What is Southern Culture?

[Thundercrack85]

Biology goes smooth in public schools. In private schools its hit or miss. My own ignored genetics and anything remotely like evolution or spun it to be christian like.

Which I have to say is rather odd. Because, you'd think if it were taught uncontroversially, at least in public high schools, why the hell does 75% of the population disbelieve it?

Granted, I only saw the public school half of the issue, so, for all I know they go to church on Sunday and it's an hour of their pastor telling them they're being taught (to quote Georgia congressman Paul Broun), "lies straight from the pit of hell".

I don't get how they can go to school, presumably pass said biology class and remain so ignorant. I assume it must be religious indoctrination.

Most believe men and dinosaurs coexisted too. Which raises even more questions.

 

[Marvolo]

Which I have to say is rather odd. Because, you'd think if it were taught uncontroversially, at least in public high schools, why the hell does 75% of the population disbelieve it?

Granted, I only saw the public school half of the issue, so, for all I know they go to church on Sunday and it's an hour of their pastor telling them they're being taught (to quote Georgia congressman Paul Broun), "lies straight from the pit of hell".

I don't get how they can go to school, presumably pass said biology class and remain so ignorant. I assume it must be religious indoctrination.

Most believe men and dinosaurs coexisted too. Which raises even more questions.

I read in the God Dellusion about a scientist who's name escapes me that was raised fundamentalist christian. He studied biology and was on his way to do great things and gave it all up. His reason: he knew science was sound, he knew the evidence was there, but he also knew what the bible told him. That God created it all in six days. Due to his fundamentalism and sola scriptura he said he couldn't turn away from God and his Word no matter what man had discovered in science. He even said it was probably foolish. Fundamentalist take it very literally and the Bible comes before all and is all they need. I recently had a friend say that exact thing when we got into an argument and accused me of attempting to turn them from their faith.

And yes the pastors do say that evolution is a lie and straight from satan himself then go onto talk about how we didn't come from monkeys. As any learned man knows that is not at all what evolution proposes.

Sola scriptura doctrine has caused some of the worst deliberate ignorance that I know of. Jesus never said be woefully and purposefully ignorant.

We probably shouldn't get too deep into this tho because its off topic and could spiral this thread. Suffice it to say, most kids dick around in school and then dick around in church. What bits they do hear get twisted by adults and other things resulting in a youth that doesn't know what to believe or think. Luckily many find their way to the facts in time.

 

[Doctor Evo]

Biology goes smooth in public schools.

Really? Teachers don't get flak for teaching evolution in public schools?

 

[Thundercrack85]

Generally no. But they're sometimes encouraged to bring up the "other theories".

And by other theories I of course mean creationis- intelligent design.

Not that it really matters since it goes in one ear, and right out the other.

 

[Marvolo]

Generally no. But they're sometimes encouraged to bring up the "other theories".

And by other theories I of course mean creationis- intelligent design.

Not that it really matters since it goes in one ear, and right out the other.

^this.

The kids don't really care in most case. They just want to get through the day and out of school. The principal and school board just want to keep the peace. The teacher wants to do their job and teach the kids. If their is a problem it happens like so. Kids get home. The parents ask them what they learned, kid relays some of what they learned, and the parent doesn't like what they hear so they cause a stink. Its usually the parents who cause problems.

 

[cherokeesam]

Lived in the South all my life, and it is where I feel most at home.

Its really hard to explain just what makes the South the South, or a person "southern". The South just is, and the people just are. Its in the land, and its in the blood. You can't really fully understand it unless you've grown up in it. The more cynical might have you believe its a bunch of hatred, but there is something here something deep that I haven't found anywhere else. I love it, despite how I ***** about it around here, and I wouldn't trade it for the world.

Yes, you have your bigots, your racists, and your religious nuts like any place. We just have our own unique brand in high concentration. Very conservative. The liberals don't speak out much. While it is true there is still plenty of racism, interracial relations are generally smooth. I have african americans in my own family, and have grown up seeing them as no different from any other race. My grandparents generation are still coming around to that idea. Things move slower here, and change is slow.

Nothing like going to a smokehouse, getting a slab of ribs, and a sweet ice tea in the middle of July in the South. And the country! Don't even get me started on the country. The Blue Ridge Mountains, Smokey Mountains, just the mountains in general are something to behold. Standing at an overlook staring out at hundreds of miles of wilderness you really get a sense of what it must have been like when the mountain men first saw the Gap and began their journey west.

Side note: My grandmother didn't have indoor plumbing until the 80s. You know what they say "If the outhouse ain't broke..." lol.

My old folks saw those rows and rows of mountains and just settled down, permanently. The "mountain men" were the ones who tried to "persuade" the rest of us to move west....we're still not too keen about that.

 

[Marvolo]

My old folks saw those rows and rows of mountains and just settled down, permanently. The "mountain men" were the ones who tried to "persuade" the rest of us to move west....we're still not too keen about that.

Mid 1700s my family got to North Carolina and put down roots immediately. Hooked up with the natives and got land. Said to hell with whatever lie across the Appalachian lol. We are still like that. Even to this day, I only know of one person in my family who went West. A few have went north and further south, but we for the most part have hugged the Appalachian.

 

[Doctor Evo]

^this.

The kids don't really care in most case. They just want to get through the day and out of school. The principal and school board just want to keep the peace. The teacher wants to do their job and teach the kids. If their is a problem it happens like so. Kids get home. The parents ask them what they learned, kid relays some of what they learned, and the parent doesn't like what they hear so they cause a stink. Its usually the parents who cause problems.

That's about what I figured. That would annoy the bejeezus out of me.

 

[Juicy J]

I read in the God Dellusion about a scientist who's name escapes me that was raised fundamentalist christian. He studied biology and was on his way to do great things and gave it all up. His reason: he knew science was sound, he knew the evidence was there, but he also knew what the bible told him. That God created it all in six days. Due to his fundamentalism and sola scriptura he said he couldn't turn away from God and his Word no matter what man had discovered in science. He even said it was probably foolish. Fundamentalist take it very literally and the Bible comes before all and is all they need. I recently had a friend say that exact thing when we got into an argument and accused me of attempting to turn them from their faith.

And yes the pastors do say that evolution is a lie and straight from satan himself then go onto talk about how we didn't come from monkeys. As any learned man knows that is not at all what evolution proposes.

Sola scriptura doctrine has caused some of the worst deliberate ignorance that I know of. Jesus never said be woefully and purposefully ignorant.

We probably shouldn't get too deep into this tho because its off topic and could spiral this thread. Suffice it to say, most kids dick around in school and then dick around in church. What bits they do hear get twisted by adults and other things resulting in a youth that doesn't know what to believe or think. Luckily many find their way to the facts in time.

That's my biggest problem with the people I live around, and a lot of the people I love dearly.
They cling to their fundamentalist beliefs so dogmatically that they appear ignorant and childish in the face of opposition.
And I'm a bible believing Christian, don't get me wrong. I just also happen to believe in evolution and for the life of me can't understand why it's such a hot topic among Christians.

 

[Marvolo]

That's my biggest problem with the people I live around, and a lot of the people I love dearly.
They cling to their fundamentalist beliefs so dogmatically that they appear ignorant and childish in the face of opposition.
And I'm a bible believing Christian, don't get me wrong. I just also happen to believe in evolution and for the life of me can't understand why it's such a hot topic among Christians.

For the political backers of ID its just an agenda. I don't think the average person gives two flying squirrel ****s until someone has a differing view. The world is here. Knowing the machinations of its origin isn't necessary to live. Scientists can deal with that stuff and we can all reap the rewards. My big issue is the few trying to eradicate facts to push an agenda.

I don't see how Evolution takes away from God. Personally I find the slow process of evolution amazing. All evolution does to Christianity is show that creation in genesis is nothing more than a metaphor or allegory. I'm cool with that. Surely God uses metaphor and allegory. Jesus used parables. The fundamentalist argument is "well if the genesis creation is allegory or not literal how can we know for sure what else is literal?" To which I say "Use your brain and the evidence at hand." Once again it comes back to not being willfully ignorant. At some point in fundamentalist development it became accepted to act like a confused child. This notion has spread like wildfire and continued to burn in the South.

 

[Bruce Banner]

I live in Virginia, but I've also lived in Philadelphia and a couple places in New Jersey.

If I had to choose, I'd pick Virginia in a heart beat.

Everything is typically a lot more laid back, people are happier/friendlier. Yes, I would say there are more religious people in Virginia, but its NEVER been a source of issues - churchs here try to help out the communities and that's about as visible as they get, no damning others for differing beliefs. There are still plenty of other faiths, atheists and where I live is a melting pot (hispanic, indian, middle-eastern, african american, asian). People around here love their cookouts, hiking, hopping on their boats and speeding down the rivers. There's lots of hunters and fishing, horse back riding, dirt biking, etc, though none of it is as all-encompassing as you'd imagine. It's pretty diversified. I've never ridden a horse, hunted, rode a dirt bike or stepped foot on a farm (outside of a elementary school field trip).

I'm in Richmond, VA, attending VCU and it is very much a melting pot within the city, but also LOADED with a **** ton of hipsters. Outside the city limits it has the " 'merica" southern vibe or snot nosed, yacht club, brats.

While I was born in the south, I've never really adopted any tradition or anything, I've just done my own thing like always and I've traveled frequently enough that I can't really call any place in particular as "home".

 

[mrvlknight21]

Ive lived my whole life in Georgia, but in a medium sized city, surrounded by rural areas. So, from where I live to a shoort drive (45 minutes) outside of my city changes a LOT of things-demographics, perceptions, beliefs, etc.

That said sweet tea is THE DRINK for me and most anyone I know.
Slavery-never gets talked about, ever. Seriously.
NASCAR is loved by many (but not by me).
LOTS of churches...as another person said, you could easily find 3-4 in a single mile stretch.
LOTS of college football fanatics.

 

[Spider-Who?]

I think a big aspect of religious people having a problem with evolution is that isn't really about the theory itself...

Science should be an extremely unbiased thing - it should be a constantly evolving (no pun meant) collection of knowledge and understanding. Nothing more. But so many people bastardize and misuse that knowledge - evolution in particular - as a way to lay credence to their anti-religious views. Instead of it remaining a pure pursuit of human understanding, it's become such a political tool...a weapon of persecution one might say; so much so that the actual facts get lost in the chaos of rhetoric and arguments. This only pushes religious people away even more - they're told that evolution disproves God, instead of being taught the facts of evolution in a clear, unbiased way. This makes a lot of religious people close their ears to the actual science, in a not entirely unjustified way. But it seems religious people are pretty equally divided concerning evolution - they either don't accept it at all, or they DO accept it, but instead of rejecting their faith (as atheists would like), they believe that it was God's avenue for creating life. Atheists HATE that - religious people can't win; if they dismiss evolution, they're labeled ignorant creationist fools, and if they accept evolution (without dismissing their faith) they're labeled ignorant intelligent design fools. This only continues the cycle of uncertain people shying from it.

This is why evolution is such a hot topic in the south more than the north. On average, people are more religious in the south, which simply means that the arguments between the religious and atheist are that much louder. It really doesn't have to do with the intelligence of the religious, but it has a lot to do with the inappropriate focus many people place on evolution in the first place. People don't take kindly to being told they're a fool, and they especially don't take kindly to being told their faith is a lie. It really is no surprise a lot of religious people shy away from evolution.

I believe in God, but I also accept that evolution has a pretty good grasp of things. If that means I believe in "intelligent design", then so be it, I guess. But science is only as perfect as the scientists (case in point: many dinosaurs thought to be separate species diverged through evolution are being reclassified as the same species, just at different ages/sexes), and I'm really interested to see where better findings and further knowledge takes us. There's a heck of a lot that can be done with understanding evolution.

An interesting article I found:

http://www.dailytech.com/Study+Indi...led+by+Fear+of+the+Uncertain/article19743.htm

Yet, 44 percent of respondents to a recent 2007 Gallop Poll of U.S. citizens stated that they believed that God created man in its current form (pure creationism) and 44 percent stated they believed God guided human evolution (intelligent design).

Intriguingly, while many people believe religious reasons to be the driving factor, for many people it appears that fear of randomness and uncontrolled circumstances is one of the major motivations for people to deny the theory of evolution.

So perhaps resistance to evolutionary theory is based less on one's beliefs and more on an inherent human fear of uncertainty.

By determining that part of the mental roadblock to evolution is in the uncertainty, college and public schools instructors may be able to present the theory in a less threatening way.

 

[Spider-Who?]

Just a shame people don't realize that both sides relied on each other for the economic growth and stability of this nation.

People don't realize that? If you're insinuating that I am one of those people, then I think you totally misunderstood my post. I'll try and clear that up...

Agriculture in the south didnt happen because of northerners pulling their weight, it came about because the soil for widespread agriculture was in the south not the north.

You're correct, but that isn't entirely accurate... As of around 2007, Iowa has about 90,000 farms, Illinois has over 70,000, Pennsylvania has 58,000, Michigan has over 52,000, Minnesota has around 80,000...all of these northern states have more farms than southern states like Mississippi (42,000), West Virginia (21,000), Louisiana (28,000), Georgia (47,500). These are just a few examples. Yes, advancements and technology have had an effect on the production of agriculture, but it's pretty safe to assume that the inherent fertility of soil and climate of a state influences the amount of farms they have, which points to the fact that the North was far from incapable of supporting their own agricultural needs. Yes, there are more southern states that are better suited for agriculture, but northern states are hardly incapable of it themselves.

But in any case, I was making a point (through hyperbole) about modern day Northerners' misunderstanding that the less number of slaves in the north was due to some higher morality or lack of racism. The simple fact is that there just wasn't as much of a need for slaves in the north due to (as you rightly said), the division of agriculture and industry among the states.

 

[Quasimod0]

Lived in Florida my whole life. Its quite nice. The weather is pretty moderate the whole year. I live right on the beach. Lots of churches, thats not a complaint for me as I'm a christian. The people are generally kind to strangers. I wave at people walking around my neighborhood and such. There are some places that have more rednecks than usual. But most redneck people arent the normal redneck stereotype. And no the issue of slavery in the south almost never comes out in normal conversation. And its not like anyone alive had anything to do with it, so it doesnt really matter.

 

[Donnie Darko]

And its not like anyone alive had anything to do with it, so it doesnt really matter.

I wish more people saw it this way.

 

[Quasimod0]

I wish more people saw it this way.

I know how you feel. I hear people all the time on tv and such talk about it as if any of us had anything to do with it. Especially around election time. Drives me crazy. Yes it happened and yes it was bad. But that is way in the past and we dont have to continue to apologize for it because we had nothing to do with it. Oh well

 

[Marvolo]

I know how you feel. I hear people all the time on tv and such talk about it as if any of us had anything to do with it. Especially around election time. Drives me crazy. Yes it happened and yes it was bad. But that is way in the past and we dont have to continue to apologize for it because we had nothing to do with it. Oh well

That's pretty much how I see it as well.

And besides if we want to start apologizing for past atrocities committed in the US we are going to be apologizing for a very long time. Slavery is far from our worst deeds. Native Americans. America commited genocide against them and they live in poverty on the reservations and the most they get is casinos.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

People don't realize that? If you're insinuating that I am one of those people, then I think you totally misunderstood my post. I'll try and clear that up...



You're correct, but that isn't entirely accurate... As of around 2007, Iowa has about 90,000 farms, Illinois has over 70,000, Pennsylvania has 58,000, Michigan has over 52,000, Minnesota has around 80,000...all of these northern states have more farms than southern states like Mississippi (42,000), West Virginia (21,000), Louisiana (28,000), Georgia (47,500). These are just a few examples. Yes, advancements and technology have had an effect on the production of agriculture, but it's pretty safe to assume that the inherent fertility of soil and climate of a state influences the amount of farms they have, which points to the fact that the North was far from incapable of supporting their own agricultural needs. Yes, there are more southern states that are better suited for agriculture, but northern states are hardly incapable of it themselves.

But in any case, I was making a point (through hyperbole) about modern day Northerners' misunderstanding that the less number of slaves in the north was due to some higher morality or lack of racism. The simple fact is that there just wasn't as much of a need for slaves in the north due to (as you rightly said), the division of agriculture and industry among the states.

No I'm not saying you're one of those people.

I'm more along the lines of people who are against taxes going to social or federal programs, because hey, "I did this all myself", and not acknowledging the help that they, and this nation got, whether directly or indirectly, from the actions of other people, and from programs, and from the aid that came from taxes.

Since I'm in a history class right now, this example is coming to mind directly, which is that in the early days of industrialization, a lot of southerners were against their tax dollars going to northern industry because "it's not ours", not realizing that the northern industry was creating a market for the goods that the south was producing, which aided their economy. And vice versa with northern taxpayers having their taxes go to aid the south, not realizing that the south was providing the goods needed for the industries to create a product.

We still see this kind of mentality today. "NOT MY TAXDOLLARS!", not realizing that their tax dollars are going to benefit themselves, as well as other people, because as a society, we are all dependent upon each other one way or another.

 

[RockSP]

And no the issue of slavery in the south almost never comes out in normal conversation. And its not like anyone alive had anything to do with it, so it doesnt really matter.

I know how you feel. I hear people all the time on tv and such talk about it as if any of us had anything to do with it. Especially around election time. Drives me crazy. Yes it happened and yes it was bad. But that is way in the past and we dont have to continue to apologize for it because we had nothing to do with it. Oh well

lol @ "continue" to apologize. No one ever has apologized to me for it, nor do I expect or want them to. But to act like just because something happened in the past that it has no bearing on the present is utterly ridiculous.

 

[Quasimod0]

lol @ "continue" to apologize. No one ever has apologized to me for it, nor do I expect or want them to. But to act like just because something happened in the past that it has no bearing on the present is utterly ridiculous.

That's not what I was implying and I'm sorry you took it that way. We have to learn from the past and it does matter a great deal. But the people who are alive now are not the ones responsible for the atrocities of our past.

 

[chamber-music]

I saw this and wondered what you guys thought

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Having lived in the south for the past few years, originally living in California before that, this whole "southern hospitality" thing is perhaps the most overblown misconception out there about the south.

Not to digress, but I feel that way about "Canada nice." Nothing against the Canadian posters here who are fine, but most Canadians I've met are passive aggressive or downright mean. Ooops, anyway, back to your discussions on the South.

 

[Perfect Cell]

Not to digress, but I feel that way about "Canada nice." Nothing against the Canadian posters here who are fine, but most Canadians I've met are passive aggressive or downright mean. Ooops, anyway, back to your discussions on the South.

We are a kindly, pleasant people! We just don't like Americans...*

*Joking. I think. Although you can never be sure with some of us.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

I like you, SlackBrian. I do have some Canadian friends. But I do find that stereotype about everyone being "nice" there, baffling.