Dark Phoenix X-Men: Dark Phoenix News and Speculation Thread - - - - Part 13

[X-Maniac]

I'm also under the impression that certain things in the test screening were either left out or intentionally shot a certain way. There's no doubt this was screened many times before the test audience. If you recall, there was a big mystery with Jessica Chastain's character. It can't be the fact that she's a shapeshifter because that's in the official synopsis (I realized it doesn't actually say alien). Nothing in that reddit leak hints to this mystery for the character. If you notice, the term "otherworldly" is used to describe her character which doesn't always mean extraterrestrial. It can also translate as transcendental (Kinberg described her character: "[Chastain's] character is way, way smarter than we are"), mystical, supernatural, magical. If they're claiming this film its closer to the comics, then I'm still under the impression her role will mirror something similar to Mastermind in my opinion.


-The leak doesn't describe much of Chastain's character at all, or how she manipulates or influences Jean, or anything about her interactions with Jean.

-Nor Chastain's interaction with McAvoy, which one released image showcased.

-Nor did it say anything much about Jean and Scott which is described in official materials as "a huge part of the emotional core of the movie."

-Or how the Phoenix threatens to overtake Jean's mind and divide the X-men as described in official material.-Didn't allude to anything about the officially released photo of Magneto laying on the ground apprehended and surrounded by armed men.

-Nor did the leak include the "franchise changing twist."

I also think the aliens were a misdirect, or at least the way the test audience saw them, since visual effects weren't complete.

Well, Kinberg did confirm in an online article published May 16 that there are extraterrestrials in the movie.

“It's much more loyal to the original comic than X-Men 3, which told the Dark Phoenix story,” Kinberg shared with ET’s Carly Steel at the Deadpool 2 premiere. “It's a movie that involves extraterrestrial characters, which is not something that we've done in the X-Men franchise before, and is something that is a huge part of the Dark Phoenix saga in the comics.”

https://www.etonline.com/x-men-dark...-extraterrestrial-characters-exclusive-102392

As for Chastain's character specifically, there may have been changes. The original story on the casting said she was Lilandra, then Chastain tweeted she was not playing Lilandra.

During the Reddit leaked info discussion, the poster was asked who Chastain was playing and said:

Spoiler

"I really couldn't tell you because they don't ever say it. She's a generic alien. The cut I saw didn't establish the name of the species or characters. Yes they are all grey. But it could have been due to the lack of cgi? The alien effects were not even close to being finished."

Someone else asked: Wasnt her character name Smith? Its on imdb

The poster replied: "It is and I can only assume because that's the name she uses as a human? So basically aliens land close to a country house and Jessica Chastain is there as a normal human. The alien kills her and shapeshifts into her but with bleached white hair. She then somehow steals the identity of an fbi agent with this body. That's where "smith" comes in I guess?"

And then clarifies:

"So this is how it goes down. Jessica chastain plays a normal human at first (she has red hair) . Aliens land by her fancy house by a lake and they kill them all. The alien that kills Jessica shapeshifts into her but with bleach white hair. Then she meets with another alien in a church (religious parallel is so obvious it hurts) and this alien took the place of an fbi agent and then gets Alien (jessica) identification to go around as an fbi agent. Its stupid and makes no sense lmao"

 

[Cktopl33]

Well, Kinberg did confirm in an online article published May 16 that there are extraterrestrials in the movie.

“It's much more loyal to the original comic than X-Men 3, which told the Dark Phoenix story,” Kinberg shared with ET’s Carly Steel at the Deadpool 2 premiere. “It's a movie that involves extraterrestrial characters, which is not something that we've done in the X-Men franchise before, and is something that is a huge part of the Dark Phoenix saga in the comics.”

https://www.etonline.com/x-men-dark...-extraterrestrial-characters-exclusive-102392

As for Chastain's character specifically, there may have been changes. The original story on the casting said she was Lilandra, then Chastain tweeted she was not playing Lilandra.

During the Reddit leaked info discussion, the poster was asked who Chastain was playing and said:

Spoiler

"I really couldn't tell you because they don't ever say it. She's a generic alien. The cut I saw didn't establish the name of the species or characters. Yes they are all grey. But it could have been due to the lack of cgi? The alien effects were not even close to being finished."

Someone else asked: Wasnt her character name Smith? Its on imdb

The poster replied: "It is and I can only assume because that's the name she uses as a human? So basically aliens land close to a country house and Jessica Chastain is there as a normal human. The alien kills her and shapeshifts into her but with bleached white hair. She then somehow steals the identity of an fbi agent with this body. That's where "smith" comes in I guess?"

And then clarifies:

"So this is how it goes down. Jessica chastain plays a normal human at first (she has red hair) . Aliens land by her fancy house by a lake and they kill them all. The alien that kills Jessica shapeshifts into her but with bleach white hair. Then she meets with another alien in a church (religious parallel is so obvious it hurts) and this alien took the place of an fbi agent and then gets Alien (jessica) identification to go around as an fbi agent. Its stupid and makes no sense lmao"

My point is just because Kinberg said the movie involve extraterrestrials, that doesn't mean HER character actually is one. I think we're lead to believe one thing in official synopsis when its actually something else. He did say there's a franchise changing twist in the movie, as well as something mysterious about her character. You'll note that it is only the press that were speculating she was playing Lilandra or a Skrull, not the official released material for the film.

The only thing it stated about her character was that she was playing an otherworldly shapeshifter. It didn't claim she was an alien shapeshifter. Otherworldly tend to deal more in mystical or transcendental world:

-not belonging to the real world

-concerned with, or preoccupied with a different world (a heavenly, spiritual, immaterial, or imaginary world) than that of the tangible here and now

-Devoted to the world of the mind.

Suggesting qualities of possible illusion, perhaps. Remember, Mastermind can cause his victims to see whatever he wishes them to see. The key thing we're told about her character is "she manipulates Phoenix for her own agenda", similar to what Mastermind did.

As for the reddit info (which is not reliable since that person didn't really attend the test screening), again it explains nothing about her character interaction with any of the other characters basically. Don't you find that odd? The main villain of the movie? It seems like he's only explaining things we already know like the fact that she has blond hair, or her name is Agent Smith so his explanation is she's taken the identity of an FBI agent somehow. Or she's extraterrestrial but we know Kinberg says the movie involves extraterrestrials (never stated she was one). This person doesn't really explain anything about what her character actually does in the movie. We're told from the official synopsis that she influences Jean. But the reddit spoiler gives no information about her interaction with Jean at all. We know she interacts with Xavier at one point from one of the official images. Again, reddit spoiler says nothing about it.

 

[SumT]

They should spend the reshoot cash on doing a new and better cut of X-Men Apocalypse and package that with Dark Phoenix on the Blu-ray. The Kinberg Collection, lol...

that would have sold millions!!

 

[Drexelhand]

The Dark Phoenix Saga comic moments:

* Rescuing Charles Xavier from Dr. Lang's SHIELD space station results in Jean absorbing radiation from solar flares and becoming Phoenix. Is in the film to a degree, although I doubt the X-Sentinels are there.
* X-Men stop D'Ken and the Shi'ar Imperial Guard from harnessing the broken M'Kraan Crystal which Jean repairs. Maybe the crystal is mentioned at most.
* Scott and Jean at Warren's Colorado lookout where she controls his optic beams. Might be in the movie.
* Recruitment of Kitty Pryde leads to the psionic battle between Jean and Emma Frost. Might be in the movie, just without Kitty and maybe Psylocke instead of Emma.
* Mastermind's deception of Jean Grey leads to the corruption of Phoenix. Would be weird to not do this one way or another.
* Dark Phoenix destroys a galaxy under the purview of the Shi'ar Empire. Something will happen to piss off the aliens, hopefully not what it is in the fake leak.
* All of the X-Men but Cyclops try to figure out how to defeat Jean, with Beast constructing an Inhibitor Diadem. This is partly confirmed, although I doubt Beast builds the Diadem.
* Dark Phoenix returns to Earth, confronts her family and nearly kills her father when he disowns her before the X-Men attack her. Again... maybe
* Dark Phoenix defeats the X-Men, but Cyclops refuses to fight her and reaches out to Jean within Phoenix, allowing Xavier to stop her. I'm going for probably.
* The Shi'ar Imperial Guard vs the X-Men with Jean sacrificing herself. A version of this, maybe

The most key story in X-Men involving the Skrulls, however, was one of Claremont's last stories. This involved a group of mercenaries called Warskrulls infiltrating the ranks of the Shi'ar and manipulating Lilandra before the X-Men expose and defeat them. It is entirely possible that if the aliens are Skrulls and not Shi'ar, they could play a similar role but this time in the employ of the Shi'ar against Earth.

Regardless, Kinberg has borrowed a few key moments from the Dark Phoenix Saga, so it is looking more comic accurate than The Last Stand was, but... is it enough?

 

[SumT]

if the movie doesnt have the Hellfire Club and Shiar empire, this is not the comics Phoenix saga, but a movie "inspired in Phoenix concept".

 

[Drexelhand]

if the movie doesnt have the Hellfire Club and Shiar empire, this is not the comics Phoenix saga, but a movie "inspired in Phoenix concept".

The Hellfire Club is a lot less necessary - you could literally substitute them with Evil Mutant Org, but the Shi'ar Empire is a lot more necessary to be the Dark Phoenix Saga.

Its kind of like Avengers 4, that isn't going to be an adaptation of the 80s Infinity stories without Adam Warlock.

 

[kevork89]

Can we not even bother comparing to the comics. Because no comic book movie has been accurate to the source. A lot of things get changed for film. DC, Marvel, Fox have all made comic to movie choices that aren’t exactly the same as the source.

 

[Cktopl33]

if the movie doesnt have the Hellfire Club and Shiar empire, this is not the comics Phoenix saga, but a movie "inspired in Phoenix concept".

They called it a loose adaptation much closer to the comics than X3. They don't need the Hellfire Club shenanigans taking up time for this story in my opinion. I didn't care for that part of the story thread in the comic. Shiar empire would be better but you can still replace it for something similar if needed and done well. The core of the story really is Jean's decent into madness and her inner moral conflict between liking the madness as phoenix and trying to gain control over the madness as Jean Grey.

 

[SumT]

as long as Magneto and his sublopt is in, the rest doesnt matter, right?
who cares about Hellfire Club, the f*** hot and shady Emma Frost and the impressive Shiar Empire? none cares about this boring stuff lol.
Give us more Magneto and Mystique, its much more unique and the creative team hasnt explore them yet.

 

[Cktopl33]

as long as Magneto and his sublopt is in, the rest doesnt matter, right?
who cares about Hellfire Club, the f*** hot and shady Emma Frost and the impressive Shiar Empire? none cares about this boring stuff lol.
Give us more Magneto and Mystique, its much more unique and the creative team hasnt explore them yet.

Hellfire Club? Pass. Emma Frost? They killed her off in Days of Future Past, didn't they? Shiar Empire? Stated they weren't going too intergalactic and the Shiar Empire is way more complex. I don't think there's going to be a moon battle. I also don't think neither Magneto nor Mystique are main central figures in the movie, though. As long as Jean's conflicting inner struggle is defined....that's the main core of the story.

 

[Jh7058622]

^If all that were to be how they adapted it I'd be totally satisfied. No adaption has every element of the comics. In the comics Spider-Man isn't Iron Man's ***** boy he completely manipulates and controls but everyone praises that version for some reason.

 

[Zarex]

^If all that were to be how they adapted it I'd be totally satisfied. No adaption has every element of the comics. In the comics Spider-Man isn't Iron Man's ***** boy he completely manipulates and controls but everyone praises that version for some reason.

Tony taking Peter under his wing is a direct lift from the Civil War comic book and other Spidey stories.

 

[Drexelhand]

Tony taking Peter under his wing is a direct lift from the Civil War comic book and other Spidey stories.

No it isn't. In Marvel chronology, Peter becomes Spider-Man like a year before Tony becomes Iron Man. The Civil War story is Peter unmasking for Iron Man and then later regretting associating with him before siding with Captain America after understanding that Iron Man ruined his life. He beats the hell out of Iron Man after Civil War finishes because Kingpin nearly kills Aunt May.

 

[Jh7058622]

Tony taking Peter under his wing is a direct lift from the Civil War comic book and other Spidey stories.

Bahahaha sure it is... He also builds him the Iron Spider suit and constantly forces him to do things like a boy servant right? You silly silly person. Stop being so silly.

 

[DACrowe]

The more I read of the leaks, the more it seems like he is making it up as he goes. There is a good chance it is real, but I hardly put full stock in it now. Folks, do need to remember salt exists.

 

[DACrowe]

Tony taking Peter under his wing is a direct lift from the Civil War comic book and other Spidey stories.

It is actually one of the least loved Spidey stories ever that was forced so as to make Quesada's horrible One Day More storyline done.

The MCU does it much better. But comic fans had no love for that storyline.

 

[kevork89]

Nothing needs to be a direct translate from page to screen. Harry Potter wasn’t exact, none of the MCU or X-Men have been either. We don’t need he Shi’ar it Hellfire to tell the Dark Phoenix story. Anyone who says they need to be in this for it to work is just being unreasonable because no comic translation has been accurate. However what needs to be done correctly is the motivation, the characters, the reasoning for things happening. That’s why MCU does such a damn good job. Every character serves a purpose. Every character even if small has a fleshed our storyline. Homecoming, Infinity War haven’t exactly been comic accurate. But they are fantastic because the characters are right, the story is right. You can easily adapt Dark Phoenix to just be a about the X-Men and Jeans struggle but if the filmmakers fall into the same issues as they did with Last Stand, Origins and Apocalypse and just have things happen just cause then that’s the underlying issue. And that’s been the underlying issue with what’s wrong with those three I mentioned. We don’t know for sure if Dark Phoenix is like that just yet. But they could nail the characters and the story and if it makes sense then it could work. But at this stage it’s 50/50 and we need to just wait and see.

 

[Zarex]

No it isn't. In Marvel chronology, Peter becomes Spider-Man like a year before Tony becomes Iron Man. The Civil War story is Peter unmasking for Iron Man and then later regretting associating with him before siding with Captain America after understanding that Iron Man ruined his life. He beats the hell out of Iron Man after Civil War finishes because Kingpin nearly kills Aunt May.

Tony mentored Peter during Civil War and worked for Stark Industries during another point in the funny books. It wasn't made up by Feige and company.

Bahahaha sure it is... He also builds him the Iron Spider suit and constantly forces him to do things like a boy servant right? You silly silly person. Stop being so silly.

Why yes, Tony did in fact create an Iron Spider suit for Peter. But he didn't treat him like a boy servant in either the comics or the films. You may want to pay more attention. Bahahaha.

It is actually one of the least loved Spidey stories ever that was forced so as to make Quesada's horrible One Day More storyline done.

The MCU does it much better. But comic fans had no love for that storyline.

I didn't comment on the quality, just on the comic accuracy.

 

[Tymminator]

Tony mentored Peter during Civil War and worked for Stark Industries during another point in the funny books. It wasn't made up by Feige and company.

Why yes, Tony did in fact create an Iron Spider suit for Peter. But he didn't treat him like a boy servant in either the comics or the films. You may want to pay more attention. Bahahaha.



I didn't comment on the quality, just on the comic accuracy.

Actually you could see Tony beginning to mentor Peter even before Civil War in both the New Avengers and even some JMS Spidey stories. True, people may like them or not, and that’s up to them, but yeah the groundwork was there which is why when Civil War finally happened, it was easier for Peter to listen to Stark about revealing his secret ID.

Anyway, on to Dark Phoenix...

Does anyone think that maybe the reshoots may be them possibly adding a bigger role for some characters? Like Storm and Nightcrawler for example?

 

[Drexelhand]

Tony mentored Peter during Civil War and worked for Stark Industries during another point in the funny books. It wasn't made up by Feige and company.

Why yes, Tony did in fact create an Iron Spider suit for Peter. But he didn't treat him like a boy servant in either the comics or the films. You may want to pay more attention. Bahahaha.



I didn't comment on the quality, just on the comic accuracy.

Did you read Civil War? It was nothing like that. Spider-Man deadpans and calls him dad or uncle a few times if I remember because he sees something of a father figure in him, but not a mentor, especially not when Spidey's actually been the more experienced hero and is even presented as such.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/iron-man-spider-man-complicated-886688

https://comicnewbies.com/2016/04/02/iron-spider-man-vs-iron-man/

Does anyone think that maybe the reshoots may be them possibly adding a bigger role for some characters? Like Storm and Nightcrawler for example?

Nightcrawler I can see them using to add more humor into the movie, but Storm wasn't really a big character in The Dark Phoenix Saga. Until the 90s, her friendship with Jean was always developed behind the scenes.

 

[Alison Blaire]

Deadpool 2 wig = X2 wig

 

[EnDz0n3]

Shipp just tweeted that’s not her hair in Dark Phoenix, presumably talking about

Spoiler

that wig from the cameo. I mean it was fairly obvious but it’s good to get a confirmation.

 

[Jh7058622]

I have no idea why some people enjoy the dark roots. It's nonsensical and isn't comic accurate. The same people saying every detail needs to be the same from the comics (you know cause Bucky was a grown man in the comics when he first was introduced ) are saying she needs dark roots. That's like saying people of African American descent can't have naturally blonde hair. It happens people.

 

[Alison Blaire]

Dark Phoenix wig

 

[GuestStar2004]

I have no idea why some people enjoy the dark roots. It's nonsensical and isn't comic accurate. The same people saying every detail needs to be the same from the comics (you know cause Bucky was a grown man in the comics when he first was introduced ) are saying she needs dark roots. That's like saying people of African American descent can't have naturally blonde hair. It happens people.

Presumbaly the dark roots are to give her hair a little visual spark.

She doesn't have it in the comics so probably not many will appreciate it.