 2 and 3, Fox won't need to spend as much on marketing as the do for most films).

I think people are going to have to accept that not only is this film happening but we will probably get a sequel.

You're probably right. FF benefits from having the slot that GOTG had. Audiences may go looking for another film like that during that time, and a superhero team orientated movie is that thing to fulfill that desire to see something like that again.

If the movie is good, which I think could very well be the case, then WOM will help it and the movie will already be a success.

 

[Zarex]

I don't feel like Galactus and Surfer are that valuable aside from appearing in Infinity War. Marvel would get far more mileage out of the Shi'ar.

I believe -and I think Feige and company feel the same way - that the Surfer is a star attraction. He is the best designed cosmic hero, could carry a solo feature and move a ton of merchandise. I don't put the Shi'ar in the same category.

And the merch rights aren't worthless. Marvel isn't creating any because they don't want to cannibalize their own profits by producing additional items where they have to share revenue. Marvel would be looking at a few hundred million for each of Fox's films.

A few hundred million seems extremely high. From articles released during the formation of Marvel Studios, tie in merchandise from FOX licensed films had very disappointing sales.

And is Marvel going to put both versions of Quicksilver on the shelf? Put both X-Men products and Inhumans products side-by-side? Merchandise rights may be included in any TV deal, but I doubt Marvel would give up anything of value to retain them.

 

[fantasticfan]

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/how-new-fantastic-four-trailer-767586?mobile_redirect=false

I thought this was interesting. Sorry if it was posted already. These threads are really difficult to keep up with these days.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

If this was Spider-Man, sure. But the X-Men merchandising rights are nowhere near as valuable.

 

[Zarex]

I do want Silver Surfer and Thanos back at Marvel but I firmly believe Disney shouldn't allow conceding anything. That's counterproductive to their overall goal.

Some MCU supporters were upset when Marvel gave up their interest in the Sony Spider-Man series in return for $275 million and Sony's 25% stake in the Spider-Man Joint Venture. The thought was that the transaction took Spidey farther away from the MCU. In reality, losing merchandising revenue put Sony's franchise in a much more perilous financial situation and raised the likelihood of a shared rights arrangement.

A similar play could be at work here. Selling off TV rights gives FOX stronger control over the X franchise. But Marvel isnt going to see those characters in the MCU anytime soon. Better to get characters that fit into the MCU franchise now than worry about a franchise that, while quite deep, has very few star attractions.

And if Marvel can get back the FF, Spidey and the Surfer over the next few years the X franchise will really be on an island. I don't think an already very mature franchise will survive given the strong competition with both Marvel and DC, and eventually a deal similar to the Spidey rights sharing agreement will be proposed.

 

[Evan Drew]

I guess there is nothing more positive to say about the movie either, eh, seeing as that thread was also closed?

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

I guess there is nothing more positive to say about the movie either, eh, seeing as that thread was also closed?

 

[Paradox1]

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/he...tic-four-trailer-767586?mobile_redirect=false

I thought this was interesting. Sorry if it was posted already. These threads are really difficult to keep up with these days.

I've heard other pundits with the same point. That this trailer is more faithful to Lee and Kirby's original conception than could of imagined.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

I've seen pundits claim lots of things, including 'everyone banned from facebook is a conservative because liberals figured out the algorithms', 'Colorado residents can use food stamps to buy weed' and 'space aliens were behind 9/11'.

 

[The Guard]

I really dislike this “Chris Nolan getting credit for trying to make superheroes more realistic” thing.

Yes, BATMAN BEGINS did take that approach. Before that, Bryan Singer was doing that with the X-MEN to a degree. And long before that, it was an industrywide approach in comics to a degree. It’s not a new idea in the least, nor did Chris Nolan come up with it, even as it relates to superhero projects and films.

Someone want to explain the importance of Ben being a linebacker to me? Why exactly is that an element that cannot be changed without losing something integral? There’s a lot of snark surrounding that element and the casting of Bell as Ben Grimm around here Is it just a visual/faithfulness thing?

Again, I think all these assumptions about what will or won’t be in this film are what are making people so negative.

You want to see Doom as a great villain, but because you heard from someone that part of what he does involves blogging, you ASSUME that there’s no chance this will happen, or that filmmakers don’t have intentions to develop Doom into the megalomaniac he is in the comics.

 

[The Guard]

This is stupid. Yeah maybe there's a cool idea in there for an original script for some other movie but it never was what the Fantastic Four was about. Basically they are saying: we are ignoring over 50 years of stories because who reads that crap? We'll just do our own thing because we can.

This is partially how the first Fantastic Four storyline handled their powers. The idea of something weird happening to them that they could not control, did not neccessarily like at first, and which frightened normal people. That was one of the things about the Four that set them apart from other heroes when they were created.

I mean, it’s a blockbuster movie, so of course they will end up learning to appreciate and embrace their powers. I mean, you don't honestly think they will just always hate their powers and see them as a disability or something bad, do you?

I don’t think a lot of fans understand that there’s a precedent for this "disability" and "trauma" thing in the creation and conceptualization of the Four.

 

[RAE072]

This quote, from the actor HIMSELF:

"I'm a programmer. Very anti-social programmer. And on blogging sites I'm 'Doom'."

Gets reduced to this:

but because you heard from someone that part of what he does involves blogging

to fit that argument.

Heard it "from someone." "Part of" what he does involves blogging.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

I really dislike this “Chris Nolan getting credit for trying to make superheroes more realistic” thing.

Yes, BATMAN BEGINS did take that approach. Before that, Bryan Singer was doing that with the X-MEN to a degree. And long before that, it was an industrywide approach in comics to a degree. It’s not a new idea in the least, nor did Chris Nolan come up with it, even as it relates to superhero projects and films.

*cough* http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0217869/?ref_=fn_al_tt_1