All Things Superman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - Part 71

[\S/JcDc\S/]

I love how up until this point we've been making fun, and joking about how people will act when the first negative reviews/thoughts come up.

It finally happened, one negative thought and the person it comes form is suddenly a crazy feminist who needs to be discredited. Come on guys, this is stupid.

The problem with your commentary is that she said nothing about the quality of the movie. No mention of the action or flow of the film. It makes it easy to discredit her negativity.

 

[DMC40]

Does he look like he's kidding?

The imfamous "iron" scene.Got to love Van Alden.

 

[InJustice]

I love how up until this point we've been making fun, and joking about how people will act when the first negative reviews/thoughts come up.

It finally happened, one negative thought and the person it comes form is suddenly a crazy feminist who needs to be discredited. Come on guys, this is stupid.

Except we're not exactly having a problem with the feminism speak from Jenn, more power to her if that's what she believes in (unless you're in CBM...that's when she's being called that). Our problem is that she's using a test that is insanely flawed test and comes off as if it's an accurate measure of a character. On top of that, she hasn't spoken about the quality of the film, just that particular thing, which makes her come across to some as a "wine and cheese nitpicker."

 

[\S/JcDc\S/]

I also think she just mentioned the test to sound intelligent. lol

 

[Rhonimus]

The test is obviously flawed, and I don't think that it should be used to judge every film as perfectly feminist friendly or empowering to women in general, all I'm saying is that there's no sense in even making a female character if her sole purpose is to rely on a man.

that's just the nature of this CBM and rescuing is implied, naturally .. it always has & it it likely always will .. that's besides the fact that her sole purpose is NOT to rely on this particular man .. but rather to get to the bottom of his story .. him rescuing her follows as a natural by product .. your argument is flawed .. at least in this particular instance

 

[Andreth]

I love how up until this point we've been making fun, and joking about how people will act when the first negative reviews/thoughts come up.

It finally happened, one negative thought and the person it comes form is suddenly a crazy feminist who needs to be discredited. Come on guys, this is stupid.

I understand that, but what happens when she seems to base her "this film is TERRIBLE" review on the fact that females should not talk with each other about the protagonist. And applies this strange logic to qualify films in a movie about the origins of an alien, when the female protagonist is a reporter.

I'm totally against the kind of witchhunt that happened with the negative Batman reviews, but this one sounded so silly that it was impossible not to comment.

 

[JimJimBinks]

The problem with your commentary is that she said nothing about the quality of the movie. No mention of the action or flow of the film. It makes it easy to discredit her negativity.

BUT WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DISCREDIT HER?!
The movie is embargoed, she can't say too much about it yet. At least wait for her full comments are out. Even then you can't say anything until you see the movie and can form your own opinion.

Except we're not exactly having a problem with the feminism speak from Jenn, more power to her if that's what she believes in (unless you're in CBM...that's when she's being called that). Our problem is that she's using a test that is insanely flawed test and comes off as if it's an accurate measure of a character.

Listen, I get it people.....

If you see a cake and you have been craving it, and you really want to eat it, but you can't for a few hours... 10 people tell you the cake tastes awesome and you'll believe them because you want that cake you'll be eating in a few hours to taste awesome. If one person tell you the cake tastes like crap. You haven't eaten the cake yet, you don't know how it tastes, you can't tell them it tastes awesome. You can't tell them their tastebuds are wrong. But I totally get why you're mad, because you still really want that cake, and you want it to be good. Just don't attack the person who doesn't like it when you don't know if you like it yet.

 

[Mad Love]

I love how up until this point we've been making fun, and joking about how people will act when the first negative reviews/thoughts come up.

It finally happened, one negative thought and the person it comes form is suddenly a crazy feminist who needs to be discredited. Come on guys, this is stupid.

I would have been fine if she just said it was terrible and left it at that. I'm sure reasonable feminist critiques could be made, however judging the movie through the Bechdel test is not one of them.

Other reviews simply said the movie was lacking. That's fair. But if they mention it's because Lois hair was red or some other poor reason, then that discredits their opinion. It's about weeding out the invalid from valid whether positive or negative.

 

[Andreth]

I'm just wondering, is she a movie critic?
Is her review going to appear in rottentomatoes and metacritic?

 

[Rhonimus]

I understand that, but what happens when she seems to base her "this film is TERRIBLE" review on the fact that females should not talk with each other about the protagonist. And applies this strange logic to qualify films in a movie about the origins of an alien, when the female protagonist is a reporter.

I'm totally against the kind of witchhunt that happened with the negative Batman reviews, but this one sounded so silly that it was impossible not to comment.

lol .. more common sense ..

 

[DaJanksta]

I hope this gets uploaded to Youtube I'm stuck at work right now

 

[DaJanksta]

I would have been fine if she just said it was terrible and left it at that. I'm sure reasonable feminist critiques could be made, however judging the movie through the Bechdel test is not one of them.

Other reviews simply said the movie was lacking. That's fair. But if they mention it's because Lois hair was red or some other poor reason, then that discredits their opinion. It's about weeding out the invalid from valid whether positive or negative.

Do you have a link to what she said?

 

[robot]

BUT WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DISCREDIT HER?!
The movie is embargoed, she can't say too much about it yet. At least wait for her full comments are out. Even then you can't say anything until you see the movie and can form your own opinion.



Listen, I get it people.....

If you see a cake and you have been craving it, and you really want to eat it, but you can't for a few hours... 10 people tell you the cake tastes awesome and you'll believe them because you want that cake you'll be eating in a few hours to taste awesome. If one person tell you the cake tastes like crap. You haven't eaten the cake yet, you don't know how it tastes, you can't tell them it tastes awesome. You can't tell them their tastebuds are wrong. But I totally get why you're mad, because you still really want that cake, and you want it to be good. Just don't attack the person who doesn't like it when you don't know if you like it yet.

No one's attacking the person who doesn't like a chocolate cake.. we are just saying we don't 'care a damn' about someone who doesn't like ALL chocolate cakes... because judging a cake by it's chocolatiness is just madness!! Plus, it's not even a chocolate cake, it's a banana cake....

 

[DaJanksta]

BUT WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DISCREDIT HER?!
The movie is embargoed, she can't say too much about it yet. At least wait for her full comments are out. Even then you can't say anything until you see the movie and can form your own opinion.



Listen, I get it people.....

If you see a cake and you have been craving it, and you really want to eat it, but you can't for a few hours... 10 people tell you the cake tastes awesome and you'll believe them because you want that cake you'll be eating in a few hours to taste awesome. If one person tell you the cake tastes like crap. You haven't eaten the cake yet, you don't know how it tastes, you can't tell them it tastes awesome. You can't tell them their tastebuds are wrong. But I totally get why you're mad, because you still really want that cake, and you want it to be good. Just don't attack the person who doesn't like it when you don't know if you like it yet.

Maybe they're just making sure she can be taken seriously.

 

[arman200]

that's just the nature of this CBM and rescuing is implied, naturally .. it always has & it it likely always will .. that's besides the fact that her sole purpose is NOT to rely on this particular man .. but rather to get to the bottom of his story .. him rescuing her follows as a natural by product .. your argument is flawed .. at least in this particular instance

Well her business life is entirely focused on getting to the bottom of HIS story(implying her success is reliant on HIM), during which she falls into danger only to be rescued by HIM, and struggles romantically with other people because she's sub-consciously holding out for HIM. Pretty reliant.

It's the nature of the beast, but there are ways around it.

 

[Princess Denise]

I love how up until this point we've been making fun, and joking about how people will act when the first negative reviews/thoughts come up.

It finally happened, one negative thought and the person it comes form is suddenly a crazy feminist who needs to be discredited. Come on guys, this is stupid.

Yes and what everyone is missing is that she did not say that failing the "bechdel test" was the only reason she thought the movie was terrible. She may just think that MOS is just plain awful in so many ways and as an aside is upset that it is just another example of a film with weak female characters. Look her feminist leanings may be clouding her judgment and Zack Snyder is perceived by some to be anti-woman (I disagree). This could be fueling her over the top negativity. Or maybe MOS is just not her cup of tea and she really just did not enjoy it. Even the most successful movies have some people who hate them. For instance I found the Harry Potter films to be unwatchable but my opinion was always in the minority. Hopefully, her reaction to MOS will be a minority view. But, it could be that MOS is just a terrible movie and this is just another case of attacking the messenger. We really don't know yet, but we should not live in denial to at least consider that this may be a possibility.

 

[Rhonimus]

Well her business life is entirely focused on getting to the bottom of HIS story(implying her success is reliant on HIM), during which she falls into danger only to be rescued by HIM, and struggles romantically with other people because she's sub-consciously holding out for HIM. Pretty reliant.

It's the nature of the beast, but there are ways around it.

so if he was a she .. problem solved ? like i said .. nit picking .. also irrelevant given the context and premise of the entire 75 yr old story .. it shouldn't even be discussed imo

not attempting to bash you or anything .. i just think that even discussing this lends itself to pre-supposition & no objectivity given the very nature of the story .. so with that i bow out of this particular "argument"

 

[InJustice]

Listen, I get it people.....

If you see a cake and you have been craving it, and you really want to eat it, but you can't for a few hours... 10 people tell you the cake tastes awesome and you'll believe them because you want that cake you'll be eating in a few hours to taste awesome. If one person tell you the cake tastes like crap. You haven't eaten the cake yet, you don't know how it tastes, you can't tell them it tastes awesome. You can't tell them their tastebuds are wrong. But I totally get why you're mad, because you still really want that cake, and you want it to be good. Just don't attack the person who doesn't like it when you don't know if you like it yet.

Except in relation to other critiques, we could understand some who said that the movie is lacking (some have said lacking in story/character/soul), which is extremely fair to say. The fact that she based the film on a flawed test comes off as so arbitrary and "wine-cheese" nitpicking that we have a difficult time taking her seriously. I'm against what happened during TDKR spoiler and reviews, but we'd like to know that critics can be taken seriously when they review. It doesn't have to be a good review, but it shouldn't have to be so arbitrary that people question it. Jenn, for the most part, doesn't come across as that with her tweets (that she subsequently deleted).

As for the embargo, that hasn't stopped people from making positive reviews about the film, story, plot, and the cast...So surely, you could be critically negative with few words in the same way that people have been critically positive.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I don't think I'm going to be coming to this particular thread very often. I've never been interested in arguing about a critic's review of a film before I seeing the film.

 

[arman200]

I think her review on the film considering the obvious implications and themes present in the trailers discredit her about as much as anybody complaining about the soundtrack for Great Gatsby being contemporary. It shows ignorance and lack of focus.

 

[Willi Berg]

Do you have a link to what she said?

Jenn Murphy:

"There's a reason why they told us not to tweet about the movie we just saw: IT'S TERRIBLE!!!

Also it definitely fails the Bechdel Test. Seriously can big budget movies create a decent role for a woman? It's getting pretty ridiculous."

 

[jedi42]

Can the debate about this stupid test be moved to it's own thread...where it will hopefully die a slow painful death????

 

[LordofhouseEl]

What did she say about Thor because Jane was bloody useless in that movie, and what about the scene with Jane and the other chic commenting about a shirtless Thor.

 

[InJustice]

The imfamous "iron" scene.Got to love Van Alden.

Indeed, I can only wonder what Michael Shannon does as Zod.

 

[arman200]

so if he was a she .. problem solved ? like i said .. nit picking .. also irrelevant given the context and premise of the entire 75 yr old story .. it shouldn't even be discussed imo

Um, no.

And by that argument, even though the mandarin was made as a racist caricature, he's A okay today.