Pacific Rim - Part 6

I went back to see this again last week...something I rarely do, nowadays. The 8 year-old kid in me LOVES this film! You have to accept from the beginning, that it's closer to Godzilla and Mighty Morphin' Power Rangers than it is to Avatar or Aliens. It feels good to watch an action movie like this that kids can enjoy, without it being too grim and/or too violent. It had a certain "fun factor" and presented real heroes...elements that I really felt deprived of after seeing MOS in June. I will probably even go see this a third time...I can't even remember the last time I did that for any movie.
 
It feels good to watch an action movie like this that kids can enjoy, without it being too grim and/or too violent. It had a certain "fun factor" and presented real heroes...elements that I really felt deprived of after seeing MOS in June.

May must have been good to you.
 
Just got back from watching this with my family and we all had a blast, was such an easy-to-enjoy film. I'm not into anime or mecha stuff (I think the only 'japanese' thing I've watched was Robotech) but this was great. From my wife, 13 year old daughter and 9 year old son, we absolutely loved it.

The scientist guys were painful, Hannibal Chau or whatever was stupid/ridiculous (not in a good way) but the rest we thought were great, the fights were awesome and we were on the edge of our seats for most of it - it doesn't 'need' a sequel, but damn I hope it gets one.
 
Pacific Rim is one of my favorites this summer. Tough call between this or ST:ID for 2nd place. I haven't sat down and watched a kaiju film since...elementary school, so I had a lot of fun watching this.
 
It feels good to watch an action movie like this that kids can enjoy, without it being too grim and/or too violent. It had a certain "fun factor" and presented real heroes
100% agree. That's the movie's best part - that it is done with a truly wonderful light touch and has no pretensions that it is SOME SERIOUS EXPLORATION OF THE HUMAN CONDITION... like all the ******** we get in Nolan films. It makes me eyeroll that a film about a man dressing up as a bat is taking itself as seriously as Dostevsky.

Pacific Rim got it right. Star Trek mostly got it right. Avengers got is dazzlingly well.
 
Batman is at least a character suited for those kind of stories. Unlike some other DC properties I won't mention here.

But I agree, Pacific Rim was like a breath of fresh air.
 
I was watching Pacific Rim. The movie this year with the one most cringe worthy dialogue. Thus poorly written.

The most tangible detail of writing, but not necessarily the most fundamental.

Explain how Pa Kent isn't borderline schizophrenic in his motivations.

Explain the writing merits of having the entire climax of your film be a beat for beat play on an iconic movie from earlier in the franchise completely a self parodying emotional outburst from a character whose defining feature is control over his emotions.

The writing in Pacific Rim certainly has its problems but I'd hardly say its the worst written film that I've seen this summer.
 
The most tangible detail of writing, but not necessarily the most fundamental.

Explain how Pa Kent isn't borderline schizophrenic in his motivations.

Explain the writing merits of having the entire climax of your film be a beat for beat play on an iconic movie from earlier in the franchise completely a self parodying emotional outburst from a character whose defining feature is control over his emotions.

I for one am curious what your definition of schizophrenia is.
Moreover, whatever it may be, I personally find it difficult to explain half of the actions in the comic book genre, such as people dressing as bats all the way to their naming conventions of their dual identities to their concept of law and morality etc. Long story short how would Pa being "schizophrenic" qualify as bad writing.
(again, curious what your definition of the disorder is in the first place).

Secondly, I'm confused by your second question. Could you restate it, it does seem interesting if only you were more clear...
 
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The most tangible detail of writing, but not necessarily the most fundamental.

Explain how Pa Kent isn't borderline schizophrenic in his motivations.

Explain the writing merits of having the entire climax of your film be a beat for beat play on an iconic movie from earlier in the franchise completely a self parodying emotional outburst from a character whose defining feature is control over his emotions.

Which Superman movie was that? I want to watch that one.
 
The most tangible detail of writing, but not necessarily the most fundamental.

Explain how Pa Kent isn't borderline schizophrenic in his motivations.

Explain the writing merits of having the entire climax of your film be a beat for beat play on an iconic movie from earlier in the franchise completely a self parodying emotional outburst from a character whose defining feature is control over his emotions.

The writing in Pacific Rim certainly has its problems but I'd hardly say its the worst written film that I've seen this summer.
Pacific Rim is Ingmar Bergman compared to MOS. MOS had the most ******** screenplay of any blockbuster in the last few years except Tron Legacy.
 
100% agree. That's the movie's best part - that it is done with a truly wonderful light touch and has no pretensions that it is SOME SERIOUS EXPLORATION OF THE HUMAN CONDITION... like all the ******** we get in Nolan films. It makes me eyeroll that a film about a man dressing up as a bat is taking itself as seriously as Dostevsky.

Pacific Rim got it right. Star Trek mostly got it right. Avengers got is dazzlingly well.

I'll take all this wonderful hyperbole and respond in kind.
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The more I watch this trailer the more I wonder how far removed Schumacher's Avengers may have been from the finished product.
 
It makes me eyeroll that a film about a man dressing up as a bat is taking itself as seriously as Dostevsky.

"Nice Coat"

"You can borrow the Rolls if you like"

"Nice car," "You should see my other one."

"Well, they are European."

"We were just... swimming."

"It's a black... tank?"

"Just tell me what it looks like... nevermind."

"A little worse for wear I'm afraid."

"I hope you're not a member of the fire brigade."

"I wanna borrow it. You know uh... for spelunking?" "Spelunking?"

"You wouldn't beat up a woman any more than I would beat up a cripple."

"Keep some pressure on that, darling." "Call me!"

"Must've lost my ticket." "You're wife said you were taking a cab home." "My WIFE??"

"Don't worry Mr. Wayne. It takes a little time to get back into the swing of things."

<Young cop shoots Batman's electromagnetic gun. Batman looks at him.>

"My mother warned me about getting into cars with strange men." "This isn't a car."

"Between that and the scar tissue on your kidneys, the residual concussive damage to your brain tissue, and the general scarred-over quality of your body, I cannot recommend that you go heliskiing, Mr. Wayne."

"Very well. Death! ... By exile."

"I like that name.... Robin."
 
I for one am curious what your definition of schizophrenia is.
Moreover, whatever it may be, I personally find it difficult to explain half of the actions in the comic book genre, such as people dressing as bats all the way to their naming conventions of their dual identities to their concept of law and morality etc. Long story short how would Pa being "schizophrenic" qualify as bad writing.
(again, curious what your definition of the disorder is in the first place).

Secondly, I'm confused by your second question. Could you restate it, it does seem interesting if only you were more clear...


Schizophrenic in the common (though admittedly mistaken) colloquial use of the term indicating near Gollum like changes in personality or attitude.

I'll defer to FilmCritHulk on this one, who laid it out pretty well even if I'm not much for his review overall.

FilmCritHulk said:
PERTINENT QUESTION #5

WHAT THE HECK IS GOING ON WITH PA KENT IN THIS MOVIE?

UNDERNEATH ALL OF PA KENT'S RIDICULOUS BACK AND FORTH AND HIS POORLY DRAMATIZED BEHAVIOR THERE IS AN OBVIOUS INTENTION AND IT IS THAT HE BOTH WANTS TO PROTECT HIS SON FROM THE WORLD, WHILE ALSO WANTING HIS SON TO BE A GOOD PERSON. THESE TWO IDEAS ARE IN OBVIOUS CONTENTION AND THE FILM IS TRYING TO RECOGNIZE THAT DIFFICULTY BY SAYING THAT THE DECISION IS TOUGH. SOUNDS PRETTY FAIR, RIGHT?

BUT THE PROBLEM, LIKE MOST THINGS IN THIS MOVIE, COMES DOWN TO DRAMATIZATION. INSTEAD OF FINDING THE GOOD EXAMPLE OF A MORAL GRAY AREA, THEY HAVE PA KENT JUST OSCILLATE BACK AND FORTH ON REALLY OBVIOUS MORAL CHOICES, RENDERING HIM NOTHING MORE THAN A LIMP NOODLE OF AMORAL, INARTICULATE THOUGHT. THIS IS NOT ONLY WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU "TELL, DON'T SHOW," BUT WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU HAVE CHARACTERS SPEAK ON A ETHICAL ISSUE THAT DOESN'T ACTUALLY PLAY INTO THE DRAMA AT HAND. AS A RESULT, PA KENT HONESTLY JUST COMES OFF AS KIND OF INSANE. LOOKING JUST AT WHAT THE MOVIE PRESENTS TO US: WHAT ABOUT HIS SON IMPLIES HE'S NOT A GOOD PERSON? WHAT ABOUT THEIR SITUATION IMPLIES A CRISIS? THE STORY DOES NOT DICTATE ANYTHING.

IT IS PRECISELY THE KIND OF CHARACTER INCONSISTENCY THAT CAN DRAMATICALLY AFFECT THE NARRATIVE, IF YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE IT. FOR INSTANCE, WE ALL NOTICED IT IN PROMETHEUS, WHEN TWO CHARACTERS AFRAID OF THEIR OWN SHADOW ARE SUDDENLY WILLING TO PET A DANGEROUS SPACE SNAKE. THAT'S THE VERY DEFINITION OF CHARACTER INCONSISTENCY (AND EVERY PERSON CLAMORING ABOUT PLOTHOLES SHOULD TURN THEIR ATTENTION TO THAT). BUT THE SAME EXACT THINGS APPLY TO PA KENT'S WEIRD-AS-HELL SPEECHES. THEY TAKE TWO SIDES OF AN IDEA AND JUST APPLY THEM TO A PSYCHOLOGY AND IT SOOOOO DOESN'T WORK.

SURE, KEVIN COSTNER CAN LAY ON FOLKSY DECENCY AS GOOD AS ANYONE, BUT AS FAR AS HULK KNOWS FROM THE EVIDENCE PRESENTED, PA KENT IS BASICALLY A DISTANT FATHER WITH A WEIRD ASPERGIAN-LIKE SENSE OF EMPATHY WHO DELIVERS SOME OF THE MOST MIXED MESSAGES IMAGINABLE, EACH WITH EQUAL STAUNCHNESS. WHICH IS FINE IF THAT WERE SOMEHOW THE POINT, BUT INSTEAD WE WEREN'T MEANT TO FEEL LIKE HE WAS SOMETHING FAR DIFFERENT. WE ARE ACTUALLY SUPPOSED TO CARE ABOUT HIM AND CLARK, WE ARE SUPPOSED TO TREASURE THEIR RELATIONSHIP. BUT WHAT ARE WE ACTUALLY GIVEN TO SUPPORT THAT? WHERE IS THE WARMTH OF THEIR RELATIONSHIP? WHAT IS THEIR BOND? WHAT ABOUT THEIR RELATIONSHIP IS ACTUALLY SUPPOSED TO BE MEANINGFUL TO CLARK?

MOST IMPORTANTLY, WHAT IS SPECIFICALLY LOST WHEN PA KENT DIES BY HANGING OUT IN FRONT OF A TORNADO FOR NO REASON?

IS CLARK REALLY SUPPOSED TO LEARN ANYTHING FROM HIM SACRIFICING HIMSELF TO THE WIND GODS FOR NO REAL REASONS? IF ANYTHING, THE MOVIE ARGUES THAT ALL THAT HAPPENED IS WE HAVE SIMPLY REMOVED THE PERSON WHO DOESN'T WANT CLARK TO HELP PEOPLE... SERIOUSLY... THAT IS THE DRAMATIC PLOT FUNCTION OF PA KENT DYING IN MAN OF STEEL... AND THAT SPEAKS VOLUMES.
 
All that said, can someone please indicate to Beecham and del Toro what the words analog and digital actually mean? I can stomach a lot of garbled technobabble but those are fairly common everyday words.
 
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>>>It feels good to watch an action movie like this that kids can enjoy, without it being too grim and/or too violent. It had a certain "fun factor" and presented real heroes...<<<

100% agree. That's the movie's best part - that it is done with a truly wonderful light touch and has no pretensions that it is SOME SERIOUS EXPLORATION OF THE HUMAN CONDITION... like all the ******** we get in Nolan films. It makes me eyeroll that a film about a man dressing up as a bat is taking itself as seriously as Dostevsky.

Well, I think you CAN seriously explore the human condition in a comic book superhero movie without being pretentious. The first two Nolan Batman films are dark, but they're not so emotionally draining, and grim, and intense that moviegoers commonly complain about feeling exhausted by the end.

But I agree that Pacific Rim strikes the right balance in tone, for the type of characters and story it features.
 
Schizophrenic in the common (though admittedly mistaken) colloquial use of the term indicating near Gollum like changes in personality or attitude.

I'll defer to FilmCritHulk on this one, who laid it out pretty well even if I'm not much for his review overall.

I see, you mean the colloquial use. "Two personalities", or something to that end. Still not sure how that applies to Jon. That man lives on the bible belt. He wants to protect his son and he also wants to serve what he sees as the greater good. A man of conviction that even sacrifices his own life to that end. Had he not wanted to sacrifice himself in that moment, I'd be right there with the malcontents screaming schizo and inconsistent characterization as well. Replace Clark with a young Christ and Jon's actions might appear a little more understandable.

I personally think people are clouding the issue though a layer of preconceptions based on the many takes of the material that have come before.
Looking at Staker Pentacost and his various commands in this film, I don't see him too far out of step with the seemingly conflicting life decisions of Jon Kent. At the start of the film, this moral man orders the heroes to ignore the boat for the greater good(similar to the bus in MOS). Later he has his high scoring adopted daughter sit out fighting in the armageddon due to his sense of fatherly protection. Is this man interested in saving the world or isn't he? Perhaps we should have Hulk explain this to us.

As for what this Hulk character is talking about, I can't help but find things to disagree with him on, such as the dramatization of the father son bond. It can be found in the barn spaceship reveal scene "can I keep being you son" or the father son trope itself.

What's did clark learn form daddy's death? Glad he asked:
First off, Jon didn't tell his son not to help people, he said you have to keep that part of yourself a secret. If you notice, what he did on the bus needed a bit more of a discrete approach, where as what he was doing later was more low key and in drifter mode. Moreover, Jon also said keep your alien god presence a secret till the big joseph campbell calling scene presents itself and the world is ready, Jon knew his boy was sent here for a reason you see... Which brings us to the purpose of the tornado, the scene starts off with Clark in an ideological conflict with Jon, clearly this kid has his own ideas about how to live his life and is starting to doubt in his so called father's discretion, only to have his trust in his father fully cemented. A man that is willing to die for you is worth a good fathers day gift. A brash adolescent Clark walks away from that scene with perhaps a new found respect for his fathers beliefs, ones he puts into practice. The film could have added a few aftermath scenes to communicate this stuff further but I for one think there is something to be said for giving your audience some credit. Maybe too much credit in this case...but I digress, this is clearly the wrong thread.

The Prometheus example: The scientists were scared of the unknown in the cave. Then they happened upon a small snake that appeared non threatening. Sure they acted a little too forth coming, but these people weren't played as hollywood women who are afraid of their own shadow, if anything the could have been afraid of more humanoid zombie things with helmets, guns or xenomorphs even.
Replace the snake thing they found with a Newt and then suggest the premise was inconsistent. To trained biologists, alot of small creatures might not be as threatening as they are to you or I. Again, no reason for them to throw caution to the wind but to suggest people that were lost in a cave all of a sudden lost their consistency cause they found an animal that appeared friendly...obtuse I think.
 
I draw the line at Prometheus, that was laughably groan inducing.

As far as letting earlier notions of a character color my views of the new iteration of the character, there is a thematic and story purpose that Johnathan Kent has served in the past, and they certainly try to have him serve that purpose now, but they fail, pretty badly. Instead of being an inspiration and a voice of conscience his influence is merely an obstacle. He represents a deterrent rather than a motivation. Defeats the entire point.

But hey, this is the Pacific Rim thread.
 
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Obstacle vs "Conscience"
To each his own.

I found Jon's advice after the bully incident particularly insightful.
 
Just saw it today. Man, this movie rocked. How do they do a follow up to this?
 
I went back to see this again last week...something I rarely do, nowadays. The 8 year-old kid in me LOVES this film! You have to accept from the beginning, that it's closer to Godzilla and Mighty Morphin' Power Rangers than it is to Avatar or Aliens. It feels good to watch an action movie like this that kids can enjoy, without it being too grim and/or too violent. It had a certain "fun factor" and presented real heroes...elements that I really felt deprived of after seeing MOS in June. I will probably even go see this a third time...I can't even remember the last time I did that for any movie.

Yeah, it was sort of old fashioned in the way it presented its heroes, more like an 80's movie with them being untouchable but with a bit of modern complexity and vulnerability thrown in there as well.

Overall I just loved the movie we were presented with, GDT has never dissapointed me yet.
 

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