The Joker Thread - Part 1

Eddie Dean said:
I take all those kind of statements with a heavy grain of salt. Ethan Hawke is now voicing Batman in a talking cars toddler show.
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That don't mean they'd cast someone like Penn Badgley as Joker or whoever.
 
The Lazarus Pit said:
You arguing that Killing Joke isn’t one of the definitive Joker stories? What? Dude said it’s arguably the definitive story and he is 100% correct on that.

TKJ movie sucked but the book with the OG colors is an all timer
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”Definitive” is subjective with art. There is no such thing. Only to that individual. I didn’t argue against it being one of the definitive stories or a classic to people. I argued against it being arguably THE definitive story. How can he be 100 percent correct about something so subjective?
 
Look, I love the artwork in TKJ as much as the next guy. But I'm sick and tired of it being used or suggested for everything like it's the only Joker story to ever exist.

The only thing I'd like borrowed from there is the idea of the future Joker as the original Red Hood. But even then.... I'd rather they do it like they did in Zero Year.

No possibly sympathetic backstory, no nervous timid guy before he was The Joker, none of that. Just the unnamed leader of a murderous gang who mysteriously disappears and comes back as a version of The Joker.
 
The Lazarus Pit said:
CLJ is the obvious choice for his age group. I think he should be at the top of Reeves’ list along with Poulter
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Is that Will Poulter? If so, he's an interesting choice, but still a pass for me. I couldn't stand him in Midsommar lol
 
I'm gonna have to pass on Caleb only because if they go the prosthetics route, I don't think I'd want his features all covered up.
 
shauner111 said:
”Definitive” is subjective with art. There is no such thing. Only to that individual. I didn’t argue against it being one of the definitive stories or a classic to people. I argued against it being arguably THE definitive story. How can he be 100 percent correct about something so subjective?
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I'm not trying to be rude whatsoever, so don't take this the wrong way, but you seem to be arguing with yourself here.

I never said that TKJ was THE definitive Joker story. I said it was arguably the definitive Joker story, meaning if you asked every single person even remotely familiar with the comics, most (not all) of them would likely cite the TKJ as the version of Joker they deem to be the definitive version, a theory which other posters agree with, and which I supported by suggesting you do a web search on the most definitive Joker story to see what results you come up with. Whether or not my subjective opinion is that TKJ is THE definitive Joker is not what's being argued here.
 
I'd possibly agree if they didn't lean too much on him being a broken family man. It's a great idea for A character but not the best angle to go with Joker. I want him to be the most frightening guy in the room; you can't exactly accomplish that if you heavily imply he used to be an anxious timid guy who had his wife and child taken away from him.
 
Given they used prosthetics on Farrell, I don't think we can rule them out for whoever plays Joker. We could get a monstrous Joker, I guess we'll just have to wait.

I've been trying to think of actors who I think would seriously be considered for the role. So far, I have the following

Jake Gyllenhaal
Ryan Gosling
Matthew McConaughey

These are the big, A-list tier actors who would be a draw just in and of themselves.

Rami Malek
Riz Ahmed
Kieran Culkin

These are actors who I think are on a tier just below top tier, actors who are decorated, yet not maybe not big draws. I think Malek is probably still on a high from his Oscar win from a few years ago, so his name will still be considered for roles like this, at least until producers realize he's maybe not as bankable as they'd like. I think Ahmed's star is on the rise, particularly as he's acting in fairly big movies. I added Culkin to the list if only because I think his involvement with Succession and HBO could start landing him bigger roles. I could see him being a dark horse candidate.
 
AndyTrevino said:
I'd possibly agree if they didn't lean too much on him being a broken family man. It's a great idea for A character but not the best angle to go with Joker. I want him to be the most frightening guy in the room; you can't exactly accomplish that if you heavily imply he used to be an anxious timid guy who had his wife and child taken away from him.
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And as I mentioned in a previous post, there might be some people who'd prefer it if Bruce Wayne were bitten by a radioactive bat and acquired superpowers, but that's not the character, is it? Everyone is obviously entitled to their opinion, but at what point do certain people just want something either incredibly obscure or non-canonical? You might as well just introduce a brand-new villain at that point (which, for the record, I am not entirely opposed to). People out here acting like we weren't having these exact conversations on this very forum 15 years ago with TDK lmao

I'm starting to think I'd like to see certain elements from the Joker's Five-Way Revenge explored in Reeves' films. It'd be interesting to see something like Batman trying to protect the same criminals he's been fighting from an even worse villain in the Joker. Instead of it being members from Joker's gang, it could be rival baddies like Penguin and whoever else that set him up.

I'm not so sure I want to see the Flying Graysons anymore, but I'd definitely like to see elements from A Death in the Family storyline if they do decide to bring Robin into it (which I hope they do)
 
Are you saying that what Andy is proposing for the Joker is obscure or not canon? Joker is rarely sympathetic. He’s usually portrayed like a demon clown in human form. Even some popular comics making him look like he’s not even human.
 
shauner111 said:
Are you saying that what Andy is proposing for the Joker is obscure or not canon? Joker is rarely sympathetic. He’s usually portrayed like a demon clown in human form. Even some popular comics making him look like he’s not even human.
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I'm saying (as I've said before) that a film version of any character, whether it be from comics or literature, be as true to the source material as possible. I actually don't really care what liberties they take with the appearance (though I would personally love if Bermejo was more of an influence on the design this time around), but the further away you get from stories like Batman #1, DC#168, Five-Way Revenge, Death in the Family and TKJ, the more likely it is that you end up with another Letoker lmao and nobody wants that.
 
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Chris Reeves said:
I'm saying (as I've said before) that a film version of any character, whether it be from comics or literature, be as true to the source material as possible. I actually don't really care what liberties they take with the appearance (though I would personally love if Bermejo was an influence on the design this time around), but the further away you get from stories like Batman #1, DC#168, Five-Way Revenge, Death in the Family and TKJ, the more likely it is that you end up with another Letoker lmao and nobody wants that.
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There are ways to stay true to his character without making him super cartoonish (as cool as that is).

On a more mutual note, I think some heavy Bermejo influence is very likely
 
Art Vandelay said:
Given they used prosthetics on Farrell, I don't think we can rule them out for whoever plays Joker. We could get a monstrous Joker, I guess we'll just have to wait.
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I feel like a gothic silent horror monster-looking Joker is just niche enough to fit into the vibe Reeves seems to be going for. There's arguably a little less you could do with that in another universe than say, a super vibrant permawhite Joker.

That specific design angle is something that could totally be recognizable as The Joker but distinct enough for you to recognize exactly where it comes from. No possibility of confusing it with Leto or Nicholson for instance. It's not runny makeup but it's not super clean-ish white/pale skin either. Disfigured and/or almost demonic in appearance.
 
AndyTrevino said:
I feel like a gothic silent horror monster-looking Joker is just niche enough to fit into the vibe Reeves seems to be going for. There's arguably a little less you could do with that in another universe than say, a super vibrant permawhite Joker.

That specific design angle is something that could totally be recognizable as The Joker but distinct enough for you to recognize exactly where it comes from. No possibility of confusing it with Leto or Nicholson for instance.
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It's funny, because the "gothic silent horror monster-looking Joker" you describe as being "just niche enough" to fit Reeves' vibe sounds an awful lot like Conrad Veidt from The Man who laughs, who was basically the original inspiration for the Joker. But you already knew that lol

 
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AndyTrevino said:
There are ways to stay true to his character without making him super cartoonish (as cool as that is).

On a more mutual note, I think some heavy Bermejo influence is very likely
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If I had a nickel every time I heard someone say that in the summer of '06... lmao
 
Chris Reeves said:
If I had a nickel every time I heard someone say that in the summer of '06... lmao
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But seriously though, intentional or not, Battinson looks a LOT like Bermejo's Batman. So going that route for Joker in terms of wardrobe mainly would be understandable. It's both gothic and modern.
 
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