Star Trek Into Darkness - Part 6

[Soapy]

Is it really that hard to accept flaws in the older films? Really?

You said it yourself:

Not a big deal.

It's not a matter of not being able to accept flaws in films, it's a matter of the flaw you're picking apart is so damn minor... who cares?

And I'm not even one of these people that put Wrath of Khan on a giant pedestal.

 

[Loki882]

So, JJ dropped a not so subtle hint that Rupert Wyatt (Rise of the Planet of the Apes) may direct ST 3, which would be a great choice imo, thoughts?

 

[Picard Sisko]

Is it really that hard to accept flaws in the older films? Really?

Its a minor flaw in the script that is easily fixed with a little bit of imagination. Its not about having a hard time accepting flaws. I accept and acknowledge that its a flaw, but as I'm watching I come up with my own little explanation for why Khan remembers Chekov.

You said it yourself:

It's not a matter of not being able to accept flaws in films, it's a matter of the flaw you're picking apart is so damn minor... who cares?

 

[Picard Sisko]

So, JJ dropped a not so subtle hint that Rupert Wyatt (Rise of the Planet of the Apes) may direct ST 3, which would be a great choice imo, thoughts?

I loved Rise of the Planet of the Apes, so this is exciting news!

 

[C. Lee]

My wife and I watched it again tonight...still great......

 

[The Chris]

Watched this again with my family, we love it still. We love what this team has done with Trek. Especially my father. He's been watching Trek since he was younger and he talked about how he loved how they played with The most memorable scenes from Wrath of Khan and found another meaning to it, and he loves how the characters have their own identities and their own feelings but they are still the people that we knew and loved from the series and first 6 films. Cumberbatch as Khan really impressed, especially considering how he doesn't really look like the original Khan at all but that doesn't matter because the talent and performance is so strong. Now when it comes to Trek yeah I love exploration and yeah I love philosophical topics and things like that but it's usually the television shows that I go to for that. It's always been the fun films in the film series that I liked the most, where intelligent themes and social statements were there but they were less obvious and hidden within awesome entertainment and I think Star Trek 09 and Star Trek Into Darkness are no different in that regard. There's just more bang now for our bucks. The one thing I always remember from the original series is that it entertained the hell out of me, and it gave me characters that I love, and that is still the deal for me with these new films.

 

[AndrewGilkison]

I said on this forum that I thought all the speculation about Harrison being Khan was nuts. Obviously I was wrong.

It doesn't make any sense though. How the hell did Khan go from looking like Richardo Montalban to looking and sounding like a white British dude? The movie never explained it at all, and it seemed like the main reason Cumberbatch was cast in the role was in order to hide the character in the marketing and trailers, which falls flat for me because why should I get excited over Khan being in the movie when the actor playing him doesn't remotely look or talk like him? Kind of defeats the purpose of having him in the movie in the first place.

 

[rashad]

Paramount needs a swift kick in the rear for how they butchered the Special Features on the Blu-ray.

That being said, this movie was amazing. I loved every minute of it. Hopefully the wait isn't that long for the next one.

 

[The Navigator]

I said on this forum that I thought all the speculation about Harrison being Khan was nuts. Obviously I was wrong.

It doesn't make any sense though. How the hell did Khan go from looking like Richardo Montalban to looking and sounding like a white British dude? The movie never explained it at all, and it seemed like the main reason Cumberbatch was cast in the role was in order to hide the character in the marketing and trailers, which falls flat for me because why should I get excited over Khan being in the movie when the actor playing him doesn't remotely look or talk like him? Kind of defeats the purpose of having him in the movie in the first place.

I read one theory that since he was put into Starfleet by Admiral Marcus, and presumably Khan is a pretty infamous holdover from the Eugenics Wars, he got reconstructive surgery to not be recognized?

Or Benedict Cumberbatch is a great actor and Ricardo Montalban was also not Indian, so...

 

[wobbly]

I read one theory that since he was put into Starfleet by Admiral Marcus, and presumably Khan is a pretty infamous holdover from the Eugenics Wars, he got reconstructive surgery to not be recognized?

Or Benedict Cumberbatch is a great actor and Ricardo Montalban was also not Indian, so...

In TOS Kirk & Co certainly knew of Khan prior to Space Seed (even expressed a little admiration for him, much to Spock's bemusement), so it doesn't hurt for us assume he was given a surgical makeover by Marcus so he could go about completely unrecognised. Given his reputation, I guess he might be a comaparable figure to Hitler for notoreity, so not an ideal candidate to have running covert ops while wandering around Starfleet undisguised.

They could have thrown in just a little exposition to cover it though (a line or 2 of dialogue when Khan is recounting his tale to Kirk and going on about 'what would you be willing to do for your family' would have done it).

Not a huge deal for me though, one way or another.

 

[jonathancrane]

It is an alternative universe; they are allowed to create their own iteration(s) of characters and scenarios. The original series is still canon; for comic books, this notion of dual continuities is nothing new.

 

[Picard Sisko]

I said on this forum that I thought all the speculation about Harrison being Khan was nuts. Obviously I was wrong.

It doesn't make any sense though. How the hell did Khan go from looking like Richardo Montalban to looking and sounding like a white British dude? The movie never explained it at all, and it seemed like the main reason Cumberbatch was cast in the role was in order to hide the character in the marketing and trailers, which falls flat for me because why should I get excited over Khan being in the movie when the actor playing him doesn't remotely look or talk like him? Kind of defeats the purpose of having him in the movie in the first place.

The film takes place over 300 years into the future, so we can easily assume that he was given cosmetic surgery in addition to a name change to conceal his identity. And although he has a British accent, he has similar speech patterns to Ricardo Montalban's Khan. I can picture Cumberbatch speaking all of his lines in ST2: Wrath of Khan.

I read one theory that since he was put into Starfleet by Admiral Marcus, and presumably Khan is a pretty infamous holdover from the Eugenics Wars, he got reconstructive surgery to not be recognized?

 

[Loki882]

So, Khan and Adm. Marcus attacked the Klingons. Could Star Trek 3
s plot be a full-scale war between the Federation and the Klingon Empire? Call it Star Trek: The Shattered Peace.

 

[Soapy]

It is an alternative universe; they are allowed to create their own iteration(s) of characters and scenarios. The original series is still canon; for comic books, this notion of dual continuities is nothing new.

The problem with this line of thinking is that only things after Nero went back in time should be affected because that's where the split occurs. Khan was around way before then.

For the record I don't even care that much. I buy the "Khan got plastic surgery" theory. But not explaining his dramatically different appearance when it could have very easily been explained is one of the many valid criticisms of the sloppy writing in this movie.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Khan explains that Admiral Marcus tried to conceal his identity by giving him the name, "John Harrison," but it would have been great if he discussed getting cosmetic surgery to change his appearance as well, or perhaps mentioned his Indian heritage.

 

[Loki882]

It would have been nice to get a line or to, but it's ultimately not THAT big a deal, so I could role with it. Benicio del Toro and Edgar Ramirez were JJ's preferred choices, so clearly he wanted a darker skinned actor. They couldn't do it, and a fantastic actor like Cumberbatch was interested, so JJ chose him, fine by me.

 

[Nathan]

I watched this recently, and I enjoyed it a lot. Benedict Cumberbatch was just awesome as Khan. Loved watching him kick all that Klingon ass.

 

[GremlinZilla89]

This whole "Khan isn't Indian" thing is so stupid. Who gives a crap? His nationality isn't about zero percent important to the character. Not once in Space Seed nor Wrath is his nationality even made clear, let alone focused on.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

I get what's being said about Khan's physical appearance but if you're complaining about that then what about Pike looking different than he did on TOS? They're using different actors. Everybody looks different. Not everything needs an explanation.

Unless they got the science wrong and it was an already established alternate reality even before Nero arrived /nerdwank

 

[Hush]

Got my amazon Blu-ray today and can't wait to watch in Glorious HD, also my phaser is awesome.

 

[MrMaooz]

I watched this recently, and I enjoyed it a lot. Benedict Cumberbatch was just awesome as Khan. Loved watching him kick all that Klingon ass.

That fight on Qronos was so awesome.

 

[Nathan]

What actually happened to the red shirts that went down to the planet? When I saw them, at first I thought "You guys are goners.", but when Kirk ordered them to take off the shirts, I thought "Hey, you guys might make it after all.". But once all hell broke loose, you never see them again. You don't even see them get killed. They are just gone.

 

[Soapy]

Shhhh... you shouldn't point out flaws in the movie. People don't like that.

 

[GremlinZilla89]

Shhhh... you shouldn't point out flaws in the movie. People don't like that.

Nah, what Nathan said is fine. It's the incessant and hypocritical whining some people don't like.

 

[danoyse]

What actually happened to the red shirts that went down to the planet? When I saw them, at first I thought "You guys are goners.", but when Kirk ordered them to take off the shirts, I thought "Hey, you guys might make it after all.". But once all hell broke loose, you never see them again. You don't even see them get killed. They are just gone.

Yeah, I noticed that too. And one of those guys was Cupcake, the guy Kirk fought with in the first movie. He's even listed that way in the credits.