I think there's a chance that GRRM will find a bit of motivation again once the series is over and realises he very much still has his own story to tell and finish.
Even if he does, the odds of him completing the entire series still seems drastically low. Let’s optimistically say be releases the book 2020. If he has a similar gap between books, he’ll be 80 by the time he finishes.
Theres also speculation that he finished Winds of Winter 2 or 3 years ago and has been working on A Dream of Spring since then so that he can release them with less time between.
I hope so. I think finishing them both before publishing WOW would be the best course to take. That way if he runs into any problems in ADOS that is caused by something in WOW he can change it. Cause let's be real, he will put himself in a corner. Just like he did with ADWD. He'll get to some point in ADOS and will realize he backed himself into a corner because of something in WOW. And he wont be able to alter WOW so he'll spend a decade trying to figure out how to fix the problem in ADOS.
I've been watching the show again and nearly done with season 2....The Mountain casting was bloody bizarre and if it wasn't for characters referring to him as The Mountain I wouldn't have noticed him.
At least with Hafbor there's no mistaking him and he has this impossible size. There's just something awfully generic about the second actor that I wonder if it was intentional and that they were always planning on either getting the first guy back or recasting again for season 4.
Finished season 2 on my rewatch. So sad to see Osha go out the way she did given Luwin's encouraging words to her. Any other show and Osha would be making good on her promise instead of being dumbed down and pimped out in season 6.
I will never ever purchase a book written by George R R Martin again. For him to leave the readers who followed and purchased his first 5 books hanging in the wind so he could put on his greedy hat and bugger of to Hollywood or Northern Ireland shows a lack of respect for his readers. GOT was first and formost a series of books, I do not begrudge that he developed the books into a mega TV hit but finish the books first. The TV series is not even true to the books, not that odd in itself it happens all the time but to leave the book fans hanging on while the TV series overtakes the books is not on. It is one thing reading a book and then watching the movie, it is totally different to watch a movie and then read the book especially when most of the books in the series were published before the movie or TV series.
I will never ever purchase a book written by George R R Martin again. For him to leave the readers who followed and purchased his first 5 books hanging in the wind so he could put on his greedy hat and bugger of to Hollywood or Northern Ireland shows a lack of respect for his readers. GOT was first and formost a series of books, I do not begrudge that he developed the books into a mega TV hit but finish the books first. The TV series is not even true to the books, not that odd in itself it happens all the time but to leave the book fans hanging on while the TV series overtakes the books is not on. It is one thing reading a book and then watching the movie, it is totally different to watch a movie and then read the book especially when most of the books in the series were published before the movie or TV series.
However, GRRM has no responsibility to us. Any of the stories we've received from him are gifts, and I'm grateful for the amazing stories he's told so far. Do I wish he had gotten the other books out? Sure. However, I think it's pretty clear that he wishes he could have gotten the books done. Anyone who watches his recent interviews over the past few years can tell that. GRRM bit off a bit more than he could chew with this story, and it's sprawled a bit beyond his control, which is why it's taking him forever. And that's really it, not because he's been ignoring them.
This stuff happens quite often. Take a look at Wheel of Time, or The King Killer Chronicles. Sometimes Author's build worlds that get too big, and it takes them a long time. In the case of WOT, the author didn't live to finish it.
However, GRRM has no responsibility to us. Any of the stories we've received from him are gifts, and I'm grateful for the amazing stories he's told so far. Do I wish he had gotten the other books out? Sure. However, I think it's pretty clear that he wishes he could have gotten the books done. Anyone who watches his recent interviews over the past few years can tell that. GRRM bit off a bit more than he could chew with this story, and it's sprawled a bit beyond his control, which is why it's taking him forever. And that's really it, not because he's been ignoring them.
This stuff happens quite often. Take a look at Wheel of Time, or The King Killer Chronicles. Sometimes Author's build worlds that get too big, and it takes them a long time. In the case of WOT, the author didn't live to finish it.
I'm hopeful that Winds will be out by the end of the year. Martin has a convention appearance at the end of August, something that he's cut back on in recent years. It takes 3-4 months to print and release a novel from the time the manuscript is handed in, so if it's finished before the con a 2019 release is doable.
Spring is a different story. It'd be a shame not to have a proper end to the series, but unless he already has material written for it or is certain it won't wind up with another Meereenese knot, I doubt he'll have the time or desire to finish it.
I'm hopeful that Winds will be out by the end of the year. Martin has a convention appearance at the end of August, something that he's cut back on in recent years. It takes 3-4 months to print and release a novel from the time the manuscript is handed in, so if it's finished before the con a 2019 release is doable.
Spring is a different story. It'd be a shame not to have a proper end to the series, but unless he already has material written for it or is certain it won't wind up with another Meereenese knot, I doubt he'll have the time or desire to finish it.
It refers to how Martin got himself stuck with the plot in Meereen without an easy way out. Originally the books were to have a 5 year gap after A Storm of Swords to age up the characters, but this was abandoned due to how many flashbacks/recaps would've been required. The term also speaks to the cast of the books in general, and how difficult it became to reunite the main characters and wrap up their separate arcs.
The books won't give Dany as easy an out as the show did, simply killing the remaining Masters and forcing democracy on the people won't be enough. It took Martin years to come up with a proper way to finish Dany's story there, and I hope those kinds of narrative problems are at an end. If not, it could very well take 10 years to finish Spring.
She is done in Meereen though right? Sort of I guess. I mean she flew away on Drogon and her other dragons are destroying the city because they were locked up. Was that the out? Or it's supposed to be in the next book how she leaves?
Winds of Winter opens with the Battle of Meereen, and I assume after handling the Dothraki Dany will still need to collect her other dragons and deal with the aftermath of the battle. Being conservative, I'd assume that'd take up at least half of her chapters. She may not even depart for Westeros until the end of the book, it all depends on how much detail Martin goes into. Unlike the show, I doubt she'll be able to consider her reign there a win, and the fallout of her actions will haunt her going forward.
My larger point was that all of the POV characters are scattered about the map, with their separate narratives at different points of progression. Even if the bulk of them are reunited by the end of Winds, that still leaves whatever complications are left for the final novel. Martin may have the broadest of ideas mapped out, but the actual day to day work of writing is still to be done.
For example,
even though he knew how Shireen died, her death on the show happened before the corresponding scene in the books had even been written.
He still makes things up as he goes along, and changes his mind if things don't work the way he wants them to. Martin had to write three different versions Quentyn's arrive in Meereen so he could compare them and decide which one he preferred. It's clear something similar happened with Winds as it never should've taken this long if everything was smooth sailing, and it's entirely possible the same thing could happen again with Spring.
Winds of Winter opens with the Battle of Meereen, and I assume after handling the Dothraki Dany will still need to collect her other dragons and deal with the aftermath of the battle. Being conservative, I'd assume that'd take up at least half of her chapters. She may not even depart for Westeros until the end of the book, it all depends on how much detail Martin goes into. Unlike the show, I doubt she'll be able to consider her reign there a win, and the fallout of her actions will haunt her going forward.
My larger point was that all of the POV characters are scattered about the map, with their separate narratives at different points of progression. Even if the bulk of them are reunited by the end of Winds, that still leaves whatever complications are left for the final novel. Martin may have the broadest of ideas mapped out, but the actual day to day work of writing is still to be done.
For example,
even though he knew how Shireen died, her death on the show happened before the corresponding scene in the books had even been written.
He still makes things up as he goes along, and changes his mind if things don't work the way he wants them to. Martin had to write three different versions Quentyn's arrive in Meereen so he could compare them and decide which one he preferred. It's clear something similar happened with Winds as it never should've taken this long if everything was smooth sailing, and it's entirely possible the same thing could happen again with Spring.
I didn’t know that about Quentyn. And I absolutely hated his chapters because it all seemed so incredibly pointless. He added basically nothing to the main plot, and didn’t explore any themes we hadn’t already covered.
I didn’t know that about Quentyn. And I absolutely hated his chapters because it all seemed so incredibly pointless. He added basically nothing to the main plot, and didn’t explore any themes we hadn’t already covered.
This. I hated the whole secret plot for him to marry Daenerys. He was one of many arrogant men that assumed they could marry her and take control of the dragons.
This. I hated the whole secret plot for him to marry Daenerys. He was one of many arrogant men that assumed they could marry her and take control of the dragons.
And the entire time, I just kept wondering "what is the freaking point of this guy?" Ultimately, he leads to the dragons escaping...cool. But that could have happened in a myriad of other ways, you didn't need to introduce a new POV character to do it. He reveals that Dorne had plans with the Targs...again, cool, but not info we needed a new POV character to provide. Thematically, he explores that character that's too caught up in fairy tales and this ultimately leads to a bad result....but this is something GRRM already EXTENSIVELY covered with Sansa's character.
It was incredibly annoying. I'm sure his death will at some point have some kind of ramifications with Dorne, but it's all so meandering. I really hope he does try to condense things in the next novel, because I was getting hard Robert Jordan vibes from books 4 and 5. Wheel of Time had a stretch of about four of five books where the main plot line barely advances, and George was moving in that direction with books 4 and 5.
Everyone seems to have some sort of backdoor deal that leads with someone getting married to Daenerys and taking control of Westeros. It's like the only reason the Iron Born were even introduced.
The real Pate is just some dude who let his little head lead him to a death in a back alley. But the "Pate" that meets Sam at the Citadel is Jaqen H'ghar. Or, at least, a Faceless Man who wore the same face that Jaqen wore when he left Arya. The description of the alchemist who poisons Pate for the key matches the description of Jaqen from when we last saw him.
The real Pate is just some dude who let his little head lead him to a death in a back alley. But the "Pate" that meets Sam at the Citadel is Jaqen H'ghar. Or, at least, a Faceless Man who wore the same face that Jaqen wore when he left Arya. The description of the alchemist who poisons Pate for the key matches the description of Jaqen from when we last saw him.
I completely forgot about this plot line. I need to re-read the books. Though the next time I go through them, I'm looking up the order to read chapters from book 4 and 5 together. Book 4 was one of the most frustrating reading experiences I've ever had. Having to go that long to find out what the hell happened to Tyrion after the explosive end to book 3...it was torture.
Quentyn’s entire purpose is to have Dorne vs Dany when she returns to Westeros. It’ll be the inciting incident that makes Doran throw caution to the Wind and go all in with FAegon even though they’re all probably aware he’s not Elia’s son.
This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
