"Feel the Bern": The BERNIE SANDERS Thread - Part 1

[chaseter]

Safe to say Trump's methods have done a lot more harm to the country.

Hate is nothing new to this country. The only thing Trump is hurting is the GOP...which I'm fine with. It's needs to implode.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I do hope Trump is a wake up call to liberals. The progress made since the civil rights era and women's lib is reversible. The Roberts court gutted the voting rights act, and now the former Confederate states are trying to disenfranchise minorities again. Get Trump or Cruz in there, and God only knows.

 

[Marvolo]

Hate is nothing new to this country. The only thing Trump is hurting is the GOP...which I'm fine with. It's needs to implode.

Doesnt mean he or anyone else should be actively adding to it. Gun shootings are nothing new to this country too but Im sure you wouldnt want someone shooting up even more schools and public gatherings just to try to force lawmakers to enact stricter gun laws.

I want the GOP to go extinct too, but Id rather Trump not promote and support hate and run a platform on hate to accomplish it.

The end doesnt justify the means. Whether its getting rid of the current GOP or strengthening gun laws or accomplishing any of the other things this country desparately needs the means with which we accomplish those things need to be decent and humane. Not vile and repugnant.

 

[DJ_KiDDvIcIOUs]

Of course it can't be brushed aside since that was all what Jesus talked about, but those ideas don't exclusively belong to the left. He'll take a look at how Kasich is presenting his campaign in justifying his expansion of Medicaid and using Christian ideals to show compassion for others. Or Hillary trying to present herself as a progressive champion for the poor and minorities. Democratic socialists don't have a monopoly on caring for others.

I in no way said that they do HH, I understand that many Democratic presidents have talked this talk but did not walk that walk. But the majority of the folks in the GOP run on the promise of slashing everything in the government (and the services that help the less fortunate are always first to go) and the bolster the war machine. Yet they always run under the guise of being some kind of bastion for Christianity.

 

[hippie_hunter]

And we like to call those Republicans hypocrites.

 

[chaseter]

Doesnt mean he or anyone else should be actively adding to it. Gun shootings are nothing new to this country too but Im sure you wouldnt want someone shooting up even more schools and public gatherings just to try to force lawmakers to enact stricter gun laws.

I want the GOP to go extinct too, but Id rather Trump not promote and support hate and run a platform on hate to accomplish it.

The end doesnt justify the means. Whether its getting rid of the current GOP or strengthening gun laws or accomplishing any of the other things this country desparately needs the means with which we accomplish those things need to be decent and humane. Not vile and repugnant.

I'm not condoning it, just pointing out it's a tactic that's working for him. Trump is doing no harm to people so I wouldn't compare him to school shootings. That's a bit over the top.

 

[TheBat812]

I'm not condoning it, just pointing out it's a tactic that's working for him. Trump is doing no harm to people so I wouldn't compare him to school shootings. That's a bit over the top.

Neither did Charles Manson...


Perpetuating hate and xenophobia is a horrible thing especially as a presidential candidate.

 

[Marvolo]

I'm not condoning it, just pointing out it's a tactic that's working for him. Trump is doing no harm to people so I wouldn't compare him to school shootings. That's a bit over the top.

Actually he is doing harm. There is evidence that there has been an increase in racial bullying and fear in schools because of Trump. And he is telling racists, bigots, and xenophobes that their thoughts and behavior is ok. And I wasnt comparing Trump to school shootings. I was pointing out the flawed logic and danger of allowing a bad action to continue in the hopes that it will affect a desired positive outcome. People arent outright dying but he is doing real damage.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/trump-effect-southern-poverty-law-center_us_570e8619e4b03d8b7b9f2836

 

[Victarion]

Its happening abroad as well, in response to the Syrian refugee crisis. You can look at the slight shifts in political parties' powers, or find footage right on youtube of anti-refugee marches. Frightening on the on the one hand, but semi interesting if you look at it from the perspective of an aspiring SF writer (since these things are the bread and butter of much of the best SF).

 

[Slushy]

For someone who has a great resume as a capitalist and as an American, how the hell can you support a communist like Bernie Sanders? - Harley from new York

The idiot that sent this message should understand that Bernie Sanders is not communist. First thing you should do is go learn what a communist actually is before using the terminology.

A communist is not a socialist - those are two very different doctrines. A communist does not believe in any private ownership. Now does Bernie Sanders advocate against private ownership in America? No. Then, he’s not a communist. If you’re going to refer to Bernie as a communist, then you’ll need to refer to Franklin D. Roosevelt as one too. Sanders is no different than FDR. FDR got elected so many times, he’s obviously the most popular president in U.S. history, isn’t he? And it’s ironic that a “socialist” like FDR took us out of the Great Depression, isn’t it?

Now, I say this tongue in cheek, but, in many ways, it’s unfortunate that we don’t have an intelligence test to vote. Because you would obviously fail it. You shouldn’t throw around words like “communist” unless you know what they mean. And by the way, I don’t endorse Democrats or Republicans. And Bernie is a Democrat. I’ll end it with this: if we weren’t involved in these wars in the Middle East, we could pay for everything Bernie’s proposing on the domestic front.

 

[Marvolo]

^At gas stations in NC the gas stations have to tell you if ethanol is in the gasoline so there is usually a sticker on the pumps that says, "Gasoline may contain up to 10% ethanol." Well, at one of my local gas stations some moron wrote, "Communist BS!" on the sticker. Apparently ethanol and corn are communist.

I hear that rye is a dirty commie too.

 

[DDS]

Actually he is doing harm. There is evidence that there has been an increase in racial bullying and fear in schools because of Trump. And he is telling racists, bigots, and xenophobes that their thoughts and behavior is ok. And I wasnt comparing Trump to school shootings. I was pointing out the flawed logic and danger of allowing a bad action to continue in the hopes that it will affect a desired positive outcome. People arent outright dying but he is doing real damage.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/trump-effect-southern-poverty-law-center_us_570e8619e4b03d8b7b9f2836

The Overton Window is a very real thing, and Trump as well as Cruz have shifted it to unacceptable areas. We shouldn't be debating banning all Muslims (don't come at me with that "temporarily!" **** either like some Trumpkins do) or policing Muslim neighborhoods as serious campaign policies. But here we are. And it has had an adverse effect on our country, just as you say.

 

[chaseter]

Actually he is doing harm. There is evidence that there has been an increase in racial bullying and fear in schools because of Trump. And he is telling racists, bigots, and xenophobes that their thoughts and behavior is ok. And I wasnt comparing Trump to school shootings. I was pointing out the flawed logic and danger of allowing a bad action to continue in the hopes that it will affect a desired positive outcome. People arent outright dying but he is doing real damage.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/trump-effect-southern-poverty-law-center_us_570e8619e4b03d8b7b9f2836

You can't can't censor free speech. The issue isn't the speech, it's the ears that are listening. We can condemn it all we want but there's a reason why people are listening be it low IQ, Washington, masochism...who knows. It's the culture of politics that has gotten us here. As for an uptick in bullying, IMO it's the same as sports team fanatics. Sports fans riot and fight all the time. There's probably fan overlap. It will die down once the season is over. It's a certain subset of people that get defensive and turn violent. Fighting Trump won't win the fight sadly. It's the people that have to change and since we are a largely uneducated nation...I don't see that happening. Look at BLM protestors. They had riots and looters. Even some Bernie supporters have gotten disruptive. It's appealing to the lowest common denominators. Those are the ones that lash out.

 

[Marvolo]

You can't can't censor free speech. The issue isn't the speech, it's the ears that are listening. We can condemn it all we want but there's a reason why people are listening be it low IQ, Washington, masochism...who knows. It's the culture of politics that has gotten us here. As for an uptick in bullying, IMO it's the same as sports team fanatics. Sports fans riot and fight all the time. There's probably fan overlap. It will die down once the season is over. It's a certain subset of people that get defensive and turn violent. Fighting Trump won't win the fight sadly. It's the people that have to change and since we are a largely uneducated nation...I don't see that happening. Look at BLM protestors. They had riots and looters. Even some Bernie supporters have gotten disruptive. It's appealing to the lowest common denominators. Those are the ones that lash out.

We shouldn't censor him, but society shouldnt be standing by silently when he is saying this stuff. We dont need to duct tape his mouth or throw him in jail or forcefully stop him from speaking, but society should start shaming the sort of behavior that Trump exhibits. Public racism shouldnt be ignored or tolerated. Ever. If businesses stopped doing business with him and people started punishing him by not voting for him he'd probably change his tune pretty fast. Trump cares about two things. Money and his brand name. Hit him there and it will hurt him.

The first ammendment doesnt give anyone the right to say whatever without any recourse...

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

All it does is guarantee that congress cant pass laws to stop or hinder free speech. It doesnt stop the public from punishing or shaming people for hate speech. It doesnt stop states from shaming or punishing people for hate speech. Nor does it stop businesses from punishing people for hate speech. So we shouldnt censor him. We should just run his racist bigoted ass out of civilized society so to speak.

But I know it wont happen. Businesses are greedy and will keep doing business with Trump no matter what he says. And american society won't effectively shame or punish Trump.

 

[DDS]

Protesting Trump's racism at his rallies non-violently is as American as it gets. That's not taking away his free speech. It's the people exercising theirs to combat his ********.

 

[Victarion]

People outside with signs isn't censoring anything. Blocking others from going to their rallies, whichever candidate's they may be, would be encroaching on their right to free speech. If there were a censorship issue, we wouldn't have stuff like the "chalkening" that was trending on twitter, nor would we be able to make jokes about needing a permit to buy sidewalk chalk (or chalk control).

The only critique I've got for the Bern and the few of his supporters you see on the news (I've no doubt the anchors go for the most unhinged-looking ones in the crowd; its what I'd do if I wanted to score with the ratings) is their almost puritanical stance that you have to like everything about your candidate if you want to support them. Its on par with the worst you see from Alex Jones' info wars crowd and strikes me as infantile in the extreme. For me, it clashes with what Bernie stands for and probably does him more harm than good.

 

[chaseter]

Protesting Trump's racism at his rallies non-violently is as American as it gets. That's not taking away his free speech. It's the people exercising theirs to combat his ********.

Protesting peacefully is perfectly fine.

 

[chaseter]

Also, Bernie paid a lower tax rate in 2014 than the average American making 4x less. I paid a higher rate. This has always been the hypocrisy of the left. The rich should pay more the left spout but the rich left politicians take every deduction they can to pay as little taxes as they can.

 

[summerteeth]

Also, Bernie paid a lower tax rate in 2014 than the average American making 4x less. I paid a higher rate. This has always been the hypocrisy of the left. The rich should pay more the left spout but the rich left politicians take every deduction they can to pay as little taxes as they can.

I noticed that as well and nobody called him out on it. I was like dang I would have liked to pay that tax rate. Here he is talking about raising my taxes (I make around $60,000 as a single filer) and he's paying a less percentage than me while making over 200k? Sorry, that's a scumbag.

 

[chaseter]

It's taking money from the poor. They could use that money for social programs. For FREE COLLEGE!

 

[summerteeth]

It's taking money from the poor. They could use that money for social programs. For FREE COLLEGE!

It seriously makes me angry just thinking about it. Thinking about how hard I worked to pay for college without any student loans. Working 38 hrs a week going to community college and transferring to a four year university. Literally lived in a foreclosed house during this time mind you, while I knew plenty of kids who did nothing went lived in dorms and partied and now complain about student loan debt that they got themselves in. Plus don't people realize that there's Pell Grants for people who really need them? We already pay for tuition for the poor to attend college.

 

[Handsome Rob]

Also, Bernie paid a lower tax rate in 2014 than the average American making 4x less. I paid a higher rate. This has always been the hypocrisy of the left. The rich should pay more the left spout but the rich left politicians take every deduction they can to pay as little taxes as they can.

Agreed. It's hypocrisy, pure and simple. Just like these left wing idiot celebrities who rail about climate change, pollution, etc., and then own multiple houses, fly on private planes, own massive yachts, etc. Hypocrites.

But, really . . . they'll be happy to live under a higher tax rate, once the loopholes are also put in place that will make sure their effective tax rate is far lower.

 

[Taarna]

Hate is nothing new to this country. The only thing Trump is hurting is the GOP...which I'm fine with. It's needs to implode.

Sanders supporters new slogan is " Bern the witch "

There's some hate for you

In addition 1 of 4 Sanders supporters say they will never vote for Hillary. If this is accurate, Clinton lost 20-25% of her voting base for the general election.

 

[DDS]

Repost from the primaries thread:

http://fivethirtyeight.com/live-blo...ial-election-2016/?#livepress-update-25102568

Sanders would now have to win by 20 points in California and 10 points in Pennsylvania and New Jersey to get a majority of pleged delegates.

Sanders supporters new slogan is " Bern the witch "

There's some hate for you

It is definitely unfortunate that Sanders' supporters haven't been classy during this primary

 

[souvlaki]

Just saw Sanders' campaign manager on MSNBC a second ago and he basically had the most embarrassing argument for the delegate math I have ever seen. Rachel Maddow had the most horrified look on his face afterward and they basically ripped on him when they came back from the commercial break. Absolutely bizarre moment tonight. I can't imagine who on the Sanders campaign thought it would be a good idea to have him on national tv tonight to talk about delegate math.

Maddow even went far enough as to say the news tomorrow would probably about that segment as much as Hillary's win.