The Amazing Spider-Man 2 The Scene Gwen Stacey Died - Part 1

[GENERAL RAAM582]

The mystery is just too great.

 

[Airnick]

I do truly believe that she'll die at the clock tower, It makes so much sense with the theme of this movie being "time".

 

[Andrew Lucas]

Yes and make sense that he will have the time to catch her.. and i mean not *snap*.

 

[Batdetective]

To this day, the marketing campaign fulfill its purposes. It wants to speculate. And it's exactly what we do.

So, is it so obvious that it can't be true?
Or is it so obvious so we think it can't be true, and it turns out to be true afterall?

It's THE question. Is it Bluff or Double Bluff?


Side note: I just found out that Gwen is 17 years old. When you add 1 and 7, you get 8. 8 is my bad luck number. Every tragic event of my life has a 8 hidden somewhere.
She dies.
No need to argue, point proven.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

Argh my head...

Hahahaha of course man its proven now

 

[spider_shadow]

I think the third one is still considered bad.

Note the sarcasm face.

 

[sl500jazz]

I do truly believe that she'll die at the clock tower, It makes so much sense with the theme of this movie being "time".

Gwen Stacy:

...I say this today to remind us that time is luck. So don't waste it living somebody else's life. Make yours count for something. Fight for what matters to you. No matter what...

Or Gwen heads to London to do what she feels is best for herself. It could go either way.

Btw, I am thoroughly entertained by this thread right now. t:

 

[Airnick]

Gwen Stacy:


Or Gwen heads to London to do what she feels is best for herself. It could go either way.

Btw, I am thoroughly entertained by this thread right now. t:

It's possible but I'm leaning Toward her not making it there. I agree we may not always agree on everything but that's what makes it fun.

 

[sl500jazz]

^ Yup. If everyone agreed 100% on everything, these threads would be boring. It's cool to see all the different points of view.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

I just found this on google but i dunno where is from.

 

[Airnick]

I just found this but i dunno where is from.

Those images are from the SDCC footage.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

Ah my bad i never see it until now

 

[Airnick]

Ah my bad i never see it until now

It's all good Andrew.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

Okay then..

 

[Picard Sisko]

Whoever said The Amazing Spider-Man 3 will suck…

 

[Batdetective]

Alright, I will try to make my best post to date with arguments I think are worth mentionning.

You need to think of yourself as a writer. We have given information, and we need to take care of everything.
Here is everything we know so far:

1. Electro is a vilain
2. Rhino is a vilain
3. Harry is a friend that turns out to be a Goblin
4. Peter and Gwen seem to be together
5. There's a graduating scene
6. Felicity Jones' character
7. We will learn things about Peter's past
8. Norman Osborn has something to do
9. Gwen Stacy MIGHT die
10. Oscorp are jerks

Now, let's take all those thing and see if they add up. You have THREE HOURS MAX to make it work.
You skip the origin of the hero because it's a sequel.
For the story to work, it needs to contains the following things (no particular order):

1. Introduction
2. You need to develop the Peter-Gwen relationship
3. You need to introduce Harry Osborn
4. You need to introduce Maxwell
5. You need to introduce Rhino
6. You need to *create* Electro
7. You need to *create* The Goblin
8. Harry must have a REASON to dislike Peter/kidnap Gwen
9. Electro needs a REASON to dislike Spider-Man
10. You need cool action scenes so people don't die of boredom
11. You need to find out some things about Peter's past
12. You need to figure out about the whole spying thing
13. You need to give Aunt May some screentime
14. You need to learn what Norman's role/motives is/are about
15. You need to add that graduating scene
16. Uncle Ben/George Stacy must have at least one scene
17. You need to develop a relationship between Peter and Harry
18. You need one (or a few) surprise/twist
19. You need to know what are Oscorp's motives
20. You need a final battle
21. You need a conclusion

That's ALOT of things that needs to happen. If any of these things is missed, the movie CANNOT work. This is a screenwriter law: You DON'T add things for the sake of adding things. Everything MUST make sense.

All I'm saying is with so much things that need to be seen, I fear 3 hours might be not even enough. I have written scripts and I can tell you one thing: pages add up very fast.
My guess is Harry will be introduced in the first 20 minutes. We will see Rhino within the first 30 minutes and Electro will be born under 1 hour. With so many characters, it will take easily an hour to create the whole setting.
So, if BY CHANCE (it's not happening) your runtime is 3 hours, you have a mere 2 hours to resolve everything else. I think 2 hours and a half will be the actual runtime. So 1 hour and a half, or 2 hours at best to to elaborate everything else I mentionned.

THAT'S A LOT OF **** GOING ON!
My point is: You don't have enough time to elaborate Gwen's death in an effective way. If it does happen, it won't be as good as you think it would. There is just so many things that need to be handled in that movie. Adding the death of a major character is a big thing. It cannot be rushed between actions sequences, it cannot happen too fast, you have to be really careful if you want it to be memorable.

Spider-Man 3 was also very over filled with characters and subplots, and it was horrible. But Harry's death also felt unnecessary. It didn't have any impact, it just felt rushed and boring. I always felt that he died so Venom could be considered an ''arch-enemy''.

So yeah. Just think about it. Add everything I have listed above, create a movie about it. EFFECTIVELY, do not come with any far-fetched ********, unanswered questions or ''ass pull'' (look it up, it's a trope)
I want EVERY single point mentionned to be taken care of.
Fail to do this, you CANNOT kill Gwen Stacy. It doesn't work like that, it's unprofessional.

I think there are waaaaay too many things to elaborate in that movie to kill a major character inbetween. It doesn't sound right to me.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

Alright, I will try to make my best post to date with arguments I think are worth mentionning.

You need to think of yourself as a writer. We have given information, and we need to take care of everything.
Here is everything we know so far:

1. Electro is a vilain
2. Rhino is a vilain
3. Harry is a friend that turns out to be a Goblin
4. Peter and Gwen seem to be together
5. There's a graduating scene
6. Felicity Jones' character
7. We will learn things about Peter's past
8. Norman Osborn has something to do
9. Gwen Stacy MIGHT die
10. Oscorp are jerks

Now, let's take all those thing and see if they add up. You have THREE HOURS MAX to make it work.
You skip the origin of the hero because it's a sequel.
For the story to work, it needs to contains the following things (no particular order):

1. Introduction
2. You need to develop the Peter-Gwen relationship
3. You need to introduce Harry Osborn
4. You need to introduce Maxwell
5. You need to introduce Rhino
6. You need to *create* Electro
7. You need to *create* The Goblin
8. Harry must have a REASON to dislike Peter/kidnap Gwen
9. Electro needs a REASON to dislike Spider-Man
10. You need cool action scenes so people don't die of boredom
11. You need to find out some things about Peter's past
12. You need to figure out about the whole spying thing
13. You need to give Aunt May some screentime
14. You need to learn what Norman's role/motives is/are about
15. You need to add that graduating scene
16. Uncle Ben/George Stacy must have at least one scene
17. You need to develop a relationship between Peter and Harry
18. You need one (or a few) surprise/twist
19. You need to know what are Oscorp's motives
20. You need a final battle
21. You need a conclusion

That's ALOT of things that needs to happen. If any of these things is missed, the movie CANNOT work. This is a screenwriter law: You DON'T add things for the sake of adding things. Everything MUST make sense.

All I'm saying is with so much things that need to be seen, I fear 3 hours might be not even enough. I have written scripts and I can tell you one thing: pages add up very fast.
My guess is Harry will be introduced in the first 20 minutes. We will see Rhino within the first 30 minutes and Electro will be born under 1 hour. With so many characters, it will take easily an hour to create the whole setting.
So, if BY CHANCE (it's not happening) your runtime is 3 hours, you have a mere 2 hours to resolve everything else. I think 2 hours and a half will be the actual runtime. So 1 hour and a half, or 2 hours at best to to elaborate everything else I mentionned.

THAT'S A LOT OF **** GOING ON!
My point is: You don't have enough time to elaborate Gwen's death in an effective way. If it does happen, it won't be as good as you think it would. There is just so many things that need to be handled in that movie. Adding the death of a major character is a big thing. It cannot be rushed between actions sequences, it cannot happen too fast, you have to be really careful if you want it to be memorable.

Spider-Man 3 was also very over filled with characters and subplots, and it was horrible. But Harry's death also felt unnecessary. It didn't have any impact, it just felt rushed and boring. I always felt that he died so Venom could be considered an ''arch-enemy''.

So yeah. Just think about it. Add everything I have listed above, create a movie about it. EFFECTIVELY, do not come with any far-fetched ********, unanswered questions or ''ass pull'' (look it up, it's a trope)
I want EVERY single point mentionned to be taken care of.
Fail to do this, you CANNOT kill Gwen Stacy. It doesn't work like that, it's unprofessional.

I think there are waaaaay too many things to elaborate in that movie to kill a major character inbetween. It doesn't sound right to me.

Man i have a good time reading your posts and i hope you are right about Gwen

 

[Picard Sisko]

There isn't as much going on as you think, BatDetective. TDK had a lot going on as well and was very well-written. It probably had more going on than TASM2, but we'll see.

Most of the things you list overlap or tie in together, so its not like there is a number of separate plot lines that have to be shoved in together to make a movie. Spider-Man 3's problem was that it had a number of different stories that didn't meld together: Sandman, Harry's revenge, Peter/MJ relationship, the symbiote/Venom, and so on. There was no central story to that film, which was the main issue there.

With TASM2, everything seems to fit together by a puzzle piece. Let's analyze this:

1. Introduction
What do you mean by introduction? How long does it take to introduce a movie? Chances are the intro will contain the plane crash scene, followed by an introduction to Spider-Man (which is most likely the chase sequence that will include Aleksei, so there is your Rhino intro).

2. You need to develop the Peter-Gwen relationship
You mean further develop it. This is a sequel, so the relationship has been established and somewhat developed already. Half the job is done.

3. You need to introduce Harry Osborn
This is key, but also intertwines with the introduction of Norman Osborn, Peter being told about being spied on, and more about his parents.

4. You need to introduce Maxwell
This intertwines with the opening chase sequence of the movie.

5. You need to introduce Rhino
As said earlier, being introduced in the introduction.

6. You need to *create* Electro
7. You need to *create* The Goblin
Okay, how long are transformations scenes? Barely a few minutes probably.

8. Harry must have a REASON to dislike Peter/kidnap Gwen
That won't be very hard to establish. He probably wants to capture Spider-Man and get something from him, perhaps for research to save his father.

9. Electro needs a REASON to dislike Spider-Man
Yup. He certainly does.

10. You need cool action scenes so people don't die of boredom
We are getting 3-4 action scenes tops, and they don't take up more than 5 minutes each.

11. You need to find out some things about Peter's past
12. You need to figure out about the whole spying thing
This overlaps with the Harry Osborn scenes.

13. You need to give Aunt May some screentime
She will get it, but how much screen time does she need? 15 minutes overall?

14. You need to learn what Norman's role/motives is/are about
We pretty much learned his motives in the first film, and we'll expand on them some more.

15. You need to add that graduating scene
Well if you are just going to start listing specific scenes, of course its going to sound cluttered. How long is a graduation scene? Under 5 minutes probably… not even.

16. Uncle Ben/George Stacy must have at least one scene
George Stacy's scene is the graduation scene. Uncle Ben might show up, but it would be very quick if at all.

17. You need to develop a relationship between Peter and Harry
Redundant addition to your list.

18. You need one (or a few) surprise/twist
I'm sure there will be one or two.

19. You need to know what are Oscorp's motives
They're trying to cure Norman Osborn.

20. You need a final battle
You already mentioned fight scenes.

21. You need a conclusion
…. Yes, the movie needs to end.

 

[Picard Sisko]

So 2 hours and 30 minutes approximately is enough time to cover this. Also based on how Orci and Kurtzman wrote the Star Trek movies, the pacing of this film could be very fast. They don't waste a single second in those films.

 

[Airnick]

There isn't as much going on as you think, BatDetective. TDK had a lot going on as well and was very well-written. It probably had more going on than TASM2, but we'll see.

Most of the things you list overlap or tie in together, so its not like there is a number of separate plot lines that have to be shoved in together to make a movie. Spider-Man 3's problem was that it had a number of different stories that didn't meld together: Sandman, Harry's revenge, Peter/MJ relationship, the symbiote/Venom, and so on. There was no central story to that film, which was the main issue here.

With TASM2, everything seems to fit together by a puzzle piece. Let's analyze this:

1. Introduction
What do you mean by introduction? How long does it take to introduce a movie? Chances are the intro will contain the plane crash scene, followed by an introduction to Spider-Man (which is most likely the chase sequence that will include Aleksei, so there is your Rhino intro).

2. You need to develop the Peter-Gwen relationship
You mean further develop it. This is a sequel, so the relationship has been established and somewhat developed already. Half the job is done.

3. You need to introduce Harry Osborn
This is key, but also intertwines with the introduction of Norman Osborn, Peter being told about being spied on, and more about his parents.

4. You need to introduce Maxwell
This intertwines with the opening chase sequence of the movie.

5. You need to introduce Rhino
As said earlier, being introduced in the introduction.

6. You need to *create* Electro
7. You need to *create* The Goblin
Okay, how long are transformations scenes? Barely a few minutes probably.

8. Harry must have a REASON to dislike Peter/kidnap Gwen
That won't be very hard to establish. He probably wants to capture Spider-Man and get something from him, perhaps for research to save his father.

9. Electro needs a REASON to dislike Spider-Man
Yup. He certainly does.

10. You need cool action scenes so people don't die of boredom
We are getting 3-4 action scenes tops, and they don't take up more than 5 minutes each.

11. You need to find out some things about Peter's past
12. You need to figure out about the whole spying thing
This overlaps with the Harry Osborn scenes.

13. You need to give Aunt May some screentime
She will get it, but how much screen time does she need? 15 minutes overall?

14. You need to learn what Norman's role/motives is/are about
We pretty much learned his motives in the first film, and we'll expand on them some more.

15. You need to add that graduating scene
Well if you are just going to start listing specific scenes, of course its going to sound cluttered. How long is a graduation scene? Under 5 minutes probably… not even.

16. Uncle Ben/George Stacy must have at least one scene
George Stacy's scene is the graduation scene. Uncle Ben might show up, but it would be very quick if at all.

17. You need to develop a relationship between Peter and Harry
Redundant addition to your list.

18. You need one (or a few) surprise/twist
I'm sure there will be one or two.

19. You need to know what are Oscorp's motives
They're trying to cure Norman Osborn.

20. You need a final battle
You already mentioned fight scenes.

21. You need a conclusion
…. Yes, the movie needs to end.

All of this.

 

[Spideyfan117]

Well said, Picard.

 

[Andrew Lucas]

2:45 its enough and yeah i think there is much things happening in this movie besides "Lets go cure Norman"

 

[Picard Sisko]

Well said, Picard.

Thank you.

 

[Picard Sisko]

2:45 i think its enough and yeah i think there is much things happening in this movie besides "Lets go cure Norman"

I doubt it will be TDKR length. Either 2 hours 30 minutes or probably less. Maybe 2:20 will work.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Baddetective, I'm just curious… what have you written?