The Official Choose A Director Thread

Sheesh....your way to pessimistic in regards to Snyder.
I wouldn't call myself pessimistic towards Snyder. If I were I'd hate Dawn of the Dead (which I own on blu-ray) and 300 (which I will be double dipping for blu-ray eventually). I'd think that he's horrible for Watchmen.

The man's a great director and it's great to see him make direct adaptations of 300 and Watchmen.

I think he would have done a better job with V for Vendetta than James McTeigue and the Wachowskis.

However, he's absolutely wrong for Superman. It isn't pessimistic that I don't want a director whose style is not suited for Superman. I don't want a director that doesn't want to make a Superman movie. I don't want a director who doesn't understand Superman.

Your right when you say Snyder doesn't want to do Superman. He doesn't want to do a goody goody Superman boy scout film that has been done to death. He wants to do something visually original where Superman is angry and kicking a$$.
Superman is a goody goody boy scout! The fact that he thinks that Superman is not suited for today's audiences which he thinks want darker movies like The Dark Knight and Watchmen shows that he doesn't understand the character. And he doesn't understand the audiences because they also flocked to see Iron Man and Spider-Man.
 
The compromise is that Snyder would be a good choice with the right material.

That isn't a compromise :nono:.

As it's been earlier said, a compromise is a Superman reboot with Routh as Superman.

Me saying that Snyder would be a good choice with the right material is still essentially conceding to you.

I guess a compromise for this argument would be Snyder COULD be a good choice, but he isn't the right choice.
 
Snyder may not have objected to the character but, rather, how the studio wanted the character presented.

Superman shouldn't be a 'goody goody boy scout'. It's what makes him hard to engage the general audiences.

Look back at Superman's original incarnation ... he was a pretty tough character who could get physical when he needed to make an impression. He got angry sometimes.

This 'goody goody boy scout' thing needs to be put to bed. Superman needs to be less of a messiah and more of a man. He needs to be allowed the full gamut of the human experience ... including being a little wrong now and again.

The version we've been getting is not who the character was intended to be. What engaged us about Chris Reeve's Superman was that he had humour, he had anger, he could be bewildered, and he could be confident. Routh's take was never given the chance to do any of that. Singer basically had him this aloof character who looked like he was ready to cry at any given moment.

Now, if Snyder can give us a good story and a Superman who we can relate to we'd all be happy. Not dark and not a 'goody goody boy scout'. Something more human and in the middle.
 
Well wait, you start taking out the goody goody aspect and we'll probably get a lecture from mega joe about morality, lol.
 
I have been screwed over too many times regarding the Superman movies. I haven't liked one of them, not one. There is no middle ground with me regarding the director. I want a director who is actually excited about the movie, is diverse and doesn't want to turn Big Blue into Nolan's Batman. I want a director and screenwriter who don't kiss up to Donner and make their own movie that takes more cues from the comicbooks than the old ass movies.
 
Well I guess we'll never know.

Let's just hope WB gives us Superman fans a director who loves the character and can make an amzing film.

Though they already had one and chose not to use him again, but I digress....

Yeah. :( I soo wanted a sequel by Singer.



I wouldn't call myself pessimistic towards Snyder. If I were I'd hate Dawn of the Dead (which I own on blu-ray) and 300 (which I will be double dipping for blu-ray eventually). I'd think that he's horrible for Watchmen.

The man's a great director and it's great to see him make direct adaptations of 300 and Watchmen.

I think he would have done a better job with V for Vendetta than James McTeigue and the Wachowskis.

However, he's absolutely wrong for Superman. It isn't pessimistic that I don't want a director whose style is not suited for Superman. I don't want a director that doesn't want to make a Superman movie. I don't want a director who doesn't understand Superman.


Superman is a goody goody boy scout! The fact that he thinks that Superman is not suited for today's audiences which he thinks want darker movies like The Dark Knight and Watchmen shows that he doesn't understand the character. And he doesn't understand the audiences because they also flocked to see Iron Man and Spider-Man.

AGREED! :up:



That isn't a compromise :nono:.

As it's been earlier said, a compromise is a Superman reboot with Routh as Superman.

Me saying that Snyder would be a good choice with the right material is still essentially conceding to you.

I guess a compromise for this argument would be Snyder COULD be a good choice, but he isn't the right choice.

Right on. :up: BRB!

I want someone who respects and understands the character. Besides, 300 is so shallow, imo. Pure style and no substance. meh.





Snyder may not have objected to the character but, rather, how the studio wanted the character presented.

Superman shouldn't be a 'goody goody boy scout'. It's what makes him hard to engage the general audiences.

Look back at Superman's original incarnation ... he was a pretty tough character who could get physical when he needed to make an impression. He got angry sometimes.

This 'goody goody boy scout' thing needs to be put to bed. Superman needs to be less of a messiah and more of a man. He needs to be allowed the full gamut of the human experience ... including being a little wrong now and again.

The version we've been getting is not who the character was intended to be. What engaged us about Chris Reeve's Superman was that he had humour, he had anger, he could be bewildered, and he could be confident. Routh's take was never given the chance to do any of that. Singer basically had him this aloof character who looked like he was ready to cry at any given moment.

Now, if Snyder can give us a good story and a Superman who we can relate to we'd all be happy. Not dark and not a 'goody goody boy scout'. Something more human and in the middle.

I think Superman in SR was both a messiah and very human. It was a more complex Superman tale than in previous movies. A more grown up story, and I loved it. He was still a good and caring hero, but he wasn't perfect, which I liked since a Superman that is in complete control ALL the time is kinda boring and one-dimensional, imo. But that's me.

Also, Superman wasn't 'about to cry' all the time. He was also tough, brave and heroic when he needed to be, and even gave up his life to save the world. That's a real man to me. And don't waste your time, mego, you won't change my mind. :o :woot:




LOL!!!!!!
 
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I want a director who is actually excited about the movie, is diverse and doesn't want to turn Big Blue into Nolan's Batman.

U just discribed Singer.

I want a director and screenwriter who don't kiss up to Donner and make their own movie that takes more cues from the comicbooks than the old ass movies.

Now u just discribed Mark Millar.

Cant please everyone, right? :)
 
David, great post. I am in complete agreement. Superman needs to be expanded as a character on film. Obviously the characters physical prowess needs to be played up, but I seldom hear people mention ideas about the personality and character evolving.

Let's get away from the Donnerverse, yes. But let's also move away from the 'boy scout' and let's make Superman a little bit more of a wild card. Who has occasional emotional upheavals and who isn't always in control.

Just a touch, could do some good for the character. I think.
 
Danny Boyle....after watching "Sunshine", I think he'd do quite well adapting Morrison's All-Star: Superman.
 
I have been screwed over too many times regarding the Superman movies. I haven't liked one of them, not one. There is no middle ground with me regarding the director. I want a director who is actually excited about the movie, is diverse and doesn't want to turn Big Blue into Nolan's Batman. I want a director and screenwriter who don't kiss up to Donner and make their own movie that takes more cues from the comicbooks than the old ass movies.

:huh:STM?
 
^ she might be the only one who doesnt like that movie... oh wait neither do I. I think its not really a matter of liking it but knowing that they can do so much better. A lot of fans feel that STM can never be topped and thats fine, but I'm sure a lot of people feel that it can and frankly I think the general audience probably thinks it can. I appreciate what it did for the time, but I think with SR it really showed more than anything its time to move on and possiblly tackle the same story just in a different fashion.
 
Okay, what parts of the thin, smooth skin of the jet was he supposed to grab that wouldn't tear right off in his hands? Because that's what he's got to grab onto underneath the plane to stop it form spinning.


Airliner wings are surprisingly strong and flexible. They also gave Superman something structural to grab onto to stop that spin but also something, that if it did break off, would still leave the fuselage and all the people inside of it intact.

Exactly, not to mention, its made quite clear in the movie by Lois stopping being flung around everywere that he was trying to stop the plane spinning out of control by grabbing the wing.

If the plane did spin out of control, he wouldnt have been able to grab any part of it without either ripping it off or breaking the necks/backs of every passenger on board.
 
I am currently reading Birthright for the first and, with the exception of the 'soul vision' and Clark and Lex being friends in Smallville, I actually think this story could work quite well for a re-boot of the character.

Dont get me wrong, I still hope to see a sequel to SR, but if WB DO re-boot the franchise, they could do a LOT worse than an adaptation of Birthright.


I agree....some in here dislike Birthright, but I think adapting some elements of that book along with Geoff Johns current Action Comics run into a origin style film would work. Clark and Lex being friends from Smallville would not work though, and adding Braniac as the main baddie work well.
 
I agree....some in here dislike Birthright, but I think adapting some elements of that book along with Geoff Johns current Action Comics run into a origin style film would work. Clark and Lex being friends from Smallville would not work though, and adding Braniac as the main baddie work well.

Yeah, that and soul vision were 2 things I could have done without.

But reading the comments on here about Birthright, I was expecting a disaster, yet thought it was a superb modern update of the origin, and the ending, were he gets to tell Jor-El and Lara he made it to Earth, almost had me tears. And its very rare a book does that to me.

One of the best Superman reads I have read for a while.
 
Yeah, that and soul vision were 2 things I could have done without.

But reading the comments on here about Birthright, I was expecting a disaster, yet thought it was a superb modern update of the origin, and the ending, were he gets to tell Jor-El and Lara he made it to Earth, almost had me tears. And its very rare a book does that to me.

One of the best Superman reads I have read for a while.


Yeah, the ending was great....very emotional and quite a fitting ending.

I'm currently reading the Superman For Tommorrow story from Azzarello and Jim Lee.
 
Yeah, that and soul vision were 2 things I could have done without.

But reading the comments on here about Birthright, I was expecting a disaster, yet thought it was a superb modern update of the origin, and the ending, were he gets to tell Jor-El and Lara he made it to Earth, almost had me tears. And its very rare a book does that to me.

One of the best Superman reads I have read for a while.
The Krypton segment was eh. Jor-El was a bit too whiny, and Lara a bit too confident. I get what Waid was trying to do, but it fell a bit flat for me. All of the scenes involving Clark's travels, and Smallville were good. The end where he is able to talk to Jor-El and Lara was pretty good. The rest was absolute garbage. From the moment Clark gets to Metropolis, the story completely falls apart. Lex was a horrible attempt to fuse Smallville and the comics, and failed. There's no way Superman would put Lois in harm's way so quickly. They acted like I would expect them to now, with all their history, but they had just met. The faux invasion plot was stupid. The public turns against, and then back in favor of Superman too quickly. I hated the way Clark learned of his heritage. Not to mention the small stuff like "burning" his costume back together, and the "soul vision" crap. I am not a fan of Lu's art, and thought he made Superman look like a gorrilla in spots. Storywise, I expected better from Waid and was quite disapointed. Just my opinon, of course.:yay:
 
The Krypton segment was eh. Jor-El was a bit too whiny, and Lara a bit too confident. I get what Waid was trying to do, but it fell a bit flat for me. All of the scenes involving Clark's travels, and Smallville were good. The end where he is able to talk to Jor-El and Lara was pretty good. The rest was absolute garbage. From the moment Clark gets to Metropolis, the story completely falls apart. Lex was a horrible attempt to fuse Smallville and the comics, and failed. There's no way Superman would put Lois in harm's way so quickly. They acted like I would expect them to now, with all their history, but they had just met. The faux invasion plot was stupid. The public turns against, and then back in favor of Superman too quickly. I hated the way Clark learned of his heritage. Not to mention the small stuff like "burning" his costume back together, and the "soul vision" crap. I am not a fan of Lu's art, and thought he made Superman look like a gorrilla in spots. Storywise, I expected better from Waid and was quite disapointed. Just my opinon, of course.:yay:

I was kind of shocked to read through this thread and see some of the hate that Birthright has garnered, and it almost hurts me. I was a late comer to Superman fandom, and the last medium I took to were comics. The first Superman graphic novel I read was Birthright, and it literally blew me away. I've read many, many since then (Superman and otherwise) and it remains to be my favorite graphic novel (tied with Watchmen). I thought Birthright nailed the character of nearly every person in the mythos. From the origins at Krypton to Luthor's plot, I thought it was great. I'll admit, it gets a little weaker towards the end. But the beginning, particularly Clark's adventures in Africa, was incredible. I think that aspect, Clark traveling the world before becoming Superman, should be incorporated to every story from now on.
I'm going to confront a the common arguments against Birthright.

The aptly named "soul vision:" This really didn't bother me. All it really did was broaden the spectrum of light that Superman can see, which makes sense. Since the introduction of Superman's 'X-ray' vision, a lot has been learned about light and it's properties. It's okay that they've broadened that a little. This vision is really only an emission of light that living beings emit. This doesn't take anything away from the character, it doesn't really make him more powerful, and it gives an explanation for his devotion to preserve life. Sure, it's a little Zen, but it's not nearly a big of deal as people are making it to be.

Lex at Smallville in high school: I might be a little biased since one of my earliest exposures to Superman was Smallville, and I got used to the idea quickly. I can kind of understand why some people don't like this, but I really like how it was handled in Birthright. It takes nothing away from Clark and adds a little bit too Lex. Overall, not worth the hatred it's getting. In a movie, it certainly does not have to be included. But it didn't make Birthright bad.

I'd say those are the big ones. And I think a lot of it could be included in a movie. I think there would have to be a superpowered being included/instead of the fake Kryptonian army (Metallo Parasite and the like), but the story could work. One thing Birthright did that I think is important is that Superman was not immediately embraced, he was feared. That, I think is crucial, because if something like that happened today, if a man flew through New York City, people would be absolutely terrified.

I think if you took Birthright along with some of the other stories mentioned, we'd have a great origin. I find "For All Seasons" to be a little overrated. I really don't like the artwork, and it had some great stuff. I find it had great moments (Clark after the tornado with the preacher is perfect), while Birthright had a better cohesive story.

Bottom line, Birthright was great, and it could be used for a movie.
 
I was kind of shocked to read through this thread and see some of the hate that Birthright has garnered, and it almost hurts me. I was a late comer to Superman fandom, and the last medium I took to were comics. The first Superman graphic novel I read was Birthright, and it literally blew me away. I've read many, many since then (Superman and otherwise) and it remains to be my favorite graphic novel (tied with Watchmen).

:huh:
I thought Birthright nailed the character of nearly every person in the mythos.
I very much disagree
From the origins at Krypton to Luthor's plot, I thought it was great. I'll admit, it gets a little weaker towards the end.

But the beginning, particularly Clark's adventures in Africa, was incredible. I think that aspect, Clark traveling the world before becoming Superman, should be incorporated to every story from now on.
Best part of the story, by far. The idea of Clark traveling has been around since at least "Man of Steel," back in '86.
I'm going to confront a the common arguments against Birthright.

The aptly named "soul vision:" This really didn't bother me. All it really did was broaden the spectrum of light that Superman can see, which makes sense. Since the introduction of Superman's 'X-ray' vision, a lot has been learned about light and it's properties. It's okay that they've broadened that a little. This vision is really only an emission of light that living beings emit. This doesn't take anything away from the character, it doesn't really make him more powerful, and it gives an explanation for his devotion to preserve life. Sure, it's a little Zen, but it's not nearly a big of deal as people are making it to be.
I actually agree. It didn't really bother me, it worked for the story and was interesting, along with the addition/info of him being able to see microwave transmissions, etc. It wasn't really "Soul Vision" until a later story where Clark tells Conner that he sees his soul, and it's "beautiful." I guess that taints my view of it, because that scene was just awkward. That's not really Waid's fault.
Lex at Smallville in high school: I might be a little biased since one of my earliest exposures to Superman was Smallville, and I got used to the idea quickly. I can kind of understand why some people don't like this, but I really like how it was handled in Birthright. It takes nothing away from Clark and adds a little bit too Lex. Overall, not worth the hatred it's getting. In a movie, it certainly does not have to be included. But it didn't make Birthright bad.
It was poorly handled. They tried to combine Lex's Smallville origins, and the Silver Age Lex origin, that Smallville is partly based on. IMO it didn't work, but I believe it to be more because of the format of the miniseries/novel, than the writing. The main problem that I had is that Lex chose not to acknowledge his past in Smallville, and that he's deluding himself into not recognizing Clark. IMO, that' just weak. Lex's backstory would have worked better if they had more time for it, as they did with Smallville.
I'd say those are the big ones.
I would disagree. I think those are the least of Birthright's problems.
And I think a lot of it could be included in a movie. I think there would have to be a superpowered being included/instead of the fake Kryptonian army (Metallo Parasite and the like), but the story could work. One thing Birthright did that I think is important is that Superman was not immediately embraced, he was feared. That, I think is crucial, because if something like that happened today, if a man flew through New York City, people would be absolutely terrified.
Agreed. At least mostly
I think if you took Birthright along with some of the other stories mentioned, we'd have a great origin. I find "For All Seasons" to be a little overrated. I really don't like the artwork, and it had some great stuff. I find it had great moments (Clark after the tornado with the preacher is perfect), while Birthright had a better cohesive story.
Disagree
Bottom line, Birthright was great, and it could be used for a movie.
I disagree, but that's my opinion. It's cool that you liked it. :yay:
 
I think this is one of the best ideas for Superman I've heard on these boards. Although Neo is essentially Superman in the Matrix, I think they know what do with Superman and can upgrade it for the 21st century with being respectful to the mythos and the religious overtones. Throw in some Superman For All Season, and ditch the "soul vision" and you got a great reboot for Superman. No doubt about it. I think a more alien villain (not named Zod) would be better for a movie. I don't really like how the illusions mixed in with some actors working for Luthor is explained in Birthright. Having just recently reread Birthright, also, I think Luthor's depiction is the best in comics. I was very touched by the final scene where Jor-El and Lara see Superman "doing ok" on earth...It is a great line when he says, "Mom, dad...I made it." Or something like that...that is a great ending. He made it and now he is here. Our greatest champion. Could be great. Also in Superman For All Seasons, I love how Ma and Pa Kent are depicted. They aren't really sure what to make of Clark, and are a little bit afraid of him...Pa Kent says, "what are we dealing with here?" referring to Clark. And then of course Clark hears them with his super-hearing, not knowing he HAS super-hearing. That aspect has to be explored with the Kents. Not just the kind hearted elderly parents, but people with some real fears and doubts. Also the priest scene is absolutely fantastic along with the tornado scene. Could be good...
 
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I like of a lot of aspects of Birthright.

I love Lex Luthor Waid shows in the book. He is the busnessman, but he is also a brilliant scientist that help him to create this huge company. Superman/Clark personas are very well done. Plot is interesting, the ending is amazing.

Only thing i really dont like (never did, even in pre-crisis or smallville) is Clark and Lex being friends as a teenagers.

Besides that, with some good work on some points, Birthright would be an incredible Superman movie.
 
I just want a MOS sequel, I really think Singer would get it right.
 

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