"Intervention" Episode 12 Discussion Thread

[CaptainCanada]

You're not negating anything; your basically retconning in an explaination for the buildup that seemed to be unrelated and unjustified. The only difference, is that it was planned from the beginning.

Yes, it does negate it, because it doesn't jibe remotely with those episodes as we watched them. The first ten episodes (well, the parts Brock appeared in) show him as a likeable, reasonable person who gets angry at Peter because Peter's actions appear to him to be selfish; his actions are all those of a normal person. The next two episodes throw all this out, pivot the character's entire motivation for being a villain on mental instability that has never been alluded to; thus, all the episodes previous making his anger believable and rational are thrown out.

On top of all this, Eddie 2.0 is simply not a very interesting take on the character now, in my opinion. I was interested to see how they were going to wrangle someone with entirely rational (if misconstrued) anger into hating Peter so deeply that he'd attract Venom; the answer, apparently, is that they're going to snap their fingers and say he's crazy, and always has been.

And, wow, do I sound down on the show; apart from Eddie, everything is pretty much perfect, but they really fell on their faces with Eddie.

 

[TheAQU4M4N]

nope sorry, i just know there is a link out there for youtube. I dont need the episodes for my self since i watch them live and dvr them and put them to a tape so i can watch when i can. The last few episodes i been looking for dl links for a buddy of mine who didnt see the episodes because he was busy with other things and just was able to catch up and watch all the episodes and he loves the show now.

its ok i just want to see it again, that episode owned..

 

[Silver Spider]

The flashabcks really touched my heart alot for quite a few reasons. It really showed how his gift and cursed started. Then, we get to see his heroic actions in defeating all the Villians with that great music on, and same for seeing all of his friends and the people who care about him and basically having Uncle Ben tell Peter about the great things he has done in his life since that spider bit him. As I have said, I just thought the flashback scene was really a fantastic thing to have.

I loved that part. I liked how you saw all the heroic deeds he's done, and then the symbiote basically tells him, that despite all that, he has nothing and no one except it; and Uncle Ben says, "I beg to differ," and then you see all the times his friends and family, have been there for him.

 

[Silver Spider]

Yes, it does negate it, because it doesn't jibe remotely with those episodes as we watched them. The first ten episodes (well, the parts Brock appeared in) show him as a likeable, reasonable person who gets angry at Peter because Peter's actions appear to him to be selfish; his actions are all those of a normal person. The next two episodes throw all this out, pivot the character's entire motivation for being a villain on mental instability that has never been alluded to; thus, all the episodes previous making his anger believable and rational are thrown out.

On top of all this, Eddie 2.0 is simply not a very interesting take on the character now, in my opinion. I was interested to see how they were going to wrangle someone with entirely rational (if misconstrued) anger into hating Peter so deeply that he'd attract Venom; the answer, apparently, is that they're going to snap their fingers and say he's crazy, and always has been.

And, wow, do I sound down on the show; apart from Eddie, everything is pretty much perfect, but they really fell on their faces with Eddie.

All of Eddie's rational feelings are sandwiched between his passionate side shown in "Interactions," and "Natural Selection;" and his unstable side shown in "Group Therapy," and "Intervention." His anger is probably his biggest issue, moreso than the instability, and it was shown nearly from the get-go. His unstable nature isn't the soul purpose for his dark intentions, it's his emotions. The instability is just another factor.

 

[CaptainCanada]

His anger was shown to be reasonable; it's the amplification in the last two episodes completely out of nowhere that makes no sense. It'd be like if an X-Men prequel spent episodes building up Claremont Magneto and then switched to Morrison Magneto with no explanation.

 

[TheAQU4M4N]

His anger was shown to be reasonable; it's the amplification in the last two episodes completely out of nowhere that makes no sense. It'd be like if an X-Men prequel spent episodes building up Claremont Magneto and then switched to Morrison Magneto with no explanation.

yeah i didn't like the build up, they should have fleshed it out a lot more..

 

[SLYspyder]

The episode started out great, I was absolutely loving it. Peter's new look and attitude. I was a bit surprised Peter didn't go off on Eddie the first time they met in the episode though, I would've really liked that. I also liked him going of at school and the scene in Tombstone's office.


Then it took a down turn. Too much of a coincidence Peter ends up at the church. I mean, all of a sudden, he wants to get rid of the costume. He didn't really do anything THAT bad. He should've almost killed someone and then realized it was the suit and not just him telling off a couple of people. The flashback/inner struggle went on for too long and the symbiote shouldn't have called itself "we" when it was separated from Peter. Eddie shouldn't have "sensed" the symbiote calling to him either and therefore releasing it.

A swing at Spider-Man with a chair or something when he was trying to kill the symbiote and misses and breaks the glass would've been much better. Or him trying to revive the symbiote after Spider-Man left and then getting attached would've also been better. But the whole it's calling me and I'm going to free it and touch it even though it would jeopardize my job didn't make sense.


I still feel TAS had the best Eddie character. I much prefer him hating Spider-Man first before realizing he's Peter Parker when he gets the symbiote. Spider-Man should've done more to Eddie, and again, the reason he didn't stems from the fact that they made Eddie a stand-up citizen from the start, which they shouldn't have.

 

[Silver Spider]

His amplification of anger, these last few episodes are him snapping. He's had enough of Peter's selfish acts, and he can't hold his feelings back anymore. You could tell in "Persona" that Eddie was royally pissed at Peter for betraying his trust again. He was getting over the Lizard thing, and then Peter just slaps him again with another self-centered deed. Not to mention how he seemed to lie to Gwen. After everything Peter does, he's completely oblivious to it, when he talks to Eddie again. Eddie interprets this as a sign that Peter is only out for himself now, and he doesn't care about his friends. As I've said, it's clear that Eddie is very passionate, which with a touch of instability, can justify his actions, within the show.

I'm going to stop debating now bacause for one, It's late and I'm too tired to continue thinking this in depth, and two, it's obvious you're not going to change your mind about Eddie so it's pointless to persuade you otherwise.

 

[Toxin]

Just watch the memories the symbiote plays to Eddie. It obviously is twisting Eddie's mind. Eddie was already angry, and that let the symbiote lead him in its direction.

 

[TheAQU4M4N]

yeah defintely, its warping his mind

and i got my 300th post YAY
one word: AVATAR

 

[Webhead2006]

Yea i mentioned that too in earlier posts and a few others, it was only showing bad/wrong moments of peter's memories to twist and manipulat brocks hatred more.

 

[b. goose]

is it sad for me to enjoy this episode a lot more than spider-man 3? haha....

what a great episode. it really took a dramatic turn and explored the mind of peter parker in a deeper level. cant believe this is a saturday morning cartoon. i think he even hit a woman at tomb's office hah

 

[Webhead2006]

Yea one of tombstone's body guard people is a musclar woman you can tell by her painted finger nails and her female sounding voiced from the grunts/ow's she said.

 

[TheAQU4M4N]

lol yeah when i first saw it, i thought it was messed up..im still waiting for a direct link.

 

[UltimateJustin]

If this was the R rated Spiderman most fans want, Pete would have forced himself on that muscular bodygaurd instead of just hit her. I like how he offered his services to tombstone but then just used that as one of the many reasons he needed to get rid of the black suit. The final straw for him to get rid of it was cause Flash had a good point. It should have been because he really crossed the line and like ate somebodys face or something.

 

[November Rain]

meh, i think a normal spidey would have proposed leaving crime alone to get money from tombstone...

a normal spidey did less in spidey 2, a large majority of people's favourite superhero flick and he did that for pure selfish love. Leaving crime for a weak to save aunt may is not necessarily a particularly 'evil' comic thing to do considering what spidey's done.

 

[varsas]

meh, i think a normal spidey would have proposed leaving crime alone to get money from tombstone...

a normal spidey did less in spidey 2, a large majority of people's favourite superhero flick and he did that for pure selfish love. Leaving crime for a weak to save aunt may is not necessarily a particularly 'evil' comic thing to do considering what spidey's done.

No I don't think normal Spidey would ever do this because it goes completely against his character especially in this incarnation when he's only recently become a hero; the difference in personality is quite clear due to his conscious decision not to take up the offer from Tombstone when it was made originally without the influence of the symbiote.

 

[November Rain]

Heh, spidey consorts directly to do deals with the devil for his aunt but he's above taking cash to save her life.

spidey would pretty much do anything and forsake his moral fibre for the ones he loves. That's his major weakness.

Personally, I don't think this is completely out of the ordinary for a spiderman character. I mean he did take advantage of the early symbiote incident when told not to and went on to make a profit on the cash. He's not exactly a saint.

 

[Ratcrawler]

I like how Tomby sPecified that it was ok for him to fight a supervillain if one were to endanger public safety. That normally feels like something a typical villain would leave out and use against him. Guess he's not a total reprobate.

 

[November Rain]

tombstone has always been happy to spidey to deal with that, he just wants the petty thugs to get along with their daily basis.

 

[FNSpidey]

I have to agree, leaving crime alone for a week is not really evil. Maybe just slightly irresponsible, but even then, it's not like the guy can be there for every crime in NY or even most of them. Seeing him actually working for Tombstone would have been interesting, but what we saw was just slightly exaggerated reactions of a troubled person, nothing drastically immoral or bad.

And I think people are missing the point when defending Eddie's characterization. Even if we forget all this out-of-nowhere talk about mental instability, his anger could never lead him to becoming Venom because in the end, there's nothing for him to be angry over. The symbiote's back, he gets his job back and great future credentials for studying it. What is he mad about? Why in the world would he take it out (losing his job and a great future) and go after Peter? That's the worst case of Eddie characterization ever. It all boils down to "the symbiote made him do it".

Also, did anyone else find the writing VERY convenient when Spidey tries to destroy the symbiote and doesn't even wait to see if it worked? Even knowing there's a person there who wouldn't want it destroyed?

 

[varsas]

Heh, spidey consorts directly to do deals with the devil for his aunt but he's above taking cash to save her life.

spidey would pretty much do anything and forsake his moral fibre for the ones he loves. That's his major weakness.

Personally, I don't think this is completely out of the ordinary for a spiderman character. I mean he did take advantage of the early symbiote incident when told not to and went on to make a profit on the cash. He's not exactly a saint.

When did he consort "directly to do deals with the devil for his aunt"? I don't remember this happening in the series.

In the future I would agree that that it is not completely out of character to act this way when he's older and more cynical but right now I don't think it is in character at all.

He isn't a saint but originally iirc all he was going to do was take pictures from the skylight; I'm not sure if he was going to break into the lab. However that sort of stubbornness can be put down to being a teenager.

 

[November Rain]

i get the impression venom wasn't originally meant to be in this series but they tried their hardest and forsake some of the real characterisation to squeeze him in, kinda like they did in spidey 3 but I think they squeezed him in better then.

 

[varsas]

I have to agree, leaving crime alone for a week is not really evil. Maybe just slightly irresponsible, but even then, it's not like the guy can be there for every crime in NY or even most of them. Seeing him actually working for Tombstone would have been interesting, but what we saw was just slightly exaggerated reactions of a troubled person, nothing drastically immoral or bad.

And I think people are missing the point when defending Eddie's characterization. Even if we forget all this out-of-nowhere talk about mental instability, his anger could never lead him to becoming Venom because in the end, there's nothing for him to be angry over. The symbiote's back, he gets his job back and great future credentials for studying it. What is he mad about? Why in the world would he take it out (losing his job and a great future) and go after Peter? That's the worst case of Eddie characterization ever. It all boils down to "the symbiote made him do it".

Also, did anyone else find the writing VERY convenient when Spidey tries to destroy the symbiote and doesn't even wait to see if it worked? Even knowing there's a person there who wouldn't want it destroyed?

It is immoral and bad especially if you're meant to be a hero; if you're a cop and you're on the take it's not immoral or bad???

Imho Eddie never has a good reason to be Venom even in previous incarnations either since losing his job and his reputation is something he can get over. In this case, the symbiote survives but clearly Eddie is unstable and that is the reason the rage does not subside as it would in most people i.e. he does not think clearly especially when the symbiote is released and show Eddie all the bad aspects of Peter as Spider-Man.

Yes a convenient device at the end; he should have checked that the symbiote was really dead after being frozen solid.

 

[Anwar]

All he wanted was to see the symbiote with his own eyes, nothing more. That there was a theft happening JUST as he got there was amazing coincidence.