Homecoming **SPOILERS*** What issues did you have with the film?

[Venom 1988]

Saw this movie Yesterday my issues with this movie are:

1- This movie could have been called Iron Man 4: Guest Staring Spider-Man.

You mean Iron Man 5 since Captain America: Civil War was clearly Iron Man 4

 

[UltimateWebhead]

I hope they eventually cast someone to show us a flashback scene or two. I don't need a full origin by any means, but just something. What I think this film was missing that really would have helped, was just a bit more of the sense of loss that Peter should be dealing with. And I didn't feel that as much as I would have liked. This kid just lost his only father figure less than a year ago. We needed to see the after effects of that. Just a bit more of the emotion that Peter showed Ned when getting him to back off on his idea of Telling May. Or heck, having one of the reasons that Liz is being so accepting of Pete's flakiness be because she knows that he just lost Uncle Ben. Have the Vulture reference that Peter's already lost someone, and he'll take even more people away. Etc.

We just needed to feel that loss a bit more.

And this is what I'm hoping for as well. I like how Ben was still apart of Homecoming but imo it was entirely too subtle for my tastes. At least one more dramatic scene or referencing Ben by name would have done enough of a job to make his importance to Peter felt more by the audience. Yes, everyone and their mom knows the origin story at this point but that's not a good excuse for leaving Ben by the side. He's the reason and driving force as to why Peter becomes Spider-Man. I think a great way to show flashbacks or whatever is by having Pete and May talk about how everything started since May pretty much knows now that Peter is Spider-Man. I've always loved how TSSM referenced the origin via flashback in the episode Intervention. If anything, this should be the template for how to creatively approach that subject.

Well you have a point there. As far as my personal preferences go, it's really awkward that they introduced a 15 year old Spiderman in the Civil War battle so I still don't like it, but I do see your point.

I still wish they hadn't had Peter vlog during the battle though. I know it's technically just small thing but that definitely makes him seem like an airhead and made me dislike this Peter from the beginning of the movie. Infact most of the vlog stuff in the beginning made him pretty obnoxious. And I don't mind that Peter is starstruck by Tony, but what I do mind is how obsessed Peter is with him. The way he had sent a barrage of texts without answer and still kept sending messages made him more of a weirdo than a likable relatable person

I think those are perfectly legitimate reasons not to like the character. To be clear, I don't mean that your reasons for liking him are any less legitimate. In the end it's subjective and we don't have to agree

And for the record, I'm very much ok with us disagreeing on the topic. I'm not trying to change your view. I'm only trying to give you my perspective. If you learn something or if I do, then great. I'd think this place would be very boring if everyone were in agreement. That said, I see where you are coming from...I just don't agree with it.

I don't think Peter is dumb. The film does a good job of showing us Peter is very smart. He's just inexperienced at the hero gig, therefore mistakes are made despite his good intentions. I equate this with my job. I've been in my job for over 15 years. I'm experienced and rarely make errors but there was a time I did. And I see that same learning curve with the newbies. They come into the job wanting to do a good job, to do the right thing, but they often make mistakes. Not because they're dumb, it's because they're undertaking a job that is difficult and requires lots of repetition. Especially when in this field, no two things are exactly the same. There's lots of variation in the types of work you encounter.

That's the best I can explain it. I'd have more of an issue with these things if Peter had been Spider-Man for years and/or was older. I think as we progress through these films we'll see him develop into a more confident hero.

 

[Oscorp]

Homecoming is pretty much perfect in my opinion. The only minor gripes I have are:

-The CGI lacked a bit at parts.
-The overuse of the word "awesome".

Other than that I can't think of any other flaws as of now. Some people think the action is weak but I honestly liked it a lot. It wasn't flashy for the sake of being flashy. It felt real, which I prefer. Raimi still reigns supreme in the action department though.

 

[CosmicSpider]

Overall amazing film.
Couple minor gripes for now:
-Spidey AI suit
-MJ reveal. Would have preferred they made it ambiguous.
-Tony and Pepper back together with no explanation

 

[Themanofbat]

10 - Where's Mary Jane? Peter's actual first love.

Firstly, if you think "Mary Jane is Peter's first love" you need to read a damned comic book.

His high school era love interest is Liz Allen.
His first real LOVE was Gwen Stacey, whom he doesn't meet until university.
Around the same time he met Harry.

I'm going to refrain from saying "you need to read a damn comic" because I find it quite rude.
However, if you actually read the original ASM comics, you'll see that by the end of issue #7, his first REAL love is Betty Brant.

Just my opinion. Peace.

 

[Kev4000]

Movie is a great 9/10 to be. The only issue I have is: Why the AVengers stuff moving to the North? Except Vision, no one is there anymore, right?

 

[Tymminator]

I'm not even sure if I can take some of these complaints seriously...

I can't take it seriously and doubt they saw it. It's the same complaints I heard before the movie even came out.

Saying it should be "Ironman guest starring Spider-man" is something that can't even be sensibly argued for by anyone who saw the film. It would be like Ironman 2 being called "Nick Fury guest staring Ironman".

 

[Syncos]

I'm going to refrain from saying "you need to read a damn comic" because I find it quite rude.
However, if you actually read the original ASM comics, you'll see that by the end of issue #7, his first REAL love is Betty Brant.

Just my opinion. Peace.

I'm well aware of Betty. I don't think Peter's relationship with Betty can be compared to the kind of love he had for Gwen or Mary Jane.

I'm more referring to a "true love" status. Gwen before she died was the one But then for like 20 years, all everyone ever heard about was MJ. They even sorta gave Mary Jane the same "death" as Gwen in the 90s animated series.

 

[Themanofbat]

I'm well aware of Betty. I don't think Peter's relationship with Betty can be compared to the kind of love he had for Gwen or Mary Jane.

Cool... I'm not going to quantify "love", but in those early issues, especially ASM #11 & 12, you can clearly see Peter being head over heels about Betty... So to me, Betty was his first "love", and I get that it paled in comparison to what followed with Gwen and then MJ.

I'm more referring to a "true love" status. Gwen before she died was the one But then for like 20 years, all everyone ever heard about was MJ. They even sorta gave Mary Jane the same "death" as Gwen in the 90s animated series.

Yeah. It's funny though how throughout the years, they've raised MJ's status as the one with retcons/reveals about the past, etc... though I get why the writers/editors would do that because at some point, Gwen became more "meaningless" (for lack of a better word" to the readers except the old troops.

I know she gets referenced in flashbacks, and alternate Gwens have appeared, and Peter gets "weird", which must even be more "weird' to newer readers.

In any event, I hear ya about Gwen being the first "true" love.

Though in my opinion, Stan wrote her into a corner with her father's death, because in those issues afterwards, she was just all two-dimensional "I hate Spider-Man for my father's death" ad nauseum, gone to London, cool trip to the Savage Land, and then BAM! Gerry Conway does the unthinkable probably more because he didn't know what to do with her (I keep hearing Romita Sr was pushing hard for that story too, who knows)

Cheers.

 

[Spider-Gnome]

Cool... I'm not going to quantify "love", but in those early issues, especially ASM #11 & 12, you can clearly see Peter being head over heels about Betty... So to me, Betty was his first "love", and I get that it paled in comparison to what followed with Gwen and then MJ.



Yeah. It's funny though how throughout the years, they've raised MJ's status as the one with retcons/reveals about the past, etc... though I get why the writers/editors would do that because at some point, Gwen became more "meaningless" (for lack of a better word" to the readers except the old troops.

I know she gets referenced in flashbacks, and alternate Gwens have appeared, and Peter gets "weird", which must even be more "weird' to newer readers.

In any event, I hear ya about Gwen being the first "true" love.

Though in my opinion, Stan wrote her into a corner with her father's death, because in those issues afterwards, she was just all two-dimensional "I hate Spider-Man for my father's death" ad nauseum, gone to London, cool trip to the Savage Land, and then BAM! Gerry Conway does the unthinkable probably more because he didn't know what to do with her (I keep hearing Romita Sr was pushing hard for that story too, who knows)

Cheers.

Hey, Bats!

Not sure if you posted it already, but did you see Homecoming and if you did, as a longtime fan, I'd be interested in what you thought.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

Cool... I'm not going to quantify "love", but in those early issues, especially ASM #11 & 12, you can clearly see Peter being head over heels about Betty... So to me, Betty was his first "love", and I get that it paled in comparison to what followed with Gwen and then MJ.



Yeah. It's funny though how throughout the years, they've raised MJ's status as the one with retcons/reveals about the past, etc... though I get why the writers/editors would do that because at some point, Gwen became more "meaningless" (for lack of a better word" to the readers except the old troops.

I know she gets referenced in flashbacks, and alternate Gwens have appeared, and Peter gets "weird", which must even be more "weird' to newer readers.

In any event, I hear ya about Gwen being the first "true" love.

Though in my opinion, Stan wrote her into a corner with her father's death, because in those issues afterwards, she was just all two-dimensional "I hate Spider-Man for my father's death" ad nauseum, gone to London, cool trip to the Savage Land, and then BAM! Gerry Conway does the unthinkable probably more because he didn't know what to do with her (I keep hearing Romita Sr was pushing hard for that story too, who knows)

Cheers.

I think he knew what to do with her once he took over the book. Gerry's been quoted as saying the only thing that makes Gwen interesting is her death. Here's some quotes from his book:

"For me, destiny already announced Peter's soulmate the day Mary Jane Watson appeared on his doorstep. [She was] so obviously right for him I always assumed Peter's relationship with Gwen was just a temporary diversion from the true path fate had laid out for him."

On Gwen Stacy: “She was a nonentity, a pretty face. She brought nothing to the mix. It made no sense to me that Peter Parker would end up with a babe like that who had no problems."

"Only a damaged person would end up with a damaged guy like Peter Parker. And Gwen Stacy was perfect! It was basically Stan fulfilling Stan’s own fantasy. Stan married a woman who was pretty much a babe," Conway continued. "Joan Lee was a very attractive blond who was obviously Stan’s ideal female. And I think Gwen was simply Stan replicating his wife, just like Sue Storm was a replication of his wife. And that’s where his blind spot was. The amazing thing was that he created a character like Mary Jane Watson, who was probably the most interesting female character in comics, and he never used her to the extent that he could have. Instead of Peter Parker’s girlfriend, he made her Peter Parker’s best friend’s girlfriend. Which is so wrong, and so stupid, and such a waste. So killing Gwen was a totally logical if not inevitable choice.”

 

[Themanofbat]

I think he knew what to do with her once he took over the book. Gerry's been quoted as saying the only thing that makes Gwen interesting is her death. Here's some quotes from his book:

"For me, destiny already announced Peter's soulmate the day Mary Jane Watson appeared on his doorstep. [She was] so obviously right for him I always assumed Peter's relationship with Gwen was just a temporary diversion from the true path fate had laid out for him."

On Gwen Stacy: “She was a nonentity, a pretty face. She brought nothing to the mix. It made no sense to me that Peter Parker would end up with a babe like that who had no problems."

"Only a damaged person would end up with a damaged guy like Peter Parker. And Gwen Stacy was perfect! It was basically Stan fulfilling Stan’s own fantasy. Stan married a woman who was pretty much a babe," Conway continued. "Joan Lee was a very attractive blond who was obviously Stan’s ideal female. And I think Gwen was simply Stan replicating his wife, just like Sue Storm was a replication of his wife. And that’s where his blind spot was. The amazing thing was that he created a character like Mary Jane Watson, who was probably the most interesting female character in comics, and he never used her to the extent that he could have. Instead of Peter Parker’s girlfriend, he made her Peter Parker’s best friend’s girlfriend. Which is so wrong, and so stupid, and such a waste. So killing Gwen was a totally logical if not inevitable choice.”

I dunno. Easy for him to say years later. I'm not sure he was that insightful at 19 back in '73.
But what do I know lol

 

[Themanofbat]

Hey, Bats!

Not sure if you posted it already, but did you see Homecoming and if you did, as a longtime fan, I'd be interested in what you thought.

I liked it quite a bit... 8/10
I thought it was "too" funny, and while I didn't like some aspects of his insecurities, they really make sense and I feel they finally got the kid "right".

The future looks bright.

 

[Mr.T]

Finally, had a chance to watch it again and loved it even more. It's the most entertaining movie of the year for me (so far). I still have a problem with the Vulture's Sunday morning cruise onto Stark's cargo jet. Just too easy for such important stuff...

 

[Schlosser85]

Iron Man is in it like ten minutes but it's Iron Man 4?

 

[ironwez20]

Yea if you watched the movie you'd know this is far from an iron man 4 movie and if it was i'd be disappointed that it focused on peter/spiderman the majority of the film.

 

[NotSoLongAgo]

Iron Man is in it like ten minutes but it's Iron Man 4?

Less than that even

 

[Spider-Gnome]

I liked it quite a bit... 8/10
I thought it was "too" funny, and while I didn't like some aspects of his insecurities, they really make sense and I feel they finally got the kid "right".

The future looks bright.

Glad to hear!

 

[AnneFan]

http://www.cbr.com/spider-man-2-is-...Distribution&utm_campaign=CBR-FB-P&view=lista

sums it up

Spot on article.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

I dunno. Easy for him to say years later. I'm not sure he was that insightful at 19 back in '73.
But what do I know lol

Hindsight is 20/20 I suppose but Gerry has always been rather smart about things. He did a great job writing ASM at that age--it's probably pretty accurate to his feelings at the time.

I liked it quite a bit... 8/10
I thought it was "too" funny, and while I didn't like some aspects of his insecurities, they really make sense and I feel they finally got the kid "right".

The future looks bright.

So glad you liked Homecoming.

 

[LaughterLives]

The Urkel schtick was that grating.

It was to me.

 

[auditor]

I do not want aunt may to know that he is Spider-Man. You guys think there is any chance he can just play it off like he wanted to wear this costume? She didnt see him using his powers.

 

[Grootster]

I do not want aunt may to know that he is Spider-Man. You guys think there is any chance he can just play it off like he wanted to wear this costume? She didnt see him using his powers.

It would be funny if he were able to pass it off as a fake Spider-man costume to her, lol.

"But Aunt May, they were having a sale on Spider-man cosplay down at the costume store!"

 

[metaphysician]

I do not want aunt may to know that he is Spider-Man. You guys think there is any chance he can just play it off like he wanted to wear this costume? She didnt see him using his powers.

No, because that's a terrible idea. It makes May into an idiot, all for the sake of. . . nothing.

 

[Shikamaru]

I only have two major issues.

The first is the comedy in the first act. It gives the film a generic feel similar to a lot of the subpar Marvel films (Ant-Man, Doctor Strange, etc.). After the first act it just dissapears. Honestly, maybe I felt this way due to the marketing since most of the footage Sony showed was from that first act. I'm hoping I have a better impression of it on a second viewing.

The second is the lack of Uncle Ben references. Since Vulture in this is practically an evil Uncle Ben, and tries to get Peter to understand his worldview, it's just a missed opportunity to not do parallels between Toomes and Ben. At least direct parallels. There's plenty of indirect ones via Peter as a Ben proxy.

All my other issues are just nitpicks. I'll say I don't care for their MJ yet, but I'll give them a chance to see what they do with it. Surprisingly they sold me on the AI suit so it's possible they can sell me on her too.