The Official "I Loved Raimi's Spider-Man' Thread - Part 1 of 99 Luft - Part 10

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Nice insight on Eddie but at the end he could've been done alot better and I think that topher would've pulled it off well. However eddie and venom were the ONLY good thing about the movie.
 
That was actually a GOOD idea. Eddie was supposed to be a mirror Peter: his opposite. What did Uncle Ben say? With great power comes great RESPONSIBILITY. What seperated Eddie and Peter was morality and the fact Eddie blamed everyone else for his problems, while Peter owned up to his own. Eddie doesn't take RESPONSIBILITY! See how that relates to the story? This is why Peter is Spider-Man, and Eddie is Venom in SM3. It makes perfect sense, and isn't a flaw in the story. I can name things like the rushed team-up scene and the crappy Butler angle with flaws for SM3 (of which it has many), but Eddie's motivations as a villain were interesting. Sure, he could have used more screentime, but the idea had merit given Eddie was supposed to be a mirror Peter.

I think SM3 is a good movie. Flawed, but good.

Awesome, awesome post.

Love it when the Hero and Villian mirror each other in some sort of way. It allows the thematic message of the story to shine through.

The Raimi Venom was not intrinsically bad, just rushed. You give that character extra time to flow, and it would have been fine. That's a testament to Raimi's skill that he can create a fair bit of depth for a character he wasn't really interested in.

Let's look at the other villians;

Harry's story was built up over 3 movies

Sandman's was heartwarming, about forgiveness and tied in thematically with Venom, they both had some out there relationship to Uncle Ben.

It all comes together, it all ties together. It's those words, "Great Power Comes Great Responsibility". They resonate through the series, its about Uncle Ben, it always was, and its about Peter encapsulating those words, Spider-Man is just his way of doing that. I'm kinda sad that a dance scene makes some people forget that.

SM3 was a good movie, it was just rushed and altered too much.
 
Raimi was great at mirroring the villains with Peter. Making them fit the theme and conflict of the movie that Peter was facing. My personal favorite was with Doc Ock, in how it was all conceptual and fit like a glove.

Peter was being irresponsible by giving up being Spider-Man so he could live his dream of living a normal life. Doc Ock was being irresponsible by doing evil things to make his dream of the fusion reactor happen. By the end of the movie they both came full circle and accepted responsibility.

Nice insight on Eddie but at the end he could've been done alot better and I think that topher would've pulled it off well. However eddie and venom were the ONLY good thing about the movie.

I thought you were banned from this thread; http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=29639189&postcount=816
 
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Nice insight on Eddie but at the end he could've been done alot better and I think that topher would've pulled it off well. However eddie and venom were the ONLY good thing about the movie.

You disobeyed my direct order to not post in here. I never lifted your ban in this thread. Take 1 month off.
 
Awesome, awesome post.

Love it when the Hero and Villian mirror each other in some sort of way. It allows the thematic message of the story to shine through.

The Raimi Venom was not intrinsically bad, just rushed. You give that character extra time to flow, and it would have been fine. That's a testament to Raimi's skill that he can create a fair bit of depth for a character he wasn't really interested in.

Let's look at the other villians;

Harry's story was built up over 3 movies

Sandman's was heartwarming, about forgiveness and tied in thematically with Venom, they both had some out there relationship to Uncle Ben.

It all comes together, it all ties together. It's those words, "Great Power Comes Great Responsibility". They resonate through the series, its about Uncle Ben, it always was, and its about Peter encapsulating those words, Spider-Man is just his way of doing that. I'm kinda sad that a dance scene makes some people forget that.

SM3 was a good movie, it was just rushed and altered too much.

100% agreed. SM3 has its faults for sure, but it also has some very good ideas mixed in there. The good ideas outweigh the bad ones for me, and while it never shines as brightly as say Spider-Man 2, it still has many moments of brilliance. SM3 is about more than just a couple dancing scenes. Also, I never thought Venom needed a second movie. Venom as the final villain at the climax would have worked if the movie was slightly retooled.
 
You disobeyed my direct order to not post in here. I never lifted your ban in this thread. Take 1 month off.

Can we get a director's cut of that ban :awesome:

100% agreed. SM3 has its faults for sure, but it also has some very good ideas mixed in there. The good ideas outweigh the bad ones for me, and while it never shines as brightly as say Spider-Man 2, it still has many moments of brilliance. SM3 is about more than just a couple dancing scenes. Also, I never thought Venom needed a second movie. Venom as the final villain at the climax would have worked if the movie was slightly retooled.

I disagree, I think he was perfect to just be thrown in the finale. Peter/Spider-Man literally confronts his personal demons in a physical form, high atop skyscrapers, seemingly helpless until someone helps to save him.


I see ya Raimi.
 
Can we get a director's cut of that ban :awesome:



I disagree, I think he was perfect to just be thrown in the finale. Peter/Spider-Man literally confronts his personal demons in a physical form, high atop skyscrapers, seemingly helpless until someone helps to save him.


I see ya Raimi.

Exactly. The themes of the film took physical form in Venom. We didn't need an entire 4th film about this particular Venom. He was serving his symbolic purpose by slowly becoming the grand villain of the climax. I think a couple extra character scenes for Brock, a better team-up scene, and cutting out the dumb butler would have gone a long way to fixing the final battle of SM3, and largely all that was filmed. I would have liked Gwen to be kidnapped instead of MJ, but alas, not much could have been done about that.
 
I just wanted Venom play a big role on the movie since he isn't a secondary villain on the mythos that gets ten minutes or less before dying.

That was a huge disappointment regarding the symbiote IMO.
 
Venom wasn't treated like a secondary villain. He killed Harry and was the final threat of the movie that the film actively built towards. I'd argue he was the film's main villain, given his symbolic emphasis. If anything, Sandman was the secondary threat. Hence why Harry is the one who basically beats him. Secondary hero defeats secondary villain.
 
Exactly. The themes of the film took physical form in Venom. We didn't need an entire 4th film about this particular Venom. He was serving his symbolic purpose by slowly becoming the grand villain of the climax. I think a couple extra character scenes for Brock, a better team-up scene, and cutting out the dumb butler would have gone a long way to fixing the final battle of SM3, and largely all that was filmed. I would have liked Gwen to be kidnapped instead of MJ, but alas, not much could have been done about that.

:up:

All of it was too, wish they would've shown us the scene at Gwen's / Venom kidnapping Penny. I really loved that Eddie was the true face of evil in the franchise, although Norman should've too (but I can let that slide.) I do think Gwen was to be kidnapped, but BDH was found to be preggers, so they nixed that. I know it got repetitive by SM3, but MJ being kidnapped adds more punch than Gwen, imo.
 
:up:

All of it was too, wish they would've shown us the scene at Gwen's / Venom kidnapping Penny. I really loved that Eddie was the true face of evil in the franchise, although Norman should've too (but I can let that slide.) I do think Gwen was to be kidnapped, but BDH was found to be preggers, so they nixed that. I know it got repetitive by SM3, but MJ being kidnapped adds more punch than Gwen, imo.

It does, but by SM3, it was too repetitive and using Gwen would have made it more personal for Eddie, thus developing him better. I am sure MJ would have found her way to the fight if Peter was in danger, also. Thus, we could have had the best of both worlds idealy: development for Eddie, and it getting personal for Peter late.
 
Maybe if Venom wasn't keeping being hold to the last minutes I wouldn't say that he was somehow treated le a secondary villain.

But I can't say that with what we got.
 
I'm not disagreeing with you there, I said it myself lol. I think it just boils down to BDH's safety. I think I read somewhere it was a last minute decision?

It would've been nice if they filmed (I don't think they did) Gwen's reaction at the finale. Doesn't add toooooo much, but it would've been nice.
 
Also, MJ really needed to be present for Harry's death scene. It wouldn't have been right without her.
 
I'm not disagreeing with you there, I said it myself lol. I think it just boils down to BDH's safety. I think I read somewhere it was a last minute decision?

It would've been nice if they filmed (I don't think they did) Gwen's reaction at the finale. Doesn't add toooooo much, but it would've been nice.

Oh, I know that they had to change it due to BDH's condition. Hence why I said we can't do much about that. Though newer films, like Avengers: AoU are getting around that with CG doubles and filming other scenes later. If only Raimi had tried that, LOL
 
Also, MJ really needed to be present for Harry's death scene. It wouldn't have been right without her.

I think the original idea was MJ (not Peter) asks for Harry's help, and that is how he gets to the final battle. I remember part of that in the trailer with her saying something like "we have to forgive each other" so I imagine she would have got to the area via Harry, and walked into the site during the fight. Seems like that was the original idea.
 
I think the original idea was MJ (not Peter) asks for Harry's help, and that is how he gets to the final battle. I remember part of that in the trailer with her saying something like "we have to forgive each other" so I imagine she would have got to the area via Harry, and walked into the site during the fight. Seems like that was the original idea.

I've always wondered about that scene and where it would fit. She either spoke to Harry about forgiveness before being kidnapped, or this was left-over from the original idea to have Gwen be the hostage.
 
The web-slinging is great, but it's bar none the MOST repetitive video game I've ever played. I was sick of it halfway through.



Still better than Edge of Time though lol
 
This thread needs more Ock bad assery;

[YT]71Nwfmd2CJg[/YT]
 
I've always wondered about that scene and where it would fit. She either spoke to Harry about forgiveness before being kidnapped, or this was left-over from the original idea to have Gwen be the hostage.

I think it is a leftover from that idea, personally. It would make sense.
 
Edge of Time was ARSE.

I liked Shattered Dimensions, though.
 
Sorry for the bad quality but..
harry-osborn-expression-o.gif


I seriously miss James Harry Osborn, he was brilliant while it lasted :csad: In SM3 his character was mostly perfection.Best Harry portrayal so far.
 
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