BvS All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - - - Part 98

[Thread Manager]

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]486563[/split]

 

[Thread Manager]

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]486279[/split]

 

[matt47]

^ lol good point. They'd probably just be happy he's dead.

 

[Rorschach2012]

Jesus this again...there is zero evidence that any of that is true. Even more, if they are going to "steal from the best" why would they then completely bastardize the Doomsday plot when there are actual villains who have been created by Lex that work better than Doomsday anyways?

If the rumor is true (and I doubt it is) I think it is ridiculous and sounds terrible. It is the second worst rumor behind the "Superman Fakes His Death And Goes Into Exile" rumor.

I thought we were done with this rumor after the fake script fiasco...Faraci has no sources when it comes to WB movies. (which is why the rumor died in August FYI)

edit: Superman is not going to die. Please for the love of Zod stop propagating that rumor. You dont kill him before Justice League and you certainly dont kill him when no one has any reason to care if he dies. It would be stupid and weightless because he hasnt been around long enough for anyone to care. DOS works because Superman had been saving the world for YEARS...this Superman has done it once and half the people seem to hate him for it. If they do that dumb idea I guarantee it will fall flat and Justice League will be a disaster.

we have very different taste. A The Dark Knight Returns/Death of Superman hybrid for this movie sounds ****ing awesome to me, especially considering how insane Doomsday vs the proto Justice League (the trinity + Aquaman and Cyborg) will be under Zack Snyder's direction.

 

[zryson]

we have very different taste. A The Dark Knight Returns/Death of Superman hybrid for this movie sounds ****ing awesome to me, especially considering how insane Doomsday vs the proto Justice League (the trinity + Aquaman and Cyborg) will be under Zack Snyder's direction.

When it comes to DOS/Superman in exile, I can see how it could happen. Especially given the theme of people in Metropolis rallying against Superman. My hope is that if any of it is true, its balanced more evenly, backed up by incredible writing (from Terrio).

 

[Rorschach2012]

Cavill keeps hinting at Doomsday and he's said that Death of Superman is his favorite comic book storyline. There's a really good chance Doomsday is the final villain, and Superman will come back probably in Justice League. Sounds so awesome.

Ideally, there would be a 4th world film in between Batman v Superman and Justice League, and Justice League could be a full on New Genesis + Justice League vs Darkseid and Apokolips

 

[herolee10]

we have very different taste. A The Dark Knight Returns/Death of Superman hybrid for this movie sounds ****ing awesome to me, especially considering how insane Doomsday vs the proto Justice League (the trinity + Aquaman and Cyborg) will be under Zack Snyder's direction.

Personally, I think timing is everything and I think it would be a waste of a great story line to stick all of that, plus everything else, into one film when the things that you mentioned above could be better explored in future films.

 

[Iceman]

Agreed, I'd be interested in all this stuff but at a later date. For now I want the setup to be successful without any hugely complicated issues that are better suited to a mature franchise.

 

[herolee10]

Agreed, I'd be interested in all this stuff but at a later date. For now I want the setup to be successful without any hugely complicated issues that are better suited to a mature franchise.

Indeed.

At most, this film probably wouldn't be more than 2 Hours and 25 Minutes. During that time, they have to catch audiences up with what's been going on for Superman and company since the conclusion of "MOS", while dealing with the fallout from Zod's invasion, introducing Bruce Wayne/Batman and his world, along with bringing in the likes of Lex Luthor, Wonder Woman, Aquaman, and Victor Stone in some form of fashion.

We also have to deal with the inevitable confrontation that Superman and Batman will have with each other before they eventually put aside their differences and work together to take down a bigger threat, thus the beginnings of the Justice League.

To cram the "Death" story line into all of this would be a HUGE disservice to it.

One of the reasons why that story worked so well was because Superman had not only been around for a long time within the DC Universe, but because of the long standing relationships he had with everyone that was shown to be affected by his sudden death.

Superman's death will mean a hell of a lot more if he's been friends with Batman and company for years, while having been a part of the Justice League already and being hailed as a hero by mostly everyone on Earth.

Killing him with the excuse of saying that people who once hated him will now realize on how important he was is a weak one in my honest opinion.

Honestly, I would rather wait and allow the DC Universe to get fully formed first before I play out a major story line like that. Other wise you end up not only wasting that story line but potentially harming the much needed development that the DCCU needs right now.

Heck, one of the reasons why I feel "Days of Future Past" had worked so well is because we had spent several films getting to know the X-Men and had a least one film devoted into showing the younger cast/generation as well.

I really doubt that people would have been "as" invested in the final product if DOFP was the first time we were seeing James playing young Charles or Michael playing Magneto for the first time.

We got to know the casts of both eras so well that it made the story feel that much more important and invested in.

 

[Wise]

Doomsday created in a lab on Earth is not Doomsday.

I don't want to see another comic book movie cinematic bastardization where they use the name of a character and then ignore everything about their history and personality.

 

[Iceman]

Yep (to herolee), the death is a huge storyline that should only be used when it will have maximum impact when this DCCU is nearing its peak. It should be a global event event outside of film.

 

[Rorschach2012]

Personally I think the Death and Return of Superman arc was executed pretty poorly. I wouldn't want a movie adaptation to play out exactly like the comics, so I'd be fine with an abridged adaptation for this movie.

Also, mutated Zod clone Doomsday is Doomsday in name only, but it's not like Doomsday has an amazing backstory in the comics to begin with. I'd rather he remain alien, but Zod/Doomsday actually works for me.

Doomsday was created by a scientist who rapidly repeatedly cloned and murdered the creature Doomsday in an effort to make the most powerful creature possible. Lexcorp could do something similar to Zod's body to create Doomsday, and that'd be good enough for me.

 

[herolee10]

IF anything, it's really both Wonder Woman and Aquaman that I have absolutely no idea on how they'll potentially factor into this film.

I mean it's pretty much a given that Superman and Batman will have a rough start upon their first meeting with each other before eventually having some sort of physical confrontation. But ultimately, we know that they'll eventually let bygones be bygones and work together to take down Lex and his plans.

I've heard some speculate on how Diana could factor as a neutral party in this film, with her being here to just observe on what's going on after the events of "Man of Steel", while Arthur can act in as a possible antagonistic entity for Superman and company.

And it's really the identity of the super villain that I'm curious about as well. It's pretty much a given that there'll be some villain, other than Lex, that will act in as the "Muscle" of the villainous group. The only question is...who will it be?

In terms of structure, I feel like this film would match "The Winter Soldier" a lot, but be on a much bigger scale obviously with a longer running time. If I had to compare characters to each other from this film and that one..this is how I would do it:


1. Superman= Captain America

2. Batman= A combination of The Winter Soldier and Falcon

3. Wonder Woman= A combination of Maria Hill and Black Widow, where she's the kickass female heroine in the film but doesn't have A WHOLE LOT to do.

4. Lois Lane= A Combination of both Black Widow and Sharon Carter, probably has the most screen time in terms of female lead and scenes with the boy scout of the film while serving as the love of his life as well.

5. Lex Luthor= Alexander Pierce

6. Tao's Character= Crossbones?

7. Holly Hunter's Character= World Security Council

8. Alfred= Nick Fury

 

[Iceman]

Personally I think the Death and Return of Superman arc was executed pretty poorly. I wouldn't want a movie adaptation to play out exactly like the comics, so I'd be fine with an abridged adaptation for this movie.

Also, mutated Zod clone Doomsday is Doomsday in name only, but it's not like Doomsday has an amazing backstory in the comics to begin with. I'd rather he remain alien, but Zod/Doomsday actually works for me.

Doomsday was created by a scientist who rapidly repeatedly cloned and murdered the creature Doomsday in an effort to make the most powerful creature possible. Lexcorp could do something similar to Zod's body to create Doomsday, and that'd be good enough for me.

I don't want it to be like the comics but I definitely don't want the death of a major character wasted before many of the characters even know each other! Far better for this to happen for the first time when this universe reaches its peak and the stakes are high enough to justify it. It could become a real pop culture event if handled well.

 

[herolee10]

On another note, what are the chances that most of us will be able to objectively look at this film once the first teaser/theatrical trailer comes out?lol

Regardless of the final product, if the trailer reactions for this film are anything like the ones for MOS, then it's going to be fun watching those "reaction videos" again on Youtube.lol

 

[matt47]

On another note, what are the chances that most of us will be able to objectively look at this film once the first teaser/theatrical trailer comes out?lol

Regardless of the final product, if the trailer reactions for this film are anything like the ones for MOS, then it's going to be fun watching those "reaction videos" again on Youtube.lol

This might sound a lil sad but I still watch those reaction videos every now n then.
I love reaction videos

 

[Iceman]

On another note, what are the chances that most of us will be able to objectively look at this film once the first teaser/theatrical trailer comes out?lol

Regardless of the final product, if the trailer reactions for this film are anything like the ones for MOS, then it's going to be fun watching those "reaction videos" again on Youtube.lol

I've ordered 40 pairs of trailer pants. 10 for AoU day, 10 for BvS day, 10 for Star Wars day and 10 for Apocalypse day. I don't know if that'll be enough.

 

[herolee10]

This might sound a lil sad but I still watch those reaction videos every now n then.
I love reaction videos

I've ordered 40 pairs of trailer pants. 10 for AoU day, 10 for BvS day, 10 for Star Wars day and 10 for Apocalypse day. I don't know if that'll be enough.

And to just think..by this time next year, we'll likely already have had a teaser trailer and a few more promotional/official images, along with more reports regarding the plot of the film and some CC exclusive footage descriptions as well.

 

[matt47]

I think hearing about the plot is the thing i'm most anticipating. I really want to know what the hell is going on! haha

 

[Rorschach2012]

everyone needs to check the CBM frontpage right now. they have an article titled "doopie's doodles" and it's hilariously spot on regarding the different CBM studios

 

[matt47]

anyone seen on the IMDB page Scoots now Metallo............

 

[elgaz]

Doomsday created in a lab on Earth is not Doomsday.

I don't want to see another comic book movie cinematic bastardization where they use the name of a character and then ignore everything about their history and personality.

Totally agree. Doomsday having his origins on Krypton made the whole thing much more personal.

 

[zryson]

Cavill keeps hinting at Doomsday and he's said that Death of Superman is his favorite comic book storyline. There's a really good chance Doomsday is the final villain, and Superman will come back probably in Justice League. Sounds so awesome.

Ideally, there would be a 4th world film in between Batman v Superman and Justice League, and Justice League could be a full on New Genesis + Justice League vs Darkseid and Apokolips

To have Superman MIA/dead, in some ways would be a huge risk for WB. So while it might be awesome spectacle-wise, I hope in some ways that if they do it, its in a later movie.

 

[Rorschach2012]

the Zod clone/Doomsday thing would make more sense if the Zod clone was Bizarro.

 

[Steamteck]

Doomsday created in a lab on Earth is not Doomsday.

I don't want to see another comic book movie cinematic bastardization where they use the name of a character and then ignore everything about their history and personality.

IMO Doomsday is one of the few characters almost anything could improve him. Although I kind of like the alien genetically engineered one best. In any event, He just such a flat character most of the time, I don't care for him. At least the lab guy had SOME personality.