Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Sports' started by The Incredible Hulk, Apr 11, 2019.
Whatever they choose, it will probably still be offensive to somebody.
I know many Washington fans, and they're all disappointed that the franchise didn't have a name and logos ready to go today. They feel like they've been left in limbo.
step 1. change name to Washington Sentinels
step 2. sign Shane Falco as QB
step 3. win Championship
They need Danny Bateman to anchor their defense though
I grew up in the DC area (northern VA) and still live here today and while I may be a Raiders fan I still don't like the idea of them changing their name. While I get why some may want them to change their name. However most Native American tribes have said they have no problem with the name or that they have bigger things to worry about than a football teams name. Also a lot of native Americans take pride in that name and the team and some of their schools use that name and logo so should we ask them to change that as well. I also disagree with people who had no problem getting rich off the name and franchise for years now asking for it to be changed (yeah I'm looking at you FedEX). Once again I get why some may want it to be change and I'm in difference either way but doing this opens up Pandora's box that can't be closed because what if people get offended by the Cowboys name because it's not gender neutral or offended by the Vikings, Raiders, and Bucs names because it represents people who killed and raped women and children. And should the Chiefs name. Should the Patriots change their name and logo because some my find it offensives. Should Yale change it's name because it's relations to slavery. As I said doing this opens up a box that can't be closed not just in the NFL but other sports as well.
Even if it's nothing but white people griping about it they can't really take the risk of losing revenue from it.
I am not sure there are legit stats on whether Native American tribes have said they have no problem with the name, as the polls that have been conducted were heavily flawed to say the least. Though even if that were the case, would that be okay to continue to disrespect the part of the community that clearly has a problem with it, especially considering what the name actually is?
Second, I think there is a fundamental difference what words a group uses inclusively, as opposed to others.
Personally I would change the Chiefs, Seminoles, Indians, and Blackhawks names, simply as It does seem pretty crazy that Native American culture is used in such a manner. You really don't see that with other races and ethnicities.
One difference is that Florida State has the full support of the real Seminole tribe, to use the name.
That's fair then. I guess if it is specific enough and you get that support, that is between the team/school and the tribe.
I don't really see anything wrong with tribe names as team names, especially if the actual tribe supports it. Chiefs as a team name is innocuous enough. But I'm sure the Cleveland Indians will likely change their name soon enough if the Redskins did. It's not as offensive as the Redskins, but it isn't too far off. I still find it strange that the term "Indian" to describe Native Americans even survived the 16th century. It only happened because Columbus thought he reached the Indian ocean when he made landfall in what would later be America.
Once again I understand what you're saying but I still feel this is opening a box that can not be closed.
Second you say there is a fundamental difference to certain words and everything but you are forgetting how quickly words that use to be used to describe things are quickly being changed to be more gender neutral and soon Cowboys could be no different.
I understand your concern, I am just not sure it will be an issue here. Like say Cowboys. Because the NFL exclusively has men playing right now, I don't think that will really come up. Maybe at universities who share that nickname, but I feel like they may have already addressed that in some way. If the NFL does start seeing women play, then maybe they will have to consider it. But I don't expect that to come up any time soon, but to be fair I have been wrong many times before.
I want to say the Washington football team and the Cleveland baseball team get so much attention is because of the symbols mixed with the names. It feels very straight forward the issue people may have with it.
Difference is with Washington is the polls from most native Americans say they have no problem with the name or logo. Cleveland on the other hand most people have been out spoken about. Also it doesn't matter if there is women playing in the league or not if people start to say it's sexiest then I hope the league puts just as much presser on them. Also I still wonder about the Vikings, Raiders, and Bucs given the history of where the names come from.
Those polls have a rather flawed methodology:
On the Shameful and Skewed ‘Redskins’ Poll
What we do know that there is push back from at least a portion of the community against the team name and logo, which for me is a enough. But I understand it isn't for others, and I also understand there will be Native Americans will be upset by the change. All fair and valid imo.
Native American groups ask NFL to force Redskins name change
Raiders and Bucs are innocuous enough and don't really focus on one group of people. No different than Pirates, who came from just about everywhere.
Vikings is the name of people from a certain area of Scandinavia, Minnesota has a large population of folks descended from Scandinavia. I'm not sure how this would possibly be problematic? They weren't a race, but effectively a nationality. There are teams in present day Scandinavia who use the name.
Indians was always a bigger issue with the logo, which has thankfully been retired. The name is just a misnomer, dating back to when Columbus thought he reached the West Indies. But I can see how it annoys Native Americans to be called that.
"Redskins" isn't anything like any of these other names, as it's just an out and out derogatory slur, one created by an outwardly racist owner, George Preston Marshall. (there was a reason they were the last NFL team to integrate) , after he bought a team called the Boston Braves.
The arguments about this creating some kind of "slippery slope" or "durr, what about the fighting irish?" are so disingenuous and have been shot down so many times at this point, it's not even worth rehashing.
Once again I am not oppose to the name change I am just playing even though I don't like the term devil's advocate what happens if people take offense to name because of the past history of the people. Good example is Robert E Lee, Thomas Jefferson, George Washington, Elihu Yale, and more. What this men did in the past like it or not is no different than what the Vikings did, or the English did and so on. That's what I am trying to say once you open a box into this cancel culture we have going on there's no telling where it could end if someone take offense to something.
he's available on the waiver wire
So after the news the Eagles won't be able to play with fans in Philly this year, and there is probably no way California is going to let fans into the stadium, that will be at least 4 teams that won't have fans. What do you all think are the chances we actually get an NFL season this year?
it's pretty much all but 100% certain they're already planning to cancel high school football here
Yeah, I don't see high school and maybe even college football happening. But I guess the NFL, being a pro league has a legit shot, but I guess it depends on how the work force as a whole takes the situation. There are so many players, coaches, staff and family that need to respect the basic ideas of social distancing. If one person gets it, the chances of it spreading inside each team's "bubble" is high.
I remember the name controversy coming up 30 years ago (when Washington was actually good), and most Indigenous People who were surveyed were indifferent to the name and the use of the Native American motif for sports teams. However, times have changed, and the recent surveys have shown that no less than 65% of NA people found the word "Redskins" to be offensive. It certainly doesn't help that George Preston Marshall's racism is more publicized than it was during the Washington Dynasty era.
And there have already been numerous schools to change their name or logo and ban possibly offensive fan practices on both the college and high school level in the last 15 years. The Cleveland Indians retired Chief Wahoo two years ago (long overdue) and they're considering a name change now. There was also a well-publicized push for the KC Chiefs to change their name as well. The dominoes are falling.
There may be more than a name change in Washington:
Yep, if any of the stuff that has been slowly trickling out is remotely true then there is no way that Dan Snyder will remain owner of the team
Yep on the radio (SportsTalk980) here they say more than likely Washington will have a new owner by the 2021 season and the guy who owns Amazon is said to be the buyer.
The problem with that is I think it will cause some sort of 'conflict of interest' as the Washington Post, the paper which is expected to drop the story later today is also owned by Jeff Bezos. So some are already seeing it as a coordinated attack for Bezos to gain ownership.