Lord of the Advice: Return of the King of Relationships

[Erzengel]

Being you age? What's been your longest relationship?

 

[Dreadstar]

Being you age? What's been your longest relationship?

Who me? Whats that got to do with anything?

 

[Erzengel]

Curiosity.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

Who me? Whats that got to do with anything?

Do you not think the length of your past relationships has any relevance?

I mean, if you were married for 20 years or something, you're eagerness to have fun flings now would make a lot of sense.

Or if you've never had a relationship last long at all, we'd probably start considering you might have committment issues.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

I'd have to suggest that either you're not particularly good at reading situations, or both of these girls were incredibly good at pretending so they didn't hurt you

Either way, while those dates may not have been unpleasant, they were not successful. They did not lead to the girl being interested in you.

So no, they didn't go well. Whether you thought so at the time or not.

But did you ever think maybe if you'd gone for the kiss at the end of the date, and that had been great... maybe then you'd have won enough interest for a second date?

As for Courtney... Well she's just a girl I don't understand. Like I said before, I think you did all the right things there, and she simply makes no sense to me

Courtney was just... Something else lol.

As far as your other suggestion - no, I've never really thought one way or another that trying to kiss them or not was the determining factor of the date. With Lauren, im not exactly sure what happened, I kinda just chalked it up to the "spark" being one sided, and while we had a good conversation, she was just never as into it as I was. Holland, well she's a bit of a weird girl and while it was a nice date, the truth of the matter is I was never particularly that interested in her, and I don't know if she was all that interested in me. The date just kinda... Happened. Really, when I called for a 2nd date, I was doing so more out of courtesy than some full fledged hope that there was something there. I was a little caught off guard by how she handled it - messaging me on Facebook when I tried to call her - but that one didn't really tear me up too much.

For whatever its worth, I felt pretty much the same at the end of my first date as I did with the date with Lauren - a very pleasant conversation where I felt there was some chemistry and enough mutual connection to build off of. Neither time did I go for a kiss afterwards. One date did produce a mutual interest, while the other didn't.

I suppose that I had an opportunity to kiss either one of these girls that I missed, but like I said, no, I've never really considered one way or another that kissing or not was the determining factor. I just chalk it up to the dates didn't go as well on the other end as they did on mine.

With Lauren, im also not against the possibility that I ruined a shot at a second date by becoming unintentionally "clingy".

 

[Erzengel]

When I asked if there was any flirtation, I kinda meant, excuses to touch you, sexual innuendo discussion, or any overly intimate body behavior going on?

 

[hopefuldreamer]

It's not the determining factor, that's not what I meant.

But put it this way. IMO it is impossible for an attempted kiss to be the CAUSE of no second date unless you're incredibly bad at kissing.

Because if she turns away from the kiss, there is like a 99% certainty she never would have gone on another one anyway (the 1% I leave for girls like Courtney )

But it IS possible for a succesful kiss to turn a date that wasn't that great and didn't leave her all that keen... Into something she's keen to do again if it ends like THAT every time

At the end of a date, 'Is he going to kiss me' is pretty much all the girl is thinking about, whether that be hope or dread

What did you do at the end of these dates? Shake their hand? Hug? Awkwardly wave?

Try and picture how she'll tell it to her girlfriends.

Option 1: 'So how was you're date last night'

'It was nice, yeah, we got on pretty well, had a good time'.

'Oh yeah, so did you kiss?'

'No, he just hugged me and said goodnight'

'Oh... Oh well, plenty more fish in the sea'

Option 2: 'So how did you're date go last night?'

'Well it went okay, got on pretty well, had a good time'

'And... Did you kiss?'

'Yeah It was nice, I think I'll see him again friday'



That's as simple as it is in my head anyway.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

Also, really, I find most girls expect me to be the one who initiates things like kissing, making out, etc.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

Definitely agreed.

I think girls are afraid of being too pushy. It either makes it seem like you 'wear the trousers' and makes the guy feel emasculated; or it makes you seem like a ****.

Girl might be the one to invite you in for coffee, but you are usually the one who's gotta turn coffee into a euphamism

Edit: That said, if I really liked the guy and he was giving me signals like he wanted to but was unsure... I'd most probably just go for it

 

[The Guard]

I tend to have the opposite happen. Women usually kiss me.

I don't mind initiating it from there on out, but I do like a good bit of sexual tension the first time. Probably some kind of unhealthy power thing.

From his descriptions, it kind of sounds like Nell dates women who might have some intimacy/trust issues (don't we all). I don't really think he's that bad at reading people. It sounds like he dates a lot of wishy washy girls who maybe have some issues with getting close to people.

Nell, care to weigh in on that? What kind of women do you date? Do you have any certain "type", or do you like a variety of women?

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

I would probably say a like a variety.

I seem to be unintentionally attracted to girls with loads of baggage. My first ex had the whole other boyfriend she was cheating on me with going on, plus a history of family issues and suicide attempts...

Courtney had her baby's father that abandoned her and always toyed with her, coming in and out of her life but never commiting to her and their son, as well as other stories she's told me of abuse, and my ex now has weird intimacy issues so bad that when we broke up she said she thinks she needs professional help.

I don't intend to go for the crazies, it just happens that way. Maybe I am sub conciously attracted to crazy girls with emotional problems.

Erz - I can't recall how much physical flirting was going on in these dates, these dates im mentioning were years ago, like my first year in college. Maybe there wasn't enough.

Hopeful - I'd probably hug them at the end of the date. Idk, I still don't see not kissing on the first date as being a deal breaker. I still see a first date as a "I want to get to know you" date to determine if I want to continue dating further.

 

[amazingfantasy15]

Here it is. What do you make of this?

Who are you today? I understand that you are disappointed so WAS I * You went from one angry conversation to complaining about some girl. It is obvious to me that you don't listen or *it is irrelevant to you when I *tell you that I have a stressful job. 90 pecent of my calls and emails at work are from angry *people. This week has been worse than most. Most of the people I work with think I am a controlling ***** as they are not privileged to the companies financial situation * I don't want to have someone in my life that is angry, negative and describes his anger with profanity. Swearing all the time is not attractive. Of course I want you to share but I have had my limit of negativeness for the remainder of the week.*

Care to let us know what you said that led to this?

I'm not sure how much of a difference it'll actually make, you are determined to not make this relationship work. You seem to want her to dump you. I had a friend to this one time, he stopped answering the girls calls convinced she was going to dump him. She was actually calling because she wanted to see him, keep going out, however, his actions caused her to just end it.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

Hopeful - I'd probably hug them at the end of the date. Idk, I still don't see not kissing on the first date as being a deal breaker. I still see a first date as a "I want to get to know you" date to determine if I want to continue dating further.

Hugs are things I give my grandma before I leave her house. Just sounds kind of awkward to me. Like "wait, what? we're hugging? Oooo-tay".

 

[hopefuldreamer]

Hopeful - I'd probably hug them at the end of the date. Idk, I still don't see not kissing on the first date as being a deal breaker. I still see a first date as a "I want to get to know you" date to determine if I want to continue dating further.

Hugs are things I give my grandma before I leave her house. Just sounds kind of awkward to me. Like "wait, what? we're hugging? Oooo-tay".

Yup.

A hug at the end of the date is you're ticket to the friend zone.

Even if I agree to see you again, it'll be because I now believe what we went on wasn't a date but just two friends hanging out, and I assume that's what you wanna do again.

I mean, even a kiss on the cheek would do. Just something that makes it clear you have romantic interest in me.

 

[Erzengel]

I give out hugs like they're candy.

 

[RetrogradeOrbit]

God, I'm glad my dating days are behind me. It's all far too stressful trying to interpret all the signals and make the "correct" move etc.

 

[Anita18]

SO thats it? I vented, then she vented. I think I will wait for her to text me and see what happens. I though this was her break up message. Pretty pathetic to do it over a text.

She sounds pretty righteous in that text (what I was able to make of it - you both seems unable to get to the point, from what I've seen), but it didn't seem to me like a breakup text specifically.

Although yeah, the "I don't want to have someone in my life..." part does point to breaking up. But it could be just her throwing her (or you - it's unclear who's talking there) righteous self around and feeling self-important. A lot of people who like drama and have a complete lack of self-awareness will do that.

Actually it sounds like you two deserve each other, if you're both really as old as you say and still pull those kinds of games.

I don't intend to go for the crazies, it just happens that way. Maybe I am sub conciously attracted to crazy girls with emotional problems.

Erz - I can't recall how much physical flirting was going on in these dates, these dates im mentioning were years ago, like my first year in college. Maybe there wasn't enough.

Hopeful - I'd probably hug them at the end of the date. Idk, I still don't see not kissing on the first date as being a deal breaker. I still see a first date as a "I want to get to know you" date to determine if I want to continue dating further.

Everyone has their baggage, but the stuff you've described is pretty heavy. Maybe you are subconsciously attracted to the women with emotional problems.

I don't think not kissing on the first date as a deal breaker either. Frankly, if I've just met you a few hours ago, I don't want to get THAT close to you.

But maybe I'm just weird.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

I don't think not kissing on the first date as a deal breaker either. Frankly, if I've just met you a few hours ago, I don't want to get THAT close to you.

But maybe I'm just weird.

Well it may be a little different if you're internet dating, but a lot of dates aren't people you only met a few hours ago

 

[Nave 'Torment']

lame as i am the best i did on a first date was kiss her hand goodnight. still, better than a hug right? RIGHT?

edit: actually, i don't get the hugs being a deal-breaker. it was a first date after all. people aren't sexual animals all the time.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

Yup.

A hug at the end of the date is you're ticket to the friend zone.

Even if I agree to see you again, it'll be because I now believe what we went on wasn't a date but just two friends hanging out, and I assume that's what you wanna do again.

I mean, even a kiss on the cheek would do. Just something that makes it clear you have romantic interest in me.

I give out hugs like they're candy.

If hugs are special, then in the last 24 hours I've been with five women and had at least one affair.

Well it may be a little different if you're internet dating, but a lot of dates aren't people you only met a few hours ago

Yeah, most IRL dating there's some pre-dating friendliness. In fact a lot of times it's increased touching/intimacy/hugging that clues me into the fact that I might want to ask them out.

So a lot of times I'm past the hugging stage while we're on the first date.

 

[Erzengel]

I don't think not kissing on the first date as a deal breaker either. Frankly, if I've just met you a few hours ago, I don't want to get THAT close to you.

But maybe I'm just weird.

You're weird.

I've done it within hours of meeting.

There's instant chemistry, plus a few drinks shared.

Also I'm funny, charismatic and witty.

I really can't blame myself.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Well maybe most first dates didn't occur within hours of meeting someone, but I do know that a lot of my first dates have come from, say, talking to a girl in class a few times, and then saying "can I take you to dinner this weekend". So there hasn't been a lot of time to really get to know each other yet - that's what the date is for.

Like I said, I see a first date as a "getting to know each other, see if there's a mutual interest / connection" more than a time to seal the deal.

I feel a girl should understand that if im taking her out, and buying her dinner, that my intent is romantic, and not to just be her "friend".

I can't think of any situation where a guy asks to buy someone dinner because he wants to be their friend.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

You're weird.

I've done it within hours of meeting.

There's instant chemistry, plus a few drinks shared.

Also I'm funny, charismatic and witty.

I really can't blame myself.

My quickest were two instances where we were full on making out in 30 seconds to a minute of meeting each other. I hadn't even gotten a name yet. One was a college girl, and I'm pretty sure the other probably was as well.

Then I guess the next would be ten minutes.

Just like you say, there's this feeling and then here we go.

 

[Erzengel]

lame as i am the best i did on a first date was kiss her hand goodnight. still, better than a hug right? RIGHT?

edit: actually, i don't get the hugs being a deal-breaker. it was a first date after all. people aren't sexual animals all the time.

You also are from a more conservative area?

I mean I usually make some sort of innuendo or risque comment/joke, and usually see how that's perceived. But in general, if there is a comfortableness, laughter, touching, and openly flirtatious behavior, those all point to all systems go.

 

[terry78]

I did get two hugs on a first date. No lip action though.