Apocalypse Nightcrawler in the Apocalypse Movie

[MakeMinesMarvel]

"The past... a NEW and UNCERTAIN world..."

t:

 

[marvelrobbins]

As i have said many time the time travel In DOFP has basiclly erased Trilogy,origins,and the Wolverine from contunity.DOFP was essential a "reboot" since most of films are now ilrelvent now moving forward.

There is still the issue fox doesn't have rights to MS marvel with regards to rogue.

X2's portrayal of Nightcrawler has no bearing on APocalypse version of Nightcrawler.The fact a teenage version of nightcrawler is introduced with teenage versions of cyclops,jean,and storm just proves the non-FC films has been erased.

Onviously the future ending of DOFP has to be in mind with films going forward.

 

[josh8]

You're extrapolating. It could have very well been a side effect of Magneto's machine and nothing more. You are right that they could write in some new explanation down the line as to why she got the streak, but at this point, it's only a guess. And no, I doubt Ms. Marvel will ever show up.

Can X1 & X2 happen exactly now? No. Everyone knows that. I just think you guys are getting carried away if you think EVERYTHING is thrown out like a reboot. Sure, many things will now happen differently. The journey may take a different path, but the broad strokes of the destination are the same.

I get what you mean. I think it's just people interpreting "threw everything out" differently. I think most of us still prefer that the universe be the same (however, diverging now). For example, Rogue or Warren can't suddenly be born earlier to be the same age as the rest of the X-peeps (especially since Rogue was shown at the end of DOFP). But I know some are thinking that, yes, they can do stuff like that now. I think in general most of us (including you and me) are on the same page.

 

[DocLathropBrown]

EDIT: As for your comment: "If you think you know what's going to happen now, you're wrong." We DO know which X-Men survive any more "prequel" movies, except for a few like Nightcrawler and Gambit.

Xavier was incinerated in X3... people can still die and be resurrected between 1983 and 2023, they just gotta come up with some good reasons to do so.

Personally, I don't think there will be any more films set in the future moving forward, though the next Wolverine is kinda unusual in that respect. The actors cast from Apocalypse-on will be signed for multiples and I see no real reason why Fox would deviate from the momentum they'll generate to go back to another flick with the 'old' actors.

Besides, doing another film set in the future will set rules that any other films set in the 'past' will have to go by. The only possible chance we'll see the older actors again is if there's another film that uses both casts, like DOFP. I think they'll just have the years progress on and on and 'age-up' the new Cyclops (etc..) until they could get to a 'semi-modern' period. We'll see.

 

[magneto23]

The actors cast from Apocalypse-on will be signed for multiples and I see no real reason why Fox would deviate from the momentum they'll generate to go back to another flick with the 'old' actors.

I see no good reason why tptb would want to go back and forth between future and past. It's almost counterproductive in a way. The young and old versions taking stories, character interaction, and screentime away from one another. They want to do a modern/future setting? Do X-Force/Deadpool. Not X-Men. Stick with one and build it up the right way. They've cast the young X-Men and have strong actors as Xavier/Magneto. Work with that. Don't put them on the back burner to make a big OT reunion movie. That would just diminish what the young cast would be trying to build. And that would be awful for this franchise.

 

[josh8]

Personally, I don't think there will be any more films set in the future moving forward, though the next Wolverine is kinda unusual in that respect. The actors cast from Apocalypse-on will be signed for multiples and I see no real reason why Fox would deviate from the momentum they'll generate to go back to another flick with the 'old' actors.

It will be interesting to see what timeline they'll go with for the next Wolverine movie. It would be redundant to do another origin movie even with the changed past. A lot of people are hoping for the Old Man Logan storyline, which I'm not super familiar with...

If any of the OT cast show up in the next Wolverine movie, it'll be a little strange since their pasts will have been altered, but it probably wouldn't be too difficult with some careful storytelling.

You're right that it would be unwise to draw fans away from the current cast they're setting up... probably no more OT cast X-Men movies. However, I do think it's highly possible that a few of the OT cast will show up in spin-offs.

 

[Super Jim]

^ Many of the people have been saying for a long time how DoFP "erased" all of the X1-Last Stand and Origins movies, and to a degree, they are correct, but to a different degree, they are wrong.

Yes, none of the stories we saw in X1, X2, last Stand and Origins will now happen in this new timeline, but there are still many different things that stand, even if the story doesn't happen.

A very important piece of this is the ages of characters we have seen. Other than some stupid things, like the Cyclops and the "Emma" we saw in Origins (can we just totally forget that one movie?), the ages of characters matter.

Someone above mentioned that because we will now have a young Nightcrawler with the X-Men it proves that everything is totally erased, but my counter argument is the fact that they are having a late teen-aged Nightcrawler proves that the ages of characters we've seen, even in stories that are now erased, matter.

In X2 Nightcrawler was what, maybe mid 30's? And that movie was in what year... 2004?

We also know that (assuming the parentage of Kurt) that Mystique gave birth to him in 1963 or 1964 (since Azazel - the likely and per canon father (and again, if they make Kurt's dad Erik or Beast I'm flipping out!) was killed in 1963).

That would make Kurt 19 years old or so in 1986, which would make him around mid to late 30'd during X2. This (somewhat - at least mostly, which is good for these X-movies) matches up.

As far as Rogue, look, she was like 16 years old in 2004, which would make her not even born yet in 1983. So they can't just throw her into this movie, unless they do some stupid time travel crap.

That means that IF (and it's a big if) Mystique raises Rogue, then it has to happen between Rogue's birth in 1988 and her young teenaged years in the early 2000's. Yes, this could be a good story for a Mystique 2 solo film, but there is a different story that they should do for Mystique first (her meeting and developing a relationship with Destiny) before they get into the Rogue stuff.

But like others have said, they will likely, and should, stay focused on these new characters for at least the next decade (3 movies), which should all take place in the 80's to early 90's at the latest. That means we're very unlikely to see our aging OT actors and actresses any time soon.

But, there are ways to still give us some OT stuff. I've suggested they do the two following things:

1. Create an Excalibur TV series or movie using some of the younger OT cast as the founders. We're talking Kitty, Iceman, Rogue and Colossus; and possibly an older Nightcrawler, along with some England characters, like Pete Wisdom, Captain Britain and Megan. This could most definitely work, and could have cameos from Patrick Stewart, Hugh Jackman and others.

Oh, and this could all lead to a crossover movie between the F4 and this group, once the F4 movie fails, with a story of the Excalibur group needing Reed's help to save Kitty, whose powers are causing her molecules to destabilize. This leads to the events of the X-Men versus the Fantastic Four.

2. Do a Cable Origins movie that would include his parents, played of course by Famke and James. This one, to me, makes so much sense:

 

[GuestStar2004]

I still as skeptical that the fantastic 4 is in the same "universe" as the X-Men, unlike what marvel have done they don't seem to wanna hint or tease that it's in the same universe beyond saying yeah we could do it a cross over and it's totally an idea we talked about but it will be tricky

I personally still believe it will be a transporting from one universe to another story if it happens, which could easy open the door to them using the new cast if they wished to play around Being taken back in time too

And truth be told if that was the plan to make it a transporting to another universe story Kinberg and co probably wouldn't reveal that idea yet anyway since

1. The x-men Bein in the same univese idea could help the film at box office (maybe)
2. You don't wanna risk deflating people when you want this film will do well

 

[marvelrobbins]

Some still think films will be 100 % like comics.No matter your preference
none of sony,marvel studios,WB,and Fox are 100% like comics.

Secondly too many assume the FF will fail even though more liked than disliked the teaser.

Because they wanted in future ending of DOFP to have X_Men of trilogy besides Nightcrawler In so called happy ending that put Rogue,Iceman,Kitty,and Colossus off limits to future films inless they appear in new wolverine film or a X-Men/FF film.Or in Colossus' case the deadpool film.

If origins was set in 1970's that would create problems with 16 year old cyclops in 1983 in apocalypse.Xavier and magneto with young jean at ebgining of last stand according to commantary was suspose to eather late 1970's or early 1980's.But,if we proceed with non-FC films erased it doesn't
matter about those films.Same as annything In FC that would conflict with trilogy,Origins,The wolverine.What FC said matter not the earlier films.

Some want Angel in Apocalypse.If you approach this as the only limition on filmakers is future ending of DOFP any character not used in FC/1973 parts of DOFP and 2023 ending of DOFP Is fair game for Apocalypse and future films.If they want Gambit in present origins can't hold them back.However they may set it in 1980's so Gambit can interact with younger cast In Apocalypse sequels.

 

[GuestStar2004]

In general the producers may not feel gambit needs to be a member of th X-Men or even interact with the X-men

If his solo idea hasnt scream it out enough, it has been an idea since origins after all and I doubt the intension was set up just to throw him with the X-Men later

Origins was pretty much an excuse for spin off fodder

 

[Gamma Goliath]

Wonder if singer will give nightcrawler some kind of red on his costume.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

I still as skeptical that the fantastic 4 is in the same "universe" as the X-Men, unlike what marvel have done they don't seem to wanna hint or tease that it's in the same universe beyond saying yeah we could do it a cross over and it's totally an idea we talked about but it will be tricky

They likely want to build the F4 franchise up again like they did X-Men and Apes and then announce they're definately in the same universe.

Them announcing it now puts them in a corner if F4 fails like Sony put themselves in the corner announcing all those spin-offs and then having to backtrack.

Fox are plying it smarter and not showing their cards right away.

I bet they're planning a crossover but in a way that if the F4 don't take off then they can drop the idea without any noticable effects to X-Men and if F4 is a succes then it can fit.

 

[Snikt]

They likely want to build the F4 franchise up again like they did X-Men and Apes and then announce they're definately in the same universe.

Them announcing it now puts them in a corner if F4 fails like Sony put themselves in the corner announcing all those spin-offs and then having to backtrack.

Fox are plying it smarter and not showing their cards right away.

I bet they're planning a crossover but in a way that if the F4 don't take off then they can drop the idea without any noticable effects to X-Men and if F4 is a succes then it can fit.

I find myself agreeing with you a lot . You're one of the few rational people who post in the Fan4 forums.

You make your point without ever being a di--! Which is hard to do on an internet forum

 

[marvelrobbins]

They likely want to build the F4 franchise up again like they did X-Men and Apes and then announce they're definately in the same universe.

Them announcing it now puts them in a corner if F4 fails like Sony put themselves in the corner announcing all those spin-offs and then having to backtrack.

Fox are plying it smarter and not showing their cards right away.

I bet they're planning a crossover but in a way that if the F4 don't take off then they can drop the idea without any noticable effects to X-Men and if F4 is a succes then it can fit.

we largely agree.

X-men and Apes is model fox is likely using for FF.

And hey a lot of scoopers and insiders on twitter think Fox is smarter than Sony.With Spider-man it's best to have solo films back on track before spin-off talk.Just like FC,and DOFP made doing deadpool and Gambit reasonable.And after the wolverine people will be more excited for a solo
wolverine film than they were after origins.I know not everyone loved the wolverine but some did.It's 69 on RT a far cry from origins.

 

[GuestStar2004]

They likely want to build the F4 franchise up again like they did X-Men and Apes and then announce they're definately in the same universe.

Them announcing it now puts them in a corner if F4 fails like Sony put themselves in the corner announcing all those spin-offs and then having to backtrack.

Fox are plying it smarter and not showing their cards right away.

I bet they're planning a crossover but in a way that if the F4 don't take off then they can drop the idea without any noticable effects to X-Men and if F4 is a succes then it can fit.

Doesnt mean you cant throw in the odd tease, marvel so far have done it with their films, stark gets mentioned in thor for example and appeared in the Incredible Hulk, and his dad appeared in captain America and so on, they are also doing it with WB

If they wanted they could mention Xavier's school for gifted mutants in the film but I believe kinberg has said there is no mention at all

Kinberg once said it would be hard because in a world where mutants exist the fantastic 4 wouldn't be fantastic they would just be like mutants, and what do we have in this film? A machine that transports them to other universes? Coincidence much? I am very skeptic they will wait till people like the F4 then they will reveal it and people will be into it already

And to quote what kinberg said to collider.com

KINBERG: I will say only that we are all very inspired by what Marvel has done. If there’s a way to have different communications between these universes that would be great

Suppose only time will tell

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

Little teases like a screen featuring a news segment about Mutant affairs in the background would be cool

we largely agree.

X-men and Apes is model fox is likely using for FF.

And hey a lot of scoopers and insiders on twitter think Fox is smarter than Sony.With Spider-man it's best to have solo films back on track before spin-off talk.Just like FC,and DOFP made doing deadpool and Gambit reasonable.And after the wolverine people will be more excited for a solo
wolverine film than they were after origins.I know not everyone loved the wolverine but some did.It's 69 on RT a far cry from origins.

Well said. They understand need to establish a higher confidence in the FF franchise again before expanding and announcing connecting movies and so on.

I find myself agreeing with you a lot . You're one of the few rational people who post in the Fan4 forums.

You make your point without ever being a di--! Which is hard to do on an internet forum

Thank you, I really appreciate that. I try to be civil as much as possible.

Though I'm limiting my time there unfortunately.

 

[marvelrobbins]

Thank you, I try to be civil as much as possible.

Though I'm limiting my time there unfortunately.

Your not only one doing that.It's just too much of a mind field right now.

When there is actual news or the full trailer drops that is when both of us can go back.

I look forward to how thing works and after seeing dawn of planet of the apes i look forward to see actor behind Kobra as Doom.

Next year how nightcrawler is done will be Intresting to see.

 

[GuestStar2004]

Is fox smarter for having no mention though? Marvel and WB have both thrown in Easter eggs (the man of steel had some) we will have to see if there are any in the fantastic 4 for fans

It doesn't make fox smarter to avoid it though, it feels more like saying fox obviously have something up their sleeve because they ain't saying anything at all which must mean something unlike other studios who make it to obvious while still being able to tell storys about their characters

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

Is fox smarter for having no mention though? Marvel and WB have both thrown in Easter eggs (the man of steel had some) we will have to see if there are any in the fantastic 4 for fans

It doesn't make fox smarter to avoid it though, it feels more like saying fox have something up their sleeve because they ain't saying anything thing at all which must mean something unlike other studios who make it to obvious

Have they said definately no X-Men Easter eggs though? I haven't read anything like that but haven't been following the news as much recently

If not they may have some but since the movie is being kept under wraps as the director wants people to see most of it for the first time when watching the whole movie they likely wouldn't say so it's a surprise.

 

[GuestStar2004]

It's possible they could throw in some, even though it wouldn't hurt to say there are some Easter eggs for the fans

So there’s no sign for Xavier’s School for the Gifted in this as a throw away?

KINBERG: This is really a Fantastic Four movie so that’s what we’re focused on.

I suppose in the end what's the more beneficial thing to do, let this film run alone which is certainly the more braver bet and if it does bad then give up and presumably end up giving the rights back to marvel... Or use x-men Easter eggs as a way to have a second chance to bounce this franchise back if say the first film does bad then they can do a cross over and have the chance to breath new life into those characters by using the x-men as a safety net

We will have to see, I mean maybe you are right and fox are just taking a risk which will pay off like X-Men first class did

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

From that quote I gather he means that it's Fantastic Four solely as in no X-Men stuff involved in the story, but Easter eggs aren't tied to the plot so I don't take that to mean subtle references or sneaky stuff couldn't be in the background.

Youre right we'll have to see

 

[marvelrobbins]

Let's remember that in past easter eggs in X_Men films have caused trouble down the road for them.No easter eggs In FF doesn't mean they don't exsist in shared universe and is actully smart.

 

[Sithborg]

Let's remember that in past easter eggs in X_Men films have caused trouble down the road for them.No easter eggs In FF doesn't mean they don't exsist in shared universe and is actully smart.

Easter eggs have only caused issues if you are OCD about even the minor details. Did they REALLY have to explain the Hank McCoy on the talk show in X2? The various un-named/named mutants we see only small power displays of.

There are continuity issues, sure. But nothing that was involved with an easter egg.

 

[Havok83]

Easter eggs have only caused issues if you are OCD about even the minor details. Did they REALLY have to explain the Hank McCoy on the talk show in X2? The various un-named/named mutants we see only small power displays of.

There are continuity issues, sure. But nothing that was involved with an easter egg.

I never understood why people tripped over Hank being in X2. In the comics, he's gone back and forth between furry blue and his normal human look so many times that it can logically be accepted that the same likely happened in the movieverse. It didnt need explanation in X3

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

These days Easter eggs are treated as gospel whereas back then it was a fun nod for the fans.