All Things Superman: An Open Discussion (Spoilers) - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 92

[hopefuldreamer]

Listen to the announcement he didn't say it was gonna be in the film he said he was looking for something that would get across what was happening. In other words Superman and Batman in a film together so he took a quote from their most famous story together.

Lo lets not forge Snyder was the one who said "Really?" When asked about Batman beating Superman. Yes the question he was asked did refer specifically to Nolan's Batman but his answer was more generic.

I know he didn't say that.

I'm saying what I think it could mean.

We'll find out soon enough though. If it's coming by 2015 it won't be long before we get a bit more of a feel for what they are planning to do here.

Though in fairness, if MOS is proof of anything to me, it's that you absolutely cannot tell whether or not you are going to love a movie by following it online.

Would you be happy if they based their dynamics off of the animated pair from the How it should have ended cafe segments?lol

It'd be better than TDKreturns.

At least it'd be funny!

Not to mention the fact that I have friends who hate Superman and they LOVE TDKreturns.

 

[Lily Adler]

Becky, I think everyone learned that lesson from SM3.

I'm still not 100% on board, mainly due to our 'crack' team of writers of Goyer and Snyder.

I'll take Will Beall and his grasp of the 1940's (or whatever) lingo anyday.

 

[BH/HHH]

Sony can't we have a separate thread without the negativity?

 

[Lily Adler]

I demand a separate section for this film. The question is where to put it. A logical choice would be to keep it in the Superman boards, since it's being considered a MOS sequel featuring Batman.

 

[Smallville13]

To be honest. If MOS was the film I dreamed it would be, this news would hurt me alot more. But I guess I'll just see where it goes now. We have no power over anything. They don't owe us anything. There are far more Batman fans than for Supes, so the majority wins I guess.

I hope Amy, Diane, and Lawrence, are onboard for wherever this is going.

 

[hopefuldreamer]

Becky, I think everyone learned that lesson from SM3.

I'm still not 100% on board, mainly due to our 'crack' team of writers of Goyer and Snyder.

I'll take Will Beall and his grasp of the 1940's (or whatever) lingo anyday.

Bizzarely, I think the film has more of a chance with Snyder and Goyer writing it together than it would with JUST Goyer.

Because I think Goyers experiance with writing the Batman character successfully might cause that characterisation to overshadow Clark's.

I actually like Sucker Punch. It was unconventional and it was trying to convey a message. It had layers, even if those layers weren't completely clear.

But with MOS and probably MOS 2: World's Finest, I don't think they are TRYING to do anything but make a generic popcorn action flick. Cause that's what they think will sell.

What their styles of writing combined might actually lead to is totally unpredictable if you ask me.

 

[Herolee10]

For me, this was the plan. Remember, Man of Steel finished filming in 2011 with a December 2012 initial release date that got pushed to Summer 2013.

That's A LOT of time to think about potential follow ups. I'm just guessing but I'm betting that Snyder had a cut of Man of Steel that was close to what we got in the early fall of 2012. That means, in theory, Goyer and Snyder could've hatched this plan over the last 8 months.

And remember, Goyer was coy as hell about what Man of Steel means for the Justice League and the greater DC universe as a whole.

I think they've known for months now. Months.

Well that might explain why they're so confident in getting back into the saddle so quickly since releasing a film of this scale just two years after MOS was released is pretty bold.

And yeah, all I'm hoping for that this film gives Superman and his mythology the respect that he deserves. That's all I ask for.

When Batman and Superman are presented right together, not with one over the other, but as equals and good friends, they are pure gold and that's what I'm looking for.

Truth be told, it'd be interesting to finally see superman's character have a comrade that he can trust wholeheartedly and Batman certainly fits the bill.

But in the same time, i want to see Superman really being shown getting established since he's not completely superman yet and it'd be too cruel to do a simple time skip and say that he was established in that unseen time skip.

 

[Smallville13]

Bizzarely, I think the film has more of a chance with Snyder and Goyer writing it together than it would with JUST Goyer.

Because I think Goyers experiance with writing the Batman character successfully might cause that characterisation to overshadow Clark's.

I actually like Sucker Punch. It was unconventional and it was trying to convey a message. It had layers, even if those layers weren't completely clear.

But with MOS and probably MOS 2: World's Finest, I don't think they are TRYING to do anything but make a generic popcorn action flick. Cause that's what they think will sell.

What their styles of writing combined might actually lead to is totally unpredictable if you ask me.

This is kind of an unsettling truth about alot of Hollywood productions lately. Films should always be about story. Specific ideas or moments or scenes should come second. But it seems many films these days seemed to be built around an idea. What about Batman and Superman? Let's build a movie around that.

There's no hope of us getting a beautiful, intelligent, and thoughtful piece on Superman with Henry now.

Think of it this way. Having Superman clashing and juxtaposed inside a depiction of our society is a powerful way of self-reflection, seeing what humanity is, and dealing with the strong themes. By having Batman as well, we're just too far removed from our world now. In fairness, MOS had already started this with the World Engine.

 

[Lily Adler]

Bizzarely, I think the film has more of a chance with Snyder and Goyer writing it together than it would with JUST Goyer.

Because I think Goyers experiance with writing the Batman character successfully might cause that characterisation to overshadow Clark's.

I actually like Sucker Punch. It was unconventional and it was trying to convey a message. It had layers, even if those layers weren't completely clear.

But with MOS and probably MOS 2: World's Finest, I don't think they are TRYING to do anything but make a generic popcorn action flick. Cause that's what they think will sell.

What their styles of writing combined might actually lead to is totally unpredictable if you ask me.

But the chances of it being a disaster are still relatively high. I'd rather have a proven, competent writer on the project.

 

[antsman41]

Can't we have a forum that links from both the Batman and Superman sections?

 

[Lily Adler]

Can't we have a forum that links from both the Batman and Superman sections?

Whichever. I just want a separate section, so threads for it won't overtake the forums.

 

[Smallville13]

But the chances of it being a disaster are still relatively high. I'd rather have a proven, competent writer on the project.

Yeah. Snyder and Goyer writing does not inspire confidence. I don't think we can expect excellence from these two in the writing department. At least not for the entire film (and certainly not overall).

Ugh. I'd be so much happier today if the sequel was announced with Jonathan Nolan penning it. Heck all my reservations with MOS would have been forgotten. Instead... we're getting Batman with both Snyder and Goyer writing.

 

[Herolee10]

Yeah. Snyder and Goyer writing does not inspire confidence. I don't think we can expect excellence from these two in the writing department. At least not for the entire film (and certainly not overall).

Ugh. I'd be so much happier today if the sequel was announced with Jonathan Nolan penning it. Heck all my reservations with MOS would have been forgotten. Instead... we're getting Batman with both Snyder and Goyer writing.

Not to mention, it's been confirmed and said by Goyer that he enjoys writing for Batman more so than he does for Superman.

 

[Super Kal]

and with that, maybe they should let Nolan go, or only let him supervise Batman's role

 

[SpideyFan866]

and with that, maybe they should let Nolan go, or only let him supervise Batman's role

I think they should let him go, or scale back his influence over the final product.

Not that it was entirely negative, but his influence over Man of Steel was much to apparent and much to strong.

I really hope Snyder has more creative freedom this time around.

The fact that Snyder, rather than Nolan, is writing the story with Goyer this time around is giving me SOME hope for that. Also the switch of Nolan and Thomas to Executive Producers give me hope for that scaled back role.

I really kinda feel that, had Snyder been directing off of HIS vision of the story, rather than what Nolan and Goyer had conceived previously, Man of Steel would have come out differently.

Perhaps better than it did.

 

[Project862006]

i swear people act like goyer is uwe boll of writing

Blade
Blade II
Dark City
Batman Begins all very solid scripts

and i personally really liked MOS script and i hear very good things about Da Vinci's Demons tv series

people go overboard about goyer

 

[Ramsay Snow]

So it's be cool if Bruce Wayne was kind of like an antagonist for this film, with him and Lex doing some stuff but then he uses detective skills to find out more stuff.

 

[Smallville13]

Not to mention, it's been confirmed and said by Goyer that he enjoys writing for Batman more so than he does for Superman.

Yeah. And Snyder prefers Batman too. Heck, they announced it by reciting a line that Snyder implied influences how he's writing it, and it's basically Batman making Superman his b*tch. Or using Superman to prop up Batman. Like he needs it...

 

[SpideyFan866]

i swear people act like goyer is uwe boll of writing

Blade
Blade II
Dark City
Batman Begins all very solid scripts

and i personally really liked MOS script and i hear very good things about Da Vinci's Demons tv series

people go overboard about goyer

Honestly, I don't think Goyer's writing was bad on MOS.

However, I just think it was the large amount of cuts they made to the movie that hurt it.

Even Goyer himself admitted that they cut about 1 hour+ of footage.

I really think they should just went for that 2:30/2:45, rather than having it be an hour 2:20.

It really needed that extra time in the beginning (where the cuts were most evident) to make the movie flow better and give the characters more development.

 

[Herolee10]

Yeah. And Snyder prefers Batman too. Heck, they announced it by reciting a line that Snyder implied influences how he's writing it, and it's basically Batman making Superman his b*tch. Or using Superman to prop up Batman. Like he needs it...

What if they did a twist? In the sense where Batman is the antagonist in a way to Superman like how Superman was to Batman in TDKR and that it's Superman who ends up turning Batman from his misguided path, ala seeing the potential for goodness within him.

I mean it's no big surprise to think that a version of Batman could have lost his way as well from what's right and wrong when doing his thing.

Honestly, I don't think Goyer's writing was bad on MOS.

However, I just think it was the large amount of cuts they made to the movie that hurt it.

Even Goyer himself admitted that they cut about 1 hour+ of footage.

I really think they should just went for that 2:30/2:45, rather than having it be an hour 20.

It really needed that extra time in the beginning (where the cuts were most evident) to make the movie flow better and give the characters more development.

What's interesting to note is that I think it was mentioned somewhere that it was Nolan's idea to cut the film to the length that we got in the theatrical version.

 

[J.Howlett]

That is what extended cuts on Blu-Ray are for...especially since Snyder's known to do them.

It might happen in this case. We'll see.

 

[georgec]

Maybe they'll convince J Nolan to come aboard later on.

 

[Bren]

They don't owe us anything. There are far more Batman fans than for Supes, so the majority wins I guess.

I hope Amy, Diane, and Lawrence, are onboard for wherever this is going.

'They' still owe us honesty. So if it's the MOS 2 / Superman film that has Batman in it they've mentioned, I hope they stick to that.
If it's a WF film, come out and say it. I wanna know what I'm walking into.

And yes I heard that the 'earthly' MOS cast is returning

 

[SpideyFan866]

What if they did a twist? In the sense where Batman is the antagonist in a way to Superman like how Superman was to Batman in TDKR and that it's Superman who ends up turning Batman from his misguided path, ala seeing the potential for goodness within him.

I mean it's no big surprise to think that a version of Batman could have lost his way as well from what's right and wrong when doing his thing.

I really do think we'll be seeing an early days Batman. That's really when Batman and Superman's conflict was the strongest over the right and wrong way to be a hero.

Batman using more vigilante justice, and Superman being more law and order and being on the side of the government.

And in the end, they both kinda help each other find a balance between those very black and white ways of operating.

What's interesting to note is that I think it was mentioned somewhere that it was Nolan's idea to cut the film to the length that we got in the theatrical version.

Yeah. I saw that too. You'd think he'd be in favor of the longer film.

Also, you'd think he'd have been up for their being an explanation for Superman's reluctance to kill, but he wasn't at first.

 

[SpideyFan866]

That is what extended cuts on Blu-Ray are for...especially since Snyder's known to do them.

It might happen in this case. We'll see.

I'm pretty sure Snyder, or Goyer, said they would have that extra footage on the DVD/Blu Ray when it came out.

But yeah, Snyder almost always has an extended cut for his films, regardless of how much was actually cut.