The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR Batsuit Discussion Thread VI

[cryptic name]

If they do wind up doing a simpler, fabric suit, what I would want is for Batman to get beaten by Bane in the TDK suit. Then while recuperating Bruce comes to the conclusion that he's become too reliant on technology and takes Bane on again in fabric suit with no weapons.

 

[JAK®]

Good point. Still, a powering down I think was justified after the Silver Age, if not necessarily to the point that John Byrne did. Superman in general is a hard character to write faithfully to his modern characterization while still being interesting. In terms of characterization, the modern Superman is about as alien as his physiology: Where most characters, superheroes or otherwise, like Batman are based on their character depth, modern Superman is actually based on his lack thereof: He's intentionally designed to be perfect and flawless to be a moral exemplar. This causes him to be a simple character, which coupled with his immense power makes it hard to really challenge him in a physical, intellectual, or moral way. Especially today, it is hard to relate to his simplistic views on morality and moral issues, because "doing the right thing" is not as simple as it sounds in this day and age when there are so many thought processes, moral and ethical systems, and philosophic viewpoints on what the aforementioned "right thing" is.
Thoughts on this analysis of Superman in our day and age?

Superman is a simple character. But simple characters can often be the most effective. The problem is nowadays he is written like a Marvel superhero. Except they don't want to give him flaws. Which makes him boring. The solution isn't to give him flaws, it's to stop writing him like a Marvel superhero. The Marvel superhero is a soap opera character. The big events are based on what happens in the character's personal life, with the superhero action being secondary. Which works great for Spider-Man, but Superman isn't that kind of character. Superman is closer to mythical characters like Hercules, Odysseus and Moses. His character is explored through the fantastic adventures he has. This doesn't make him a shallow or boring character, because this way his stories become more allegorical and philosophical in nature rather than a character study. So, yes, without that style of storytelling, Superman is a boring character. But that isn't a problem with Superman himself. It's just that for the past 20 years very few people knew how to write him.

 

[BatScot]

But why? Why would Batman start wearing fabric over his armor?

There is no over, there is only integration—the fabric is the armor; the armor is the fabric.

What practical purpose would it serve?

A variation of a spall shield.

People who want to see this want to see it for one reason and one reason only: because it would be more like the comics.

That is one reason to be sure, but it is not the only one.

 

[BatScot]

The Batsuit has ceramics. That was what Christopher Nolan intended.

Batman Tech HISTP Aired on Monday, Dec 27, 2010 at 11:00 AM
MOSKOWITZ : “The Batsuit's flexible armor-plated design parallels an actual technology called ceramic armor”

The operative words here being “flexible” and “parallels”.

Moskowtiz does not say the batsuit uses ceramics only that the armor used for the batsuit parallels the technique used to create ceramic armor.

Moskowtiz then goes on to talk about Ceradyne armor, its composition, its effectiveness, and—notably—its usage in modern body armor. And while certainly lighter in comparison to steel, Ceradyne is neither flexible nor light in the sense necessary for a batsuit.

So while ceramic armor was discussed in a comparative context, the batsuit is made of ‘hardened Kevlar plates over titanium-dipped tri-weave fibers for flexibility’ NOT ceramics.

I am 100% certain he does.

It is 100% proven he does not. Period, end of story.

 

[Godzilla2014]

Superman is a simple character. But simple characters can often be the most effective. The problem is nowadays he is written like a Marvel superhero. Except they don't want to give him flaws. Which makes him boring. The solution isn't to give him flaws, it's to stop writing him like a Marvel superhero. The Marvel superhero is a soap opera character. The big events are based on what happens in the character's personal life, with the superhero action being secondary. Which works great for Spider-Man, but Superman isn't that kind of character. Superman is closer to mythical characters like Hercules, Odysseus and Moses. His character is explored through the fantastic adventures he has. This doesn't make him a shallow or boring character, because this way his stories become more allegorical and philosophical in nature rather than a character study. So, yes, without that style of storytelling, Superman is a boring character. But that isn't a problem with Superman himself. It's just that for the past 20 years very few people knew how to write him.

I agree. I was saying that I think that has been the cause of his decline. His simplicity as a character ironically makes him harder to write for most writers because of his of lack of depth.

A variation of a spall shield.

A spall liner is only useful if it is underneath the hard armor plating.

 

[BatScot]

A spall liner is only useful if it is underneath the hard armor plating.

From the same source as above:

MOSKOWITZ: The final step is we have to put out an outer layer. The outer layer is called the spall shield. So when a bullet comes in, not only do you stop it and catch the fragments in the back, but there may be a little bit that tends to fly in the wrong directions."

Now if you were willing to place 100% certainty in 'Batman Tech' with regards to ceramics surely you'll give them some leeway with respect to a spall shield.

But lest ye doubt:

"A lightweight armor having a durable spall cover for suppressing debris that would otherwise be ejected from the armor as a result of the impact of a projectile or missile on the lightweight armor"

A lightweight armor laminate comprising of a fabric cover

 

[Godzilla2014]

From the same source as above:

MOSKOWITZ: The final step is we have to put out an outer layer. The outer layer is called the spall shield. So when a bullet comes in, not only do you stop it and catch the fragments in the back, but there may be a little bit that tends to fly in the wrong directions."

Now if you were willing to place 100% certainty in 'Batman Tech' with regards to ceramics surely you'll give them some leeway with respect to a spall shield.

But lest ye doubt:

"A lightweight armor having a durable spall cover for suppressing debris that would otherwise be ejected from the armor as a result of the impact of a projectile or missile on the lightweight armor"

A lightweight armor laminate comprising of a fabric cover

The spall liner is on the outside of the plate to prevent the shards from penetrating into the wearer. The point is it has to be present between the plate and the person wearing it to be effective.

 

[BatScot]

The spall liner is on the outside of the plate to prevent the shards from penetrating into the wearer. The point is it has to be present between the plate and the person wearing it to be effective.

TO PROTECT FROM DEBRIS EJECTED FROM FRONT:

“a spall cover to protect the impact face of light weight armor products from being damaged during normal use, and to protect damage to people or equipment if the armor is hit with a high-impact projectile or missile, such that debris is ejected from the front surface of the armor. The invention can be used as an insert to body armor, and the spall cover could also be used as an additional cover on any existing ceramic-based armor systems.”

DURABILITY:

“The purpose of the invention is to provide complete spall suppression and durability for the ceramic armor. That is, no spall shall be ejected from the front surface of the armor… the invention shall provide durability”

As I said, a 'variant', and in this case the variant places an additional spall component on the outer layer.

 

[Lencho01]

Imagine the possibilities with a suit like this or Spider-Man's...

[YT]RcmCUF9nvK0[/YT]

 

[Saint]

I've been saying for a while now that a Batsuit constructed like the Tron suits would be pretty ideal.

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

I've been saying for a while now that a Batsuit constructed like the Tron suits would be pretty ideal.

Agreed, I liked the Tron suits alot.

 

[Doc Samson]

Superman is a simple character. But simple characters can often be the most effective. The problem is nowadays he is written like a Marvel superhero. Except they don't want to give him flaws. Which makes him boring. The solution isn't to give him flaws, it's to stop writing him like a Marvel superhero. The Marvel superhero is a soap opera character. The big events are based on what happens in the character's personal life, with the superhero action being secondary. Which works great for Spider-Man, but Superman isn't that kind of character. Superman is closer to mythical characters like Hercules, Odysseus and Moses. His character is explored through the fantastic adventures he has. This doesn't make him a shallow or boring character, because this way his stories become more allegorical and philosophical in nature rather than a character study. So, yes, without that style of storytelling, Superman is a boring character. But that isn't a problem with Superman himself. It's just that for the past 20 years very few people knew how to write him.

Agree wholeheartedly. I always felt the main fault with Superman recently is their dire need to try and make him sympathetic enough for us to relate to him. I think that's the wrong approach, he's supposed to be better than us, not one of us.

He's the beacon, the example of how to live a better way. We should be in awe of him not because he's a downtrodden, sensitive or vulnerable alien but because he's a god on earth, tangible enough to save us, mythical enough to inspire...

 

[the dmg]

no, putting fabric or leather over armor...what? why is that necessary? for looks? that is stepping out of the design: this batsuit is meant to function for mobility. there is no point in putting fabric or leather over it because otherwise, we would already have a better looking suit than TDK. it wont happen in Nolans films, i can guarantee you

How is that stepping out of the design? Why can't the Batsuit function and look good at the same time?

I've been saying for a while now that a Batsuit constructed like the Tron suits would be pretty ideal.

I completely agree. I still want to see someone manip it into a Batsuit.

 

[StarLord]

I've been saying for a while now that a Batsuit constructed like the Tron suits would be pretty ideal.

I saw a video on YouTube by Stadium Comics and they pointed out that Batman's new look for the DC re-launch is kind of ''Tron like''.

They show a picture of it but it's too far away to see any real detail.

 

[JAK®]

I agree. I was saying that I think that has been the cause of his decline. His simplicity as a character ironically makes him harder to write for most writers because of his of lack of depth.

But he doesn't lack depth. Writers find him hard to write purely based on that misconception. Just about every story arc for the past decade has been focused on 'subverting' Superman, trying to give him some 'depth' and all it's done is made him look ineffective and weak. Again, they're trying to write him as a Marvel character. They simply don't understand him.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

Well said Jak, the characters are only as deep as you read into them. And unfortunately Superman has been a mouthpiece of verbal diarrhoea for years. I'm looking forward to the reboot and a good Superman writer taking over.

 

[Lencho01]

I've been saying for a while now that a Batsuit constructed like the Tron suits would be pretty ideal.

Yep, since it looks enough like "real armor" but he'd still be able to move very well. If people are really going to have issue with it, just say it's bullet proof to some extent. Or the audience can simply assume that it is since Batman doesn't have any powers. Oh, and it'd be great if we never saw him get shot anyway to even make it less of an issue.

 

[the dmg]

 

[Knight Rise]

save the Tron design for Batman Beyond

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

A suit like that could work so well for a Batman suit, all I can do is hope. I'm talking style and fabric wise by the way, not the sci fi lights and glow.

They're sleek and allow the actor to move around very well, and could easily have small bits of armor attached on top or even below the surface of the fabric.

Someone honestly tell me why this style of suit wouldn't work on film for Batman.

 

[RedSkull]

I can't imagine them going for a LESS armored look if Bane is involved. Unlike most I don't mind the look of the TDK Batsuit...in fact i Prefer it over the Batman Begins version.

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

Armor stlyed suit with flexibility YES Puzzle piece suit from TDK again NO!

 

[Saint]

I can't imagine them going for a LESS armored look if Bane is involved.

That doesn't really follow; Bane doesn't hit harder than bullets or explosions.

 

[the dmg]

save the Tron design for Batman Beyond

Never! t:

 

[regwec]

That doesn't really follow; Bane doesn't hit harder than bullets or explosions.

And fighting him may be easier if not swathed in ill-fitting rubber.