The Avengers The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 8

[Obi-Ron]

Again with the weiner talk...makes one wonder...

 

[Gamma Burst]

There's something to be said for answering the question...as posed...or as the person who asked the question intended. Gamma, you're funny. You haven't destroyed jack.

It's funny that you think a thread on a forum board makes your e-peen bigger.

That only makes you look clueless and even more desperate than before.

You haven't adressed any of the points I've made, which destroyed your delusional posts. (the other guys here agree with me)

But it's nice to see that, face with real evidence, you chose to give up.

 

[Gamma Burst]

Again with the weiner talk...makes one wonder...

Strange, isn't it?

 

[StanLee Wannabe]

I dont care how many forum buddies you get to pat you on the back. There weren't any restrictions on the question, now were there?

The answer you're searching for...is no.

You insults rendered anything else you said afterward...the points you made...worthless. But the answer to all your points is easily summed up as I just stated...there weren't restrictions on the question.

Treat others the way you'd like to be treated old chap. You get more flies with honey than with vinegar. Or...keep posting to prove to everyone how great you are...as if it's not silly.

I doubt you'll be able to grasp what I'm trying to convey here. But there's hope.

 

[Gamma Burst]

I dont care how many forum buddies you get to pat you on the back. There weren't any restrictions on the question, now were there?

The answer you're searching for...is no.

You insults rendered anything else you said afterward...the points you made...worthless. But the answer to all your points is easily summed up as I just stated...there weren't restrictions on the question.

Treat others the way you'd like to be treated old chap. You get more flies with honey than with vinegar. Or...keep posting to prove to everyone how great you are...as if it's not silly.

I doubt you'll be able to grasp what I'm trying to convey here. But there's hope.

So now you're going to 'there were no restrictions'' route? Funny that you never mentioned them when I countered (and destroyed) your poor examples!
Really, it's hard to argue with someone with low intellect like you.
I'll explain once again:
1) This example happened in a retconned alternate universe (and thor was holding the hammer)
2) this one was a dream
3)hulk didn't lift mjolnir in the third

Is it that hard to understand? Or do i have to explain it again?
I suppose you'll now give examples from what ifs and fanfics too? LOL

 

[terry78]

You're gonna have to chill with the back and forth before you know who waltzes in here.

 

[StanLee Wannabe]

I'm over it. Been over it. I just don't like getting insulted is all. F@#$ it. It's some guy on an internet forum board whose opinion amounts to less than nothing.

 

[Roose Bolton]

Coming back from my second viewing I noticed that during the ending news broadcast a little kid holds up a sign saying: HULK =HERO

I think thats a moment every true Hulk fan would appreciate.

 

[BigThor]

Thor is still holding his hammer in the panel that seemingly shows Hulk holding Mjolnir, he's mere holding Thor's hand which is much smaller than Hulk's.

I'll give you some credit. I didn't check what images I posted. Here's Let the Battle Begin.

 

[DouglasJ]

Oh hai,

I come to this board with a question I am sure you have already discussed:

So, the movie was indeed awesome, and all, but...
Is there any other explanation than "writer said so" as to why the Hulk first goes on a rampage at the SHIELD carrier, but later can be controlled so far that he allies with the other Avengers.

Probably, I missed it, but is there any explanation given why he first acted one way, and then another?

Thanks,

B

Most people seem to think it was due to

Spoiler

Loki manipulating Banner/Hulk

which I think was part of it

Spoiler

But I think it's largely due to words and actions, rather than magic - although the spear seems to have some influence too. I don't think Banner was being manipulated anymore than the rest of the team.

To be honest I think

Spoiler

the circumstances of the transformation have a bit to do with it. Let's not forget we've only seen that Banner can bring the transformation on at will, we've not seen that he can stop it if he gets angry.

In the case of the first Hulk-Out, although it was caused by the explosion, he was angry with SHIELD and Widow for manipulating him, so the anger was focused on her.

Perhaps chosing to Hulk-Out, and thus transforming in calmer circumstances leads to a slightly more mellow Hulk.

 

[Smashlilman]

I'll give you some credit. I didn't check what images I posted. Here's Let the Battle Begin.

You know whats funny about that. Hulk didn't smash Thor's face in with the hammer He grab the hammer from Thor and when Odin's Enchantment kicked in he redirected back at Thor's face. Look at how he's holding it on the way down.

Or maybe i'm reading to much into that

What the hell are you guys arguing about any way. I'm to lazy to keep reading back.

 

[Tim_Riggins]

Where does the panel above come from?! The art is absolutely horrendous!

 

[Smashlilman]

Where does the panel above come from?! The art is absolutely horrendous!

I know right its terrible but i have no idea where it comes from. I've only seen it floating around online.

 

[Incredible Hans]

I'd say that the debate got a little bit too heated here... which is never a good thing.

But it is true: Hulk never lifted Mjolnir in the comics.

 

[Incredible Hans]

Just to add a few things...

- The Maestro (who is Hulk, only a few hundred years in the future and much stronger than the Hulk of our time!) clearly wasn't able to lift Mjolnir in "Future Imperfect".

- The whole thing with the Red Hulk lifting Mjolnir in low gravity is bad writing. Okay, it happened in the comics, and I can't say I ignore it just because I don't like it. So it happened. But it is illogical. The enchantment says you must be worthy to lift it, it didn't say you can lift it if you are unworthy and in low gravity. So for me, Red Hulk lifting Mjolnir is the same BS as Spider-Man defeating Firelord or Wolverine defeating Lobo.

- Alternate realities don't count. If you say that Hulk can lift Mjolnir because an alternate reality's Hulk did, then you'd also have to say that Victor von Doom is a benevolent and heroic man (he is in an alternate reality), that X-Men's Storm is Asgard's goddess of thunder (she was in a what if-story), and that Wolverine and Elektra got married.

 

[Nathan]

We also had Black Panther putting the Silver Surfer into an arm lock in the comics. So if certain things are too far-fetched and stupid, I'd say we can ignore that. So I'm just gonna ignore that this Red Hulk lifting Mjolnir thing ever happened.

 

[Fifthchild]

Where does the panel above come from?! The art is absolutely horrendous!

Its from a rather minor story called "Let The Battle Begin" which has achieved notoriety because of this scene where Hulk grabs Mjolnir while in Thors hand and beats him senseless with it.

Let me chime in on the "Hulk has never lifted Mjolnir in standard 616 Marvel continuity" front. It will never happen either while Tom Brevoort is around. He doesnt even like the fact that guys like Captain America, Beta Ray Bill etc have lifted it and if it were up to him nobody but Thor would everbe able to lift it (He says that to be "worthy" you have to be Thor, which effectively makes the inscription on the hammer false advertising IMO).

As for myself i wouldnt really be averse to it and i think the Hulk at his "angriest" trying to lift it would be a very interesting scene, in an irresistable force vs immovable object way....but I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for it to happen. I thought the way it was done in the film - Hulk has a brief attempt, the floor begins to give way, Thor interrupts him - was the perfect way to do it and a nice nod to the comics where Hulk often had a brief go at lifting it back in the day.

 

[Fifthchild]

Question:

Its probably been answered elsewhere but has anyone confirmed whether Ruffalo or Ferrigno was credited with the Hulks voice in the credits? I've heard a lot of conflicting things over this.

 

[Fifthchild]

We also had Black Panther putting the Silver Surfer into an arm lock in the comics. So if certain things are too far-fetched and stupid, I'd say we can ignore that. So I'm just gonna ignore that this Red Hulk lifting Mjolnir thing ever happened.

Wrong or not its not the first time the enchantment has been shown to stop working in "zero gravity" (the fact that theres still gravity in space being the main problem with the scene). Iron Man once flew with the hammer for the same reason.

 

[Smashlilman]

Its from a rather minor story called "Let The Battle Begin" which has achieved notoriety because of this scene where Hulk grabs Mjolnir while in Thors hand and beats him senseless with it.

Let me chime in on the "Hulk has never lifted Mjolnir in standard 616 Marvel continuity" front. It will never happen either while Tom Brevoort is around. He doesnt even like the fact that guys like Captain America, Beta Ray Bill etc have lifted it and if it were up to him nobody but Thor would everbe able to lift it (He says that to be "worthy" you have to be Thor, which effectively makes the inscription on the hammer false advertising IMO).

As for myself i wouldnt really be averse to it and i think the Hulk at his "angriest" trying to lift it would be a very interesting scene, in an irresistable force vs immovable object way....but I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for it to happen. I thought the way it was done in the film - Hulk has a brief attempt, the floor begins to give way, Thor interrupts him - was the perfect way to do it and a nice nod to the comics where Hulk often had a brief go at lifting it back in the day.

It don't say to be worthy you have to be Thor. It says if you are worthy you shall posses the power of Thor. That means if you fit Odin's definitions of Worthy you will received all of Thor's Powers. It was a way for Odin to keep a check on Thor's behavior. That's why Beta Ray lost the ablity to hold his own hammer when he was hell bent on killing Galactus.

 

[Brian Braddock]

A thought struck me during the Harry Dean Stanton Janitor cameo - I reckon if Bill Bixby was still alive that cameo wouldve been his.

 

[Incredible Hans]

Unfortunately, there are a lot of inconsistencies.

For example, it was once stated that everything that isn't really alive and doesn't have a soul (robots, all kinds of machines) could lift Mjolnir.

And indeed, the Destroyer and the robotic version of Airwalker were able to lift Mjolnir without problems.

However, in the "Alone against the Celestials" storyline, Thor is found unconscious on another planet. While he's recovering, the alien inhabitants of the planet try to lift Mjolnir. They don't try it themselves, they let some huge robotic looking machines do it. However, the machines cannot lift Mjolnir! And I have no explanation why they can't.

For me, lifting Mjolnir in low gravity is also illogical, even if it was done several times in the comics. Yeah, I have to live with it, but I hate it. There are always places in the universe where there's more or less gravity. The enchantment should take care of that.

It also contradicts a Beta Ray Bill story. Here aliens try to make Storm Breaker (Mjolnir's identical twin) weightless with anti-gravity devices in order to lift it. However, Storm Breaker doesn't move.

 

[Fifthchild]

It don't say to be worthy you have to be Thor. It says if you are worthy you shall posses the power of Thor. That means if you fit Odin's definitions of Worthy you will received all of Thor's Powers. It was a way for Odin to keep a check on Thor's behavior. That's why Beta Ray lost the ablity to hold his own hammer when he was hell bent on killing Galactus.

You missed my point. Brevoort says that to be worthy you have to be Thor. Which pretty much means that you cant be worthy and the whole thing is a joke IMO. Thats what i was saying. Again: Brevoort said "to be worthy you have to be Thor", not Odin.

 

[Smashlilman]

Unfortunately, there are a lot of inconsistencies.

For example, it was once stated that everything that isn't really alive and doesn't have a soul (robots, all kinds of machines) could lift Mjolnir.

And indeed, the Destroyer and the robotic version of Airwalker were able to lift Mjolnir without problems.

However, in the "Alone against the Celestials" storyline, Thor is found unconscious on another planet. While he's recovering, the alien inhabitants of the planet try to lift Mjolnir. They don't try it themselves, they let some huge robotic looking machines do it. However, the machines cannot lift Mjolnir! And I have no explanation why they can't.

For me, lifting Mjolnir in low gravity is also illogical, even if it was done several times in the comics. Yeah, I have to live with it, but I hate it. There are always places in the universe where there's more or less gravity. The enchantment should take care of that.

It also contradicts a Beta Ray Bill story. Here aliens try to make Storm Breaker (Mjolnir's identical twin) weightless with anti-gravity devices in order to lift it. However, Storm Breaker doesn't move.

I understand Machines being directed by the will of other living being not being able to lift it. I think an independent AI driven machines can lift it since it's not being directed by other living creatures.

Like the Redneck trying to pull Mjölnir out with his truck couldn't but if robot that wasn't being controlled or willed to do something tried to lift it it could.

 

[Incredible Hans]

There was also an Avengers story where Ares was placed in Thor's body by Hera,

Ares-Thor (= Ares' spirit possessing Thor's body) was able to lift Mjolnir. IMO that's a mistake too, because in fact it means that Ares is the one who lifts Mjolnir.

If Mjolnir was able to recognize Thor's soul being unworthy at a time when arrogant Thor really was unworthy, then Mjolnir should also be able to recognize that this time there is an unworthy soul in Thor's body again - this time, of course, not his own soul, but Ares' soul.

Another example:
In a Beta Ray Bill story, Bill does a lot of "unworthy" things resulting in Storm Breaker disobeying him. So Bill cannot lift Storm Breaker any more.

However, in the "Blood and Thunder" storyline, Thor is mad and acts like a villain. But nevertheless, Mjolnir still obeys him.

As I said, a lot of inconsistencies.