Official 'The Hobbit' Thread - Part 15

[jmc]

I'm aware it was CG in The Hobbit, at the time I wasn't aware the entire film was GC.

 

[jmc]

I think they had plenty of time. The problem is Jackson adding tons of extra work for no reason. If Jackson wasn't changing stuff a month out from release, completely scrapping the look of characters over and over again, this wouldn't be an issue.

He did the same for LOTR, if you look at both Two Towers and ROTK both of those films lack the polish that Fellowship has.

 

[Venomfan]

The trailer shows exactly why they should have killed Smaug in the last one. The only will be a weird tacked on starter.

I reckon it will be like Count Dooku at the start of Ep III. After being a huge threat in II he's beaten at the start of III which makes it just feel kinda meh

 

[dark_b]

at 0:30 are the soldiers all CGI?

i respect the clean sharp look that they are using for the last two movies. its artistic. but its a very different style compared to other movies. maybe i am not used to it. the real actors look like female models on magazine covers. everything looks photoshop airbrushed.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I reckon it will be like Count Dooku at the start of Ep III. After being a huge threat in II he's beaten at the start of III which makes it just feel kinda meh

Yeah, a bit out of place.

at 0:30 are the soldiers all CGI?

i respect the clean sharp look that they are using for the last two movies. its artistic. but its a very different style compared to other movies. maybe i am not used to it. the real actors look like female models on magazine covers. everything looks photoshop airbrushed.

That is a good way of putting it. The film looks airbrushed.

 

[Marvolo]

Smaug's attack on Lake Town is the pre-title sequence of BTFA. Its revealed on the DOS EE. It shows the title card shot of BTFA in one of the docs. The title pops up over the Laketown people's exodus from the burned town.

If you want to see the shot I mean its the one at 00:34 in Trailer 1. The Battle of the Five Armies Title shows up over that shot. So Smaug's attack is prolly 10 minutes at most.

 

[regwec]

It feels a bit like having the death of the Emperor as a pre title sequence to Return of the Jedi.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

It feels a bit like having the death of the Emperor as a pre title sequence to Return of the Jedi.

More like Vader, but I get what you mean.

 

[Marvolo]

I think it can work as an opening but only because unlike Dooku who just shows up in ROTS and dies without accomplishing anything, Smaug will show up and kill hundreds and burn an entire town to the ground. Andddd maybe even kill one of Bard's daughters.

Smaug might die in the first ten minutes, but he's gonna go nuclear on a town and its people first and thats a crazy way to open a film thats obviously going to be filled with a lot of death. This film could be an emotional powerhouse if done right.

 

[TyrionLannister]

Does anyone have a clue where Legolas and Tauriel are when he says "These bats where bred for war." And what is that red building?

Kili screaming "I will not hide while others fight our battle for us!" gave me cold chills.

Looks like it could potentially be Mt. Gundabad

 

[Vartha]

Picked up the DOS EE and WOW what they added to the Dol Guldur scenes almost changes what was in the theater to something new!
I wasn't Expecting it at ALL

 

[ares834]

Yeah, that looks awesome. Got chills.

Other than that, it looks decent. CGI is pretty awful and sad to see the lack of a certain dragon. Seems they should have cut the chase and molten gold scene and instead had Smaug attack Laketown in that instead.

 

[C. Lee]

Picked up the DOS EE and WOW what they added to the Dol Guldur scenes almost changes what was in the theater to something new!
I wasn't Expecting it at ALL

Jackson talks about that in the commentary.

 

[Marvolo]

Looks like it could potentially be Mt. Gundabad

That seems to be the consensus. I completely forgot about Gundabad. Glad it seems to be making an appearance.

 

[Vartha]

Jackson talks about that in the commentary.

Didn't have time for watching both with and without today. Had to get ready for work when it was over today. lol

 

[Marvolo]

Picked up the DOS EE and WOW what they added to the Dol Guldur scenes almost changes what was in the theater to something new!
I wasn't Expecting it at ALL

Yeah I just watched those scenes and that was a bigger change than I was expecting. It adds so many implications. Not to mention it made those scenes insanely creepy and ominous. Really cant believe all that stuff ended up on the cutting room floor. And because Gandalf doesnt meet Thrain in DOS's theatrical cut it means that the scene where Gandalf tells Thorin he found his father and that his father loved him is going to be cut from the theatrical cut of BTFA.

There's no way I am ever going to be able to enjoy the theatrical cut of DOS again.

Oh and I liked the bit in Laketown where Bilbo vouches for Thorin's character and his integrity. That is going to be payed off in BTFA when Bilbo reminds him of his promise to the people that he would help them. I can already hear Thorin telling him "I will not part with a single coin!".

 

[Boom]

Another Hobbit trailer where Bilbo is barely anywhere to be found. Devin Faraci hit it on the head. Just call it "The Dwarves" and be done with it already.

"These bats were bred for war."



I'm honestly very close to just skipping this until the DVD. This movie appears to be in full-blown video game mode.

 

[Marvolo]

Honestly yall are being ridiculous about the "These bats for bred for war." line. Its a harmless statement of fact. I dont remember anyone taking issue with Aragorn saying "It is an army bred for a single purpose, to destroy the world of men." That line was melodramatic as all hell in the TTT trailer.

As for Bilbo, he appears from what I can tell from the trailer to do many of the things in the film that he did in the book and he is shown trying to talk Thorin down from his madness and unlike in the book he seems to take an active role in the Battle so its pretty clear Bilbo hasnt been sidelined. If anything his role has been increased. Honestly he's never been sidelined in the previous films either. In the films he participates in the action and the plot. He has been pivitol in the quest many times. And he has grown from a shy fussy Hobbit into a brave Hobbit who has faced a dragon and not **** himself. And now in this film he is going to stand up to an army of some really evil **** and try to save Thorin and countless others. I really dont know what more yall want. Bilbo's part in this tale is already about as substantial as it can get without having him slay Smaug and beat the Orc Armies singlehandedly.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Honestly yall are being ridiculous about the "These bats for bred for war." line. Its a harmless statement of fact. I dont remember anyone taking issue with Aragorn saying "It is an army bred for a single purpose, to destroy the world of men."

As for Bilbo, he appears from what I can tell from the trailer to do many of the things in the film that he did in the book and he is shown trying to talk Thorin down from his madness and unlike in the book he seems to take an active role in the Battle so its pretty clear Bilbo hasnt been sidelined. If anything his role has been increased. Honestly he's never been sidelined in the previous films either. In the films he participates in the action and the plot. He has been pivitol in the quest many times. I really dont know what more yall want.

Because it was an awesomely delivered line. Not a clumsy line attempting to harken back that film.

One reason Bilbo feels sidelined is because of all the material. If the narrative was focused on him, we'd maybe have two movies and not a lot of time in between the times Bilbo does things.

 

[Marvolo]

Because it was an awesomely delivered line. Not a clumsy line attempting to harken back that film.

One reason Bilbo feels sidelined is because of all the material. If the narrative was focused on him, we'd maybe have two movies and not a lot of time in between the times Bilbo does things.

Sure, Bilbo isnt the sole focus of these films, but his character hasnt been short changed. He has evolved and been a very important part in everything.

About Viggo's line it was used in a very similar way in the two towers marketing material. Sure Viggo is just better at delivering that line, but all Im saying is that without the melodramatic trailer music and in context of the scene within the film it may play a lot better. Regardless tho its a silly thing to get too worked up over.

On another note, how do yall think Saruman vs Sauron at Dol Guldor will work? Chris Lee is no spring chicken and can barely move around. Do yall think they will just cgi Lee's face and head onto a stunt double or will his battle with Sauron be something non physical?

And is it just me, or has Pete made Saruman kinda...gross looking? Maybe its just Lee's age and if it is then I wont take issue with it, cause its not the man's fault age is a *****, but I just think Saruman could look a lot better. I think its the beard thats bothering me. Its just...unflattering to say the least.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Sure, Bilbo isnt the sole focus of these films, but his character hasnt been short changed. He has evolved and been a very important part in everything.

About Viggo's line it was used in a very similar way in the two towers marketing material. Sure Viggo is just better at delivering that line, but all Im saying is that without the melodramatic trailer music and in context of the scene within the film it may play a lot better. Regardless tho its a silly thing to get too worked up over.

On another note, how do yall think Saruman vs Sauron at Dol Guldor will work? Chris Lee is no spring chicken and can barely move around. Do yall think they will just cgi Lee's face and head onto a stunt double or will his battle with Sauron be something non physical?

And is it just me, or has Pete made Saruman kinda...gross looking? Maybe its just Lee's age and if it is then I wont take issue with it, cause its not the man's fault age is a *****, but I just think Saruman could look a lot better. I think its the beard thats bothering me. Its just...unflattering to say the least.

The line reminds me of George Lucas with the prequels. Trying to harken back to something that was done well the first time. Except now the dialogue is far more clunky as it is not nature. It is simply suppose to rhyme with what came before.

And Bilbo is shortchanged as his stories impact has a lot of its weight as it is lost in the mire of these 7-8 hours of film. This would be like telling the story of Luke Skywalker, Bruce Wayne or Harry Potter and having their stories be the main focus less then a third of the time.

 

[sueb1863]

Maybe it's just the idea of war-bats that's silly. Did Tolkien ever have war-bats in any of his books? It just seems really out of left field.

 

[regwec]

Honestly yall are being ridiculous about the "These bats for bred for war." line. Its a harmless statement of fact. I dont remember anyone taking issue with Aragorn saying "It is an army bred for a single purpose, to destroy the world of men." That line was melodramatic as all hell in the TTT trailer.

Surely even the tinniest of ears for dialogue would detect, subliminally, that the second line is far more poetic and pregnant with drama than the first. The concept of "destroying the world of men" is so baroque in its scope and the language with which it is introduced that it perfectly balances the relatively mundane description of the army being "bred". It is an admirably concise way of expanding the dramatic threat posed by the belligerent who has already been introduced.

"These bats are bred for war" is, conversely, reductive because it simply reflects on a context that is already evident. By association with the line in LOTR, it also acts to create a slightly comic effect by its pithy application to "bats", which are not an exotic concept in themselves. You might say "this rice is grown for war".

If the line is really necessary at all (and it disturbs me that it was selected for the trailer), then it could be much better written. For instance;

"These beasts were bred for war alone".

This implies that the bats are something more than the mundane and implies that they represent a threat greater than we might otherwise perceive; it also intensifies the sense that the designs of the enemy have become dangerously concerted and single-minded.

is it just me, or has Pete made Saruman kinda...gross looking? Maybe its just Lee's age and if it is then I wont take issue with it, cause its not the man's fault age is a *****, but I just think Saruman could look a lot better. I think its the beard thats bothering me. Its just...unflattering to say the least.

I agree with you. I am sad to say that I believe Saruman should have been recast, and I say that as a huge fan of Christopher Lee. Even sat chatting in an armchair in the first part, he seemed a much frailer figure than the wizard that defeated Gandalf in FOTR.

I imagine that a lot of very ugly CGI will be used to sell his duel with Sauron (and they're calling him Sauron?).

 

[ravn0s]

Maybe it's just the idea of war-bats that's silly. Did Tolkien ever have war-bats in any of his books? It just seems really out of left field.

yes, the bats are in the book during the battle.

 

[regwec]

They are just bats in the book, though.