Mass Effect 3

[Balthus Dire]

This to me is the heigh of unfair, critical fan entitlement.

So because we have received a consistently solid effort, one slip up is more serious and worth being outraged about than the countless other devs who consistently undermine and take advantage of their fan base?

Hey man, Bioware earned my loyalty with ME 1, 2 and yes, even 3. I would forgive them a slip up because i know they are a solid and devoted developer. If this whole situation was the final straw or something, that would be different. But the reaction from people here just paints gamers in a terrible, terrible light. It's like "Yes, we'll accept your highly impressive games that are leaps and bounds above most other games of the same genre but waaaaaait a minute... THESE 15 MINUTES OF GAMPLAY RUIN EVERYTHING, FFFFFF UUUUUUU"

LOL dude...don't gloss over it as if it's just "15 minutes of gameplay." It's not like they messed up a segment where Shep takes a piss and OOPS the male version pees sitting down, too!

No...this is the ending of the current franchise. The culmination of every event from all 3 games. Like Matt said earlier in the thread, it's probably the most crucial thing they could've possibly screwed up. And that's why it's such a big deal to people.

 

[Matt]

I think its also a bad idea when only 50% of Xbox users use LIVE and only 50% of them buy DLC on average. I'm all for episodic and story content releases post-content but something like that being a fundamentally different and theoretically superior ending? That feels wrong.

And there's the rub. If there was any plan for the ending to be episodic, they would've sold it as such from the beginning and never risked this kind of backlash. I'm not saying they won't say, "HOLY SHNIKES! WE'VE STEPPED IN A HUGE PILE OF ****! LET'S ADD-ON TO FIX THIS!" But I will never believe that it was their initial plan.

 

[smashmode]

Keep in mind though, with over one million copies sold, 40,000 less than 4 % of the people who bought the game.

40,000 dollars donated to the Charity

 

[Balthus Dire]

I think its also a bad idea when only 50% of Xbox users use LIVE and only 50% of them buy DLC on average. I'm all for episodic and story content releases post-content but something like that being a fundamentally different and theoretically superior ending? That feels wrong.

I fully agree that it could end up being one of the worst decisions ever if it's true. But it could also be great, depending on how it's handled.

Either way, it probably won't ever happen again. IF it's true.

 

[Master Chief]

Matt responded quite nicely to this.

Spoiler

I believe something was subliminally weakening Shepard's resolve throughout the game, based on the dreams, whispers and Vega hearing a humming noise on the quietest ship the Alliance has.

When my resolve started to waiver in the game, I was reminded by Hackett that there is no alternative: I must destroy the reapers. I was reminded a second time to stick to my guns when TIM says, "Shepard was always going to stick with his ideals.".

Plus, there is just simply no plausible way to explain the impossible stuff that happens at the end. Reaper tech does not give you the power to control people, how did Anderson get ahead of Shepard, how did TIM come up behind them, why do shadows on the screen intensify everytime TIM talks, etc. etc.

 

[smashmode]

I don't see how it would be any different from buying the Fallout 3 DLC that totally negates the original F3 ending and let's you continue on..

This happens all the time with games getting post ending DLC and people are acting like it's the first time it's ever happened.

ME3 ended... But it should continue on from that ending, like many RPG's before it, in DLC.

Bad Comparison, at least you had closure, a epilogue of sorts. All the DLC did was retcon a foolish in-game choice and let you continue.

 

[X Knight]

Spoiler

I believe something was subliminally weakening Shepard's resolve throughout the game, based on the dreams, whispers and Vega hearing a humming noise on the quietest ship the Alliance has.

When my resolve started to waiver in the game, I was reminded by Hackett that there is no alternative: I must destroy the reapers. I was reminded a second time to stick to my guns when TIM says, "Shepard was always going to stick with his ideals.".

Plus, there is just simply no plausible way to explain the impossible stuff that happens at the end. Reaper tech does not give you the power to control people, how did Anderson get ahead of Shepard, how did TIM come up behind them, why do shadows on the screen intensify everytime TIM talks, etc. etc.

Spoiler

Space Magic!!!

 

[Master Chief]

Spoiler

Space Magic!!!

WHOA, if that's the twist... WOW!! t:

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

I fully agree that it could end up being one of the worst decisions ever if it's true. But it could also be great, depending on how it's handled.

Either way, it probably won't ever happen again. IF it's true.

I've considered possible avenues for a physical release like Mass Effect 3 Director's (or what have you) Cut for those without access to LIVE, but then I realize they would charge $40 for that and it feels wrong. Maybe $20 I could see but I imagine they would end up taking a hit and I doubt EA would do such a thing.

Of course if they charge for the physical copy with the new ending then they'll charge for the digital add-on as well and I personally know I would pay for it but a lot of people would be angry and rightfully so - and if it pays off it could create a very scary business model.

 

[Carnage27]

This to me is the heigh of unfair, critical fan entitlement.

First, I'd like to thank you for skipping THE REST OF MY POST for this one part.

You can call it entitlement. I call it holding a company up to their word. They continuously trumpeted how much your choices would matter. And I held them to that. If that makes me seem entitled, so be it. I'm entitled.

So because we have received a consistently solid effort, one slip up is more serious and worth being outraged about than the countless other devs who consistently undermine and take advantage of their fan base?

First of all, I'm far from outraged. Disappointed? Greatly.

As for other devs that consistently take advantage of their fanbase? Which ones? I'm seriously curious. Because I just don't pay attention all that much.

I'm a fan of Bioware. So when they drop the ball live this, yes, I find it serious as a fan. Just like I found it serious when Raimi made a crappy Spider-man 3. Or they made a crappy Matrix 2 and 3. Does that mean I'll never see those filmmaker's movies again? No.

Hey man, Bioware earned my loyalty with ME 1, 2 and yes, even 3. I would forgive them a slip up because i know they are a solid and devoted developer.

They gained my loyalty with KOTOR and Jade Empire. I'm old school like that.

And I already said I could forgive the crappy ending. Or did you not read my post in it's entirety?

If this whole situation was the final straw or something, that would be different. But the reaction from people here just paints gamers in a terrible, terrible light. It's like "Yes, we'll accept your highly impressive games that are leaps and bounds above most other games of the same genre but waaaaaait a minute... THESE 15 MINUTES OF GAMPLAY RUIN EVERYTHING, FFFFFF UUUUUUU"

They don't "ruin everything". But they certainly make me ambivalent to playing the games again. And they certainly leave a very bad taste in my mouth.

Whether you like it or not, Mass Effect is built on story just as much as gameplay. And I think it's within people's rights to complain if that story comes to an unsatisfying end.

 

[PWN3R]

This to me is the heigh of unfair, critical fan entitlement.

I hate this word now, entitlement. Especially IGN's use of the word. Although I hated (heavy stress) how ME3 ended, calling for a fix isn't what everyone should be doing. They can easily correct things with a DLC that adds to it. But I'm not saying anything that hasn't already been said.

My question: How is it entitlement when people are displeased with their product? Bioware provides a service, they promised customers different endings, even teased it, and ultimately failed. No matter our differences of opinions, can you honestly say the endings are that different?

Fans calling it out is just frustration on their part. 'Entitlement' is being thrown around, but it's really only the crazies who are acting out, 'NEVER AGAIN' and whatnot. Most people are just sadfaced and don't know how to express it.

 

[smashmode]

Yes, Rachni will help you in your quest.

Well.. Maybe.

Well

Spoiler

Not really, all they do is add some warpoints. I mean really it doesn't matter does it?

 

[Wolvieboy17]

Of course people are within their rights to complain if they don't like the ending. That's not in question.

Creating petitions and demanding they change the story? That's different.

 

[smashmode]

kind of spoilerish.

 

[Reek]

so i saved the queen in the first one, and was told shed help in the 2nd...for freaking nothing? thats one of the things i looked most forward to, an army of rachni fighting with me.

 

[X Knight]

I've considered possible venues for physical release like Mass Effect 3 Director's (or what have you) Cut for those without access to LIVE, but then I realize they would charge $40 for that and it feels wrong. Maybe $20 I could see but I imagine they would end up taking a hit and I doubt EA would do such a thing.

Of course if they charge for the physical copy with the new ending then they'll charge for the digital add-on as well and I personally know I would pay for it but a lot of people would be angry and rightfully so - and if it pays off it could create a very scary business model.

that's what I'm afraid of.

it's almost like giving game makers a license to release "unfinished" games and then charge you extra for DLC to "finish" the game.

I'd rather have them just come out and say: "Guess what?? Shepard's story is not over yet. See you all in ME 4!"

 

[Reek]

whens the first DLC supposed to come out anyway?

 

[Carnage27]

Creating petitions and demanding they change the story? That's different.

I only glanced over the petitions, but most of the wording I've seen are asking Bioware to do something, not demanding. But I could be wrong. I haven't paid much attention to them.

Personally, I think the petitions and complaints are great. Will it do anything for Mass Effect 3? Probably not. But maybe it'll give Bioware a kick in the pants and keep them on edge for their next series to ensure they come through on their promises.

 

[X Knight]

the 1st DLC is already out, if you count the Ashes DLC, isn't it?

as for future DLC......who knows.........

 

[smashmode]

so i saved the queen in the first one, and was told shed help in the 2nd...for freaking nothing? thats one of the things i looked most forward to, an army of rachni fighting with me.

essentially

Spoiler

yes, your choices equals points, points equal to a different 'ending'

 

[PWN3R]

Of course people are within their rights to complain if they don't like the ending. That's not in question.

Creating petitions and demanding they change the story? That's different.

How else are they going to make their opinions known? Twitter? Emails? Twitter is a joke because they mostly only respond to positive feedback.

People want to be heard. Petitions do that. They're unhappy with the ending, how is this entitlement? Some people are a little too crazy, but their opinions aren't invalid.

Has anyone seen the IGN Colin whatever video addressing this? Just wow.

 

[Balthus Dire]

that's what I'm afraid of.

it's almost like giving game makers a license to release "unfinished" games and then charge you extra for DLC to "finish" the game.

I'd rather have them just come out and say: "Guess what?? Shepard's story is not over yet. See you all in ME 4!"

If that was the case, they should've said it long ago instead of repeatedly saying that this is the final game and the conclusion to Shep's story.

Also, I've already said it but I'll say it again that I agree if BW charges for "ending" DLC it's an absolute joke. If that was their initial plan, I can't see them following through considering the insane backlash that would surely follow.

But we'll see.

 

[Wolvieboy17]

I hate this word now, entitlement. Especially IGN's use of the word. Although I hated (heavy stress) how ME3 ended, calling for a fix isn't what everyone should be doing. They can easily correct things with a DLC that adds to it. But I'm not saying anything that hasn't already been said.

My question: How is it entitlement when people are displeased with their product? Bioware provides a service, they promised customers different endings, even teased it, and ultimately failed. No matter our differences of opinions, can you honestly say the endings are that different?

Fans calling it out is just frustration on their part. 'Entitlement' is being thrown around, but it's really only the crazies who are acting out, 'NEVER AGAIN' and whatnot. Most people are just sadfaced and don't know how to express it.

I agree with you about that word being used to much.

To me, I only see it as entitlement when people want Bioware to actually go and change the ending to the story they created and put out there. If they want a new feature, some game fixing thing, something that means the product is actually 'broken', that is different. They ARE entitled it.

But if you go see a movie and don't like the way it ends, DEMANDING they change the movie and re-release it, is entitlement.

Good or bad, that was the story the writers and game director wanted to put out there. I can't think of anything more horrifically insulting to someone in a creative field to being told to 'redo' something they spent over 24 months working on.

Also, peoples complaints about none of their decisions mattering, to me, is a separate issue to the ending. They could have enhanced that with the overall game, addressed things like the Rachni etc better, that kind of thing. The 3 endings is different though. They could have kept those exact 3 endings and still shown more of our choices reflected, showing us each character and what is happening to them as a direct result of our choice.

However, wanting them to take back a product they've put out there, alter the story and narrative component, then release it again? If Bioware actually did that, I would have no respect for them at all.

If you write something that doesn't work or is flawed, you have to live with it. There are no do-overs. That's a black mark on your record, people will either turn away from you or give you another chance. But you can't go back in time and fix it, what's done is done.

The sooner everyone accepts that, the better. The moments developers, writers, directors, whatever, start allowing their vision be influenced by fan pressure, is the moment they lose ALL integrity as creative content producers.

 

[X Knight]

essentially

Spoiler

yes, your choices equals points, points equal to a different 'ending'

Spoiler

So....wait......we never actually get to see a Rachni army helping us??

 

[Carnage27]

Has anyone seen the IGN Colin whatever video addressing this? Just wow.

Yea. That got me more mad than the actual ending.