Scott vs. Jean wouldn't have worked.

[Darthphere]

Yeah. X1's Rogue nearly killed Logan. twice. A car wreck knocks him out. Sabretooth knocked him out with one tree swing, and Mags' hitting him against a wall of a train knocked him out. In X2 Deathstrike nearly killed him, and one bullet to the forehead knocked him out. But an omnipotent being who demolecularizes people? He walks right up to her, while being torn apart. Just a little inconsistent. Sorry, but it's lazy, lazy writing. Mags' fall was well-done, though...

Magneto's power was upgraded as well.

 

[Flame on!]

Yeah. X1's Rogue nearly killed Logan. twice. A car wreck knocks him out. Sabretooth knocked him out with one tree swing, and Mags' hitting him against a wall of a train knocked him out. In X2 Deathstrike nearly killed him, and one bullet to the forehead knocked him out. But an omnipotent being who demolecularizes people? He walks right up to her, while being torn apart. Just a little inconsistent. Sorry, but it's lazy, lazy writing. Mags' fall was well-done, though...

I think the scene is very good both visually and emmotionally. Having him burning up and healing whilst walking up to her is more cinematic than having Cyclops just standing there and talking, but yeah, I guess if Jean was totally letting loose he's have no chance.

Though I guess you could argue that Jean was helping him whilst the Phoenix was trying to kill him.

 

[PWN3R]

And worst of all, they took a scene out from HoM! OH NOEZ!

 

[D-scythe]

The question shouldn't be whether Scott in Logan's place woulda worked, it should be why on earth would these people think Logan in Scott's place would work.

The whole final Logan/Jean scene, while visually outstanding, sucked and made no sense from the context of anything X-men. The only thing that made it X-man was their powers - if you changed that, neither would be recognizably Jean or Logan.

It was just filmed fanfiction, IMO.

 

[Daniella]

I thought it was kewl that Scott (and later Logan) had that telepathic link with Jean, it shows that they are connected. I kinda wish that Jean would say more about her "sensing Scott" so she (and the audience) knows that maybe she did or did not kill him.

Scott would have been killed if they played that scenario at the end of trying to stop Phoenix. However, the writers could have altered her destructive power into shooting flames or something (and not have the whole democularization), in order to have Scott save Jean. Something like the animated series, which was awesome in portraying the Phoenix saga...I don't know, something along those likes would have worked for Scott.

When Wolverine started to have a link with Jean ?

Show me, because they NEVER hand a link if I remember right... IF THEY HAD, why Wolverine wasn't hearing her voice too ?

Jean had a link with Scott, ONLY !!!

Dany

 

[DarknessOfDeath]

I don't think it was a link...She was telepathically ... in his mind.. not sure how to say that...lol sorry.

Like how in x1, Wolvie could hear Xavier in his mind.... after his encounter with Dr. Jean Grey in the infirmary. lol

 

[The Batman]

no wonder you guys arent writers, lol....

they totally couldve written it different if it were cyclops. in fact they probably couldve fit cyke in at the end. but they didnt. because they have no imagination.

And by the way, its funny that cyclops fans are supposed to accept that their character got limited screentime....again. Some fans of the comics accept everything the writers throw at them, even if it goes against the characters, and some strive for something better. its just the way it is.

 

[undomiel]

When Wolverine started to have a link with Jean ?

Show me, because they NEVER hand a link if I remember right... IF THEY HAD, why Wolverine wasn't hearing her voice too ?

Jean had a link with Scott, ONLY !!!

Dany

Jean spoke to Logan while he was visiting Xavier's grave. She called out his name, just as she called out to Scott before he left for Alkali Lake.

 

[Daniella]

Okay, I remember now... but a LINK with wolvie ? Come on...

Dany

 

[Yve]

Scott would have been killed if they played that scenario at the end of trying to stop Phoenix. However, the writers could have altered her destructive power into shooting flames or something (and not have the whole democularization), in order to have Scott save Jean. Something like the animated series, which was awesome in portraying the Phoenix saga...I don't know, something along those likes would have worked for Scott.

They probably wanted to avoid the whole Phoenix/Flame thing because of Pyro. The general audience might have gotten confused by it.

 

[AVP82]

Okay, I remember now... but a LINK with wolvie ? Come on...

Dany

What's wrong with using "link"? She connected with him and Logan saw where she was. She didn't connect with Storm or the others.

 

[DarknessOfDeath]

erm she only contacted Logan...to let her know where she was... ...

 

[DACrowe]

As mentioned this could be fixed by a rewrite.

How about this:

Both Cyke and Logan are there. Magneto orders her to destroy the X-Men when they have the upperhand (in a much more ferocious battle than the tongue and cheek camp fight full of one-liners and no suspense that we got) and she sees Scott and can't do it. He grows angry and starts launching cars with Pyro which Cyke and Iceman stop and he is defeated. Jean goes ape**** on everyone and the only ones trying to stop her are Wolverine and Cyclops.

She tears Logan apart and he falls back but Scott marches forward. She threatens and hisses but he challenges her saying "I know you won't hurt me" (which is true to the original Dark Pheonex Saga, she couldn't kill him) and walks past her wind and flames (there should have been flames!) and stares her up and talks her down. She comes back to normalcy, if only for a moment and begs for him to finish her, he says he can't. She removes his visor and says Scott to open his eyes. She begs him to, before she loses control. Tears roll down his cheek as he hears her firing up and giving in again. He says "I love you Jean, forgive me!" and he opens his eyes and it is a full unfiltered optic blast.

There is nothing left but him on the rubble with his eyes clinched shut as he cries and Logan watches broken but in awe of what happened.

There I just wrote a better scene than what we got by merely relying on better characterization and just not cool sfx. Wow, hard....not really (not for this scene anyway).

 

[AVP82]

They probably wanted to avoid the whole Phoenix/Flame thing because of Pyro. The general audience might have gotten confused by it.

Yeah, perhaps. But I still would have liked to have seen it.

 

[AVP82]

The question shouldn't be whether Scott in Logan's place woulda worked, it should be why on earth would these people think Logan in Scott's place would work.

The whole final Logan/Jean scene, while visually outstanding, sucked and made no sense from the context of anything X-men. The only thing that made it X-man was their powers - if you changed that, neither would be recognizably Jean or Logan.

It was just filmed fanfiction, IMO.

What's wrong with that?

 

[Latin_Princess1]

It Doesnt Matter Cuz Cyke Has To Come Bak In The Next Movie!!!

 

[thealiasman2000]

When it comes to comic book movies, fanboys are NEVER pleased.

If batman is dark then he is too dark, if Batman is light then he is not dark enough.

If a movie is true to the comics then they accuse it of being completely unoriginal, if it's based on it they accuse it of being nothing like the comic.

If the Hulk is CGI they say it is too fake looking and that CGI doesn't work, if he's not CGI they say it doesn't look real enough and that it would be better with CGI.

The fact is Brett Ratner did his best to be as true to the comics as possible. But there are some things that fans envision that just can't please everyone.

 

[sundaycall]

I THINK....and this might just be me, that keeping Cyclops in the frame until the final battle COULD have worked very well both in terms of drama and the character archs of both Scott, Logan and even Jean.

The thing with Logan in this movie, was his love for jean, and his initiation as a leader of the group rather than an outsider, Cyclops is the natural leader, in the first movie (although that shot he took paid off on liberty island) he has capable of making the tough decision, the difficult choice for the greater good.

What I would have found more compelling was if in this film Scott and Logan's affections for jean were in more direct competition and indeed confrontation about what needed to be done about the presence of Phoenix (I think having Cyclops standing on Xavier's side when Logan confronts him in X3, based on Scott's knowledge from the previous film that Jean's powers were slipping out of her control, would have made for a very interesting watch.)

Anyway eventually having Logan being capable of standing as a fully fledged team member and leader during the final battle, but unable to make the necessary sacrifice by killing jean could have added a lot more weight to what was a pretty thin contribution, however having Cyclops step forward as the man and true leader (which he always should have been portrayed as) to take down the ultimate threat and take the heart breaking decision would have again added a bit more muscle to the proceedings if handled correctly.

I think the way things played out in the final battle were good, satisfying even, but with a bit more time could have really given fans something to champion, and make the third film a real revelation.

 

[AVP82]

I would have prefered Logan and Scott working together to get Jean back. That would be more satisfying (to me at least).

 

[martinbluther]

When it comes to comic book movies, fanboys are NEVER pleased.

If batman is dark then he is too dark, if Batman is light then he is not dark enough.

If a movie is true to the comics then they accuse it of being completely unoriginal, if it's based on it they accuse it of being nothing like the comic.

If the Hulk is CGI they say it is too fake looking and that CGI doesn't work, if he's not CGI they say it doesn't look real enough and that it would be better with CGI.

The fact is Brett Ratner did his best to be as true to the comics as possible. But there are some things that fans envision that just can't please everyone.

You're right when you say that fans are never pleased, not all of them, anyway, but those that stay basically true to the characters please the fans of the books, and Spiderman, and the earlier Xfilms are great examples. Batman Begins and the first two Bat films of the 80's are great examples... this? not so much, imo. Were there complaints? Sure. Were they this vociferous and widespread among fans who saw these earlier movies multiple times? I don't think so.

 

[Darthphere]

Honestly, I wouldve preferred jean not being in the movie at all and waiting for Singer to possibly do it the way he planned.

 

[martinbluther]

I would have prefered Logan and Scott working together to get Jean back. That would be more satisfying (to me at least).

that would sure have beaten what we got... Wolvy=deity

 

[HailtotheKing]

As mentioned this could be fixed by a rewrite.

How about this:

Both Cyke and Logan are there. Magneto orders her to destroy the X-Men when they have the upperhand (in a much more ferocious battle than the tongue and cheek camp fight full of one-liners and no suspense that we got) and she sees Scott and can't do it. He grows angry and starts launching cars with Pyro which Cyke and Iceman stop and he is defeated. Jean goes ape**** on everyone and the only ones trying to stop her are Wolverine and Cyclops.

She tears Logan apart and he falls back but Scott marches forward. She threatens and hisses but he challenges her saying "I know you won't hurt me" (which is true to the original Dark Pheonex Saga, she couldn't kill him) and walks past her wind and flames (there should have been flames!) and stares her up and talks her down. She comes back to normalcy, if only for a moment and begs for him to finish her, he says he can't. She removes his visor and says Scott to open his eyes. She begs him to, before she loses control. Tears roll down his cheek as he hears her firing up and giving in again. He says "I love you Jean, forgive me!" and he opens his eyes and it is a full unfiltered optic blast.

There is nothing left but him on the rubble with his eyes clinched shut as he cries and Logan watches broken but in awe of what happened.

There I just wrote a better scene than what we got by merely relying on better characterization and just not cool sfx. Wow, hard....not really (not for this scene anyway).

That is exactly how I thought it should have gone as well. They could have even made Jean enhance Cyclops' optic blast so there was an even greater chance she would be destroyed instantly. Also, when she is destroyed I think there should have been a bright flash and a big ass fiery phoenix should have appeared and then evaporated in the sky.

 

[Darthphere]

As mentioned this could be fixed by a rewrite.

How about this:

Both Cyke and Logan are there. Magneto orders her to destroy the X-Men when they have the upperhand (in a much more ferocious battle than the tongue and cheek camp fight full of one-liners and no suspense that we got) and she sees Scott and can't do it. He grows angry and starts launching cars with Pyro which Cyke and Iceman stop and he is defeated. Jean goes ape**** on everyone and the only ones trying to stop her are Wolverine and Cyclops.

She tears Logan apart and he falls back but Scott marches forward. She threatens and hisses but he challenges her saying "I know you won't hurt me" (which is true to the original Dark Pheonex Saga, she couldn't kill him) and walks past her wind and flames (there should have been flames!) and stares her up and talks her down. She comes back to normalcy, if only for a moment and begs for him to finish her, he says he can't. She removes his visor and says Scott to open his eyes. She begs him to, before she loses control. Tears roll down his cheek as he hears her firing up and giving in again. He says "I love you Jean, forgive me!" and he opens his eyes and it is a full unfiltered optic blast.

There is nothing left but him on the rubble with his eyes clinched shut as he cries and Logan watches broken but in awe of what happened.

There I just wrote a better scene than what we got by merely relying on better characterization and just not cool sfx. Wow, hard....not really (not for this scene anyway).

No offense, but thats still pretty cheesy.

 

[thealiasman2000]

1-Proof that BB isn't perfect: I didn't like it.

Proof that Burton's movies aren' perfect either: I'm the only fanboy that DID like it.

2-Don't be too quick to champion the Spider-Man series as the ultimate fanboy pleaser.

It seems that, for part 3, they are cramming Sandman, Man-Wolf, Goblin II, The Lizard and Venom all in one movie.

3-No movie can be 100 % true to the comics, specially when we are talking superheroes.

There are story arcs and details that don't work well in a movie.