The Last Crusade of Relationships

[steintym]

Raven - Instead of asking female friends to hook you up on dates, have you ever just asked them for advice? Have you ever asked for a real, honest answer on why they don't think you've hooked up with anyone?

 

[Nave 'Torment']

Yeah it is very much like a stage, and all the psychology can be complicated.

But just like in the interview anaology, your trying to sell yourself.

You say the things you think your interviewer will like most about you, or that make you the best person for the job.

You don't say 'This job looks really good, I really really want it so bad, can I have it today, please?'

You say 'I think I'd be a good candidate for the job.' In some cases, it might even benefit you to say you have other offers but you thought this one seemed the best.

And you don't then call them up the next day saying 'So, did that go well, did I get a second interview?'

You wait patiently for them to let you know if you've got to the next stage.

Once you've got the job, and your past any trial period, then you start to be a little bit more yourself. Take a few more liberties cause you know your secure. Become a lot more casual

*sigh* yeah. Well, let's see if there's a position available (wow that just... okay... innuendos).

Yeah, I just gotta wait and see. If it's meant to be, it will be, I'm sure of that

Yup. Just keep an eye on the guy. And of course, I'm sure as the rest of the board will agree, don't fear to look elsewhere.

Is she considerate to you because she cares about you and NOT because she feels guilty you're nice to her (or because she's manipulative)? That's an easy test.

Easily DEFINED perhaps. NOT, however, easily measured.

 

[Dark Raven]

Fair enough. You should still have a friend honestly tell you how you're coming off to people, though. I think your POV is skewed on that.

I think that's harder than it sounds. It needs to be a friend who can give me a balanced criticism. Those who do know me better or have taken the time to get to know me are the ones who might say I'm a great guy or a good catch. That's because they've come to see my personality (which comes out with them), my character, my humour and all my talents. They know me during times when I'm happy and joyful and spontaneous as well as times when I'm discouraged or feeling introspective and introverted. They would just say it's a matter of finding the right person in my case and continuing to be and work at the person I am.

However, those who only know me in a setting where I'm lacking confidence or feeling introverted and discouraged will think that this is all there is to me, and will tell me that X,Y and Z needs to change, when it may not necessarily be so.

It's kind of like the people who've only interacted with me in this thread such as yourself. You're bound to form one particular view of me based on the things I say here and my general attitude. However, those who know me in other threads would probably have a very different view of me, because I generally don't project the same attitude there - I tend to be more fun and jokey in other threads. Here, because it is a somewhat serious subject that brings up certain issues and hangups, your opinion of me is formed by what you can see before you.

I don't know if both types of people are needed for feedback, and the advice I glean must be weighed and considered so as not to drawn from a skewed picture of me.

So....two possibilities:

1. You look extremely fobby (I'm East Asian too, I'm gonna be honest about this. )
2. You live in an area where Asians are few and far between, and nobody sees past your race because it's that distinctive. I mean, people tried to matchmake me with other Asian guys too...in elementary school in New Jersey!

Where are you now? I spent my teens in the San Francisco Bay Area and live now in the LA area - seriously, nobody bats an eye at mixed race couples around here. And there are sooo many Asians, that we pop out a friggin' NBA player every now and again (Jeremy Lin, anyone?) simply from law of probability.

Depending on where you are in your job, it could be high-time for a change of scenery. I mean, to get yourself some non-racist friends, at the very least!

Raven, what state do you reside in now? And is it an eclectic area?


I mean I mentioned before I live in a suburb in NJ not too far from NY and Philly. However there are large groups of indian, asian sects of towns all over.


It's very common to see mixed couples here. And not just White guys with Asians girls. But Asian guys with White girls.

I live in the UK. There are some asians but it's probably not as widespread as in the US. There certainly aren't very many examples of Asian guys with white girls that's for sure. More the other way round, because most guys seem to see asian girls as exotic.

The girl can be asian in my case, but she has to be pretty much western in all other respects - ie thinks and communicates like one, because i'm not someone who can just go with the physical side of things without that vital element of good communication.

I'd really like to know what you look like, so if you feel comfortable enough that I'm not a judgemental person, then PM it to me

I'll think about it definitely.

Not being rude, but if your 'friends' don't get that, then they aren't very good friends at all

I don't know if they're necessarily doing that on purpose or being deliberately racist. It's probably more like what Anita says in point 2 above about people not seeing past the race.

Friends automatically default to thinking of another Asian when trying to matchmake me, instead of thinking of other qualities, even if it turns out the Asian woman is old enough to be my mother.

It's almost as if they only want to set up white people with other white people, and not think across races. I can't see any of my friends thinking about a white girl, for example, and saying "I think the two of you would be great together." I know this to be the case anyway, since there hasn't been a single match made by friends where the other girl doesn't turn out to be Asian in some way. So I know that they must typically default to that stereotyped way of thinking even if they aren't intending it. It's as if it takes an extra effort to get out of that mentality and think outside the box.

I have to say, I'm incredibly good at setting people up. I've made 3 happy couples in the last 2 years. And I never put people together because of similar interests, looks, weight, or anything like that.


I put people together who seem to want what the other person has to offer.

Well that's good to hear. I don't think just looking at people's interests and matching them up completely works either. You can look like a great match on paper (eg if you looked at two similar CVs) but the two people might be completely different. Should one, for example, put two accountants together just because of their same profession? No. An accountant might find his job so boring that he doesn't want to be with another accountant.

Raven - Instead of asking female friends to hook you up on dates, have you ever just asked them for advice? Have you ever asked for a real, honest answer on why they don't think you've hooked up with anyone?

I've asked, but the general response from single friends at least tends to be "we're in the same boat". Yes, they might be single as well, but I don't know of anyone else who hasn't hooked up with someone at least once. And as for those in relationships already/ married, like I said, their response is "you're a great guy, you'll meet someone blah blah blah...."

 

[Anita18]

I think that's harder than it sounds. It needs to be a friend who can give me a balanced criticism. Those who do know me better or have taken the time to get to know me are the ones who might say I'm a great guy or a good catch. That's because they've come to see my personality (which comes out with them), my character, my humour and all my talents. They know me during times when I'm happy and joyful and spontaneous as well as times when I'm discouraged or feeling introspective and introverted. They would just say it's a matter of finding the right person in my case and continuing to be and work at the person I am.

However, those who only know me in a setting where I'm lacking confidence or feeling introverted and discouraged will think that this is all there is to me, and will tell me that X,Y and Z needs to change, when it may not necessarily be so.

So, you don't have even one friend that knows you inside and out?

I only have one friend like that, but we can tell each other ANYTHING. I trust her to give me a fair assessment about myself. It can be uncomfortable, but I appreciate that it's honest and she can see things that I can't see in myself.

I don't know if they're necessarily doing that on purpose or being deliberately racist. It's probably more like what Anita says in point 2 above about people not seeing past the race.

Friends automatically default to thinking of another Asian when trying to matchmake me, instead of thinking of other qualities, even if it turns out the Asian woman is old enough to be my mother.

It's almost as if they only want to set up white people with other white people, and not think across races. I can't see any of my friends thinking about a white girl, for example, and saying "I think the two of you would be great together." I know this to be the case anyway, since there hasn't been a single match made by friends where the other girl doesn't turn out to be Asian in some way. So I know that they must typically default to that stereotyped way of thinking even if they aren't intending it. It's as if it takes an extra effort to get out of that mentality and think outside the box.

It's not so much "extra effort" as it is complete lack of cultural context. People have to see mixed race couples before they start to accept it as completely normal.

If you're simply not being around the right people, you really need to change your cultural context. I mean, there does have to be a trailblazer, but IMO it's easier for an already existing mixed-race couple to move to an area devoid of them instead of trying to forge one in a place where there aren't any.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

Raven - Instead of asking female friends to hook you up on dates, have you ever just asked them for advice? Have you ever asked for a real, honest answer on why they don't think you've hooked up with anyone?

I would avoid asking someone something like this unless they are a therapist or a real long term friend. This would have to be the kind of friend that's been around since childhood. Possibly a female relative. Otherwise they're going to tell you what they think would be attractive and that will probably be wrong.

People can be pretty fickle about what they *want* when they're looking to hook up. Whatever they find attractive isn't a solid thing.

It's better to try to figure out what you do right already, not what you do wrong. You're always going to do some things "wrong". You probably already do a lot of things "right". It's also bad, imo, to blame yourself for 'not hooking up with someone' because you don't control whether they don't find you attractive. They also don't have to find you attractive and this is their loss, not yours.

 

[Dark Raven]

So, you don't have even one friend that knows you inside and out?

Not really. Certainly not on the female front that's for sure. If there were, she might've been dating me. As for male friends, they don't seem to see a problem with me and can't quite appreciate the struggles I experience, thinking that we're all in the same boat.

I only have one friend like that, but we can tell each other ANYTHING. I trust her to give me a fair assessment about myself. It can be uncomfortable, but I appreciate that it's honest and she can see things that I can't see in myself.

That's good that you can have someone like that. As long as it's someone whom you can also have fun with. I don't like to have someone I can confide in but it's not on an equal footing, such that they effectively become a "counsellor" or "therapist" but they wouldn't share anything with me and don't consider me a peer or actual friend.

It's not so much "extra effort" as it is complete lack of cultural context. People have to see mixed race couples before they start to accept it as completely normal.

If you're simply not being around the right people, you really need to change your cultural context. I mean, there does have to be a trailblazer, but IMO it's easier for an already existing mixed-race couple to move to an area devoid of them instead of trying to forge one in a place where there aren't any.

That might be the case and you might be right. It is a very white middle/upper class society/ circle that I'm in, even though you do get people of other nationalities. There may not be the same relaxedness about mixed dating as there is in say, the US or New Zealand.

 

[SuperMike335!!]

With all this talk of relationship issues, I have an all different type of relationship issue that has recently reared its ugly head.

I'm still connected with a lot of ****, and every time I try to get out they just keep sucking me back in!

Hard to resist when I got 1500$ being waved in my face for almost no work on my part.

 

[Anubis]

Male strippin'?

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

That is what it sounds like.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

So she tells me over the phone that she won't be around all week next week, and that "the 14th" will be a dud for her. She's heading outta town, with family, and I don't have any reason to believe otherwise.

Our common friend, who's birthday is on the 14th, in turn keeps reminding me of it. I actually end up talking more with her than e-card girl, over-text, phone, etc. And she's always talking about relationships and dating etc, and saving me seats in class too.

If I give her a DVD on her birthday, (I'm thinking Inception), would it really send a bad signal to E-card Girl?

(I've known e-card girl for a year, and this girl since last semester).

 

[Nave 'Torment']

That might be the case and you might be right. It is a very white middle/upper class society/ circle that I'm in, even though you do get people of other nationalities. There may not be the same relaxedness about mixed dating as there is in say, the US or New Zealand.

Well, is it that restricted in UK? I mean, my brother lives in London, and when we went over there last year it seemed less like a homogeneous town and more like if it was New York, only not just with a single American culture defining everyone.

 

[Erzengel]

Who cares?

And I don't meant that in a bad way, just you aren't in an exclusive relationship with anyone, if you want to give something to a friend, you have every right to. If it gets back to the other girl, I was giving a gift to a friend.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

With all this talk of relationship issues, I have an all different type of relationship issue that has recently reared its ugly head.

I'm still connected with a lot of ****, and every time I try to get out they just keep sucking me back in!

Hard to resist when I got 500$ being waved in my face for almost no work on my part.

Do you really need the 500? Coz no such thing as easy-money my friend

 

[Nave 'Torment']

Who cares?

And I don't meant that in a bad way, just you aren't in an exclusive relationship with anyone, if you want to give something to a friend, you have every right to. If it gets back to the other girl, I was giving a gift to a friend.

Makes sense.

But... didn't you tell me that I was going over-board with the e-card last time?

 

[amazingfantasy15]

Okay, pulling myself together, hate being self pitying

Don't get me wrong tho... i'm not looking at my faults because I think i'd wanna change anything about myself.

I NEVER will change. I want someone to fall in love with ME, not a version of me I think they might like. I honestly don't know how to be anything but myself anyway.

And by not being able to find it by looking for it, I just mean that the Lois Lane/Clark Kent notion isn't something you find through online dating or picking someone up at a bar.

It's someone who comes into your life, and just falls for you just by being around you. Not because there was any intention of a relationship there when you first meet, but because they simply love being around you.

I really want that, and I think dating, especially online dating, sort of takes that out of the equation.

And yes, that might be me being silly, having this idealised version of how i'd like to find love. But I honestly don't mind being single, and i'd rather be single than find love in a way that doesn't excite me, doesn't feel right to me somehow.

Life is not the movies and the possibility of you "meeting cute" like in a romantic comedy (I know you mentioned Superman, but it's sounds much more romantic comedy) is slim to none, especially outside of school.

Online dating just really gives you an extra opportunity to meet someone. I met my girlfriend at a time when I was tired of dating and just about to take a break. I got dumped by my ex-girlfriend and spend the next 6 months giving it everything I had and just wound up on bad date after bad date. Got the point in eHarmony where my then future girlfriend and I were exchanging emails and asked her out, along with two other girls, these were my last three dates I was going on, then calling it quits for a while. Two of the dates were the same bad date I'd been on over the past 6 months, but the one with my girlfriend was different, it was great, felt totally comfortable, relaxed, easy. We had a ton of stuff in common and got along great. However, if I just waited for her to walk into my life at some point, it never would've happened, funnily enough we lived in the same areas of Chicago, just at different times, she was even good friends with one of my sister's friends and probably went out drinking with my sister a couple times without even knowing it. In other words, there were times when might've met cute, but just didn't because we weren't on the same path at the same time. Online dating puts yourself out there, waiting for Superman to start working at the Daily Planet, that's more than likely not going to happen.

 

[amazingfantasy15]

Here's another way to look at online dating, going off the "job interview" analogy. Online dating is like searching Monster or Career Builder or using a head hunter for a job. I'd consider the free sites like Monster or Career Builder The not much of a filter, so it going to take a lot more searching, the paid sites, like eHarmony, are more like a head hunter because they do look at you try to find the most suitable matches. Both are great though. You wouldn't just wait for a job to fall into your lap, why do the same with your love life?

 

[Erzengel]

Makes sense.

But... didn't you tell me that I was going over-board with the e-card last time?

Sorry I'm not keeping track of them all. LOL

I thought you wanted to give a DVD to a someone who was your friend, which I don't think there's an issue with that.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

^ Y'know, craziness aside. I wouldn't mind hopeful's version of things either. But I'm pretty convinced that the women around me, especially in college, inherently believes otherwise.

But change? I dunno, I used to believe that there's some side of us that never really will change. But then, the side that everyone looks at, the social image side, that can, and almost always does. I believe in compromise. But at the same time there's that one side of you that you shouldn't change just because other people want you to. There's a fine balance... somewhere.

 

[Erzengel]

Makes sense.

But... didn't you tell me that I was going over-board with the e-card last time?

Sorry I'm not keeping track of them all. LOL

I thought you wanted to give a DVD to a someone who was your friend, which I don't think there's an issue with that.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

happens.

And yeah, I guess you're right on that. God my ability to stay objective has really, really waned.

 

[Victarion]

If humans are the most dangerous animal then why should we be allowed to pursue relationships that create more humans and more danger?

Should it not be made a law that one human can not have sexual or marital relations with another human, under threat of being charged with a felony?

Why does the law paint relationships sexual and marital with less dangerous animals like monitors, dogs, sheep et cetera as being gross when they are in truth beautiful unions of peace that would prevent the propagation of a threat to the beautiful Earth?

 

[Anubis]

You'll have to work a little harder than that if you want people to accept your animal banging.

 

[Victarion]

You'll have to work a little harder than that if you want people to accept your animal banging.

Its only pragmatic--a source of food and comfort. It'd help people cope with everything going on.

 

[Anubis]

Lost your job? Lost your house? Wife and kids die in a car crash?

F**k a cat.

 

[Nave 'Torment']

You guys work for PETA don't you?