The Dark Knight Rises Are Nolan's Batman Films Really THAT Realistic?!

[Mace Dolex]

I think Nolan's Batman films are serious for the stories he's wanting to tell and are far more believable than Joel Shumacher's frilly neon glow nonsense, I'm sure Nolan can fit in the Lazarus Pit to make the audience believe something like that can exist.

Even Burton's films weren't that real to begin with after all these are still imaginary superheroes.

 

[Bat-Mite]

I'm not sure one has to interpret the Joker as being even slightly supernatural - it's enough assume that Gotham is just that corrupt and he had enough minions that a mastermind like that could get away with it. Of course it pushes the boundaries of believability, but for the sake of the narrative it'll do.

Have to? No, but it seems that that's the take of one of the guys who wrote the script, and it would certainly help to explain things like how the Joker knew that Batman would pursue Lao to the ends of the earth (none of the other mobsters, especially Lao himself, suspected this). Or why he suspected that Batman would be able to get a fingerprint off of a shattered bullet, enough so to work it into his plan to create a distraction for Batman while he tried to assassinate the mayor. You don't just automatically assume that someone, even as resourceful and determined as Batman, is capable of such a thing. He had an almost supernatural sense of how Batman operated, with no explanation given other than his own words about how Batman completes him and so forth.

 

[DieSmiling]

Have to? No, but it seems that that's the take of one of the guys who wrote the script, and it would certainly help to explain things like how the Joker knew that Batman would pursue Lao to the ends of the earth (none of the other mobsters, especially Lao himself, suspected this). Or why he suspected that Batman would be able to get a fingerprint off of a shattered bullet, enough so to work it into his plan to create a distraction for Batman while he tried to assassinate the mayor. You don't just automatically assume that someone, even as resourceful and determined as Batman, is capable of such a thing. He had an almost supernatural sense of how Batman operated, with no explanation given other than his own words about how Batman completes him and so forth.

I don't see how any of those things signify that Joker is supernatural in the least bit.

Does it give him unrealistic clairvoyace and an insanely strategic mind? Sure. But I mean, it's not like he has supernatural knowledge of Batman. Even is observation that Batman clearly was crushing on Rachel is explained in the plot.

 

[Figs]

Does anyone ever stop to think that the Joker didn't know for sure that Batman would pursue Lau or get the fingerprint to find that apartment??

If Batman didn't do either, Joker would have still been setting off his other plans to cause chaos and anarchy. It doesn't exactly matter to Joker in the overall picture, he just does things, remember.

 

[Bat-Mite]

I don't see how any of those things signify that Joker is supernatural in the least bit.

Does it give him unrealistic clairvoyace and an insanely strategic mind? Sure. But I mean, it's not like he has supernatural knowledge of Batman. Even is observation that Batman clearly was crushing on Rachel is explained in the plot.

If he has unrealistic clairvoyance, then that would make him, at least to a small extent, a supernatural character...

Does anyone ever stop to think that the Joker didn't know for sure that Batman would pursue Lau or get the fingerprint to find that apartment??

If Batman didn't do either, Joker would have still been setting off his other plans to cause chaos and anarchy. It doesn't exactly matter to Joker in the overall picture, he just does things, remember.

Except that he was spoonfeeding Harvey bull**** when he was saying that stuff. He was saying whatever he thought would push Harvey off of the deep end, which he reveals to have been his goal at the end of the film. This is why he didn't care if Harvey or Batman killed him (even going so far as to hand Harvey a gun). He'd have proven his point by corrupting either of them.

Batman: This city just showed you that it's full of people ready to believe in good.
The Joker: Until their spirit breaks completely. Until they get a good look at the real Harvey Dent and all the heroic things he's done. You didn't think I'd risk losing the battle for Gotham's soul in a fistfight with you? No. You need an ace in the hole. Mine's Harvey.
Batman: What did you do?
The Joker: I took Gotham's white knight and I brought him down to our level. It wasn't hard. You see, madness, as you know, is like gravity. All it takes is a little push!

He doesn't just do things to cause chaos like what he tells Harvey. He isn't just a dog chasing cars... he has an agenda.

 

[Figs]

If he has unrealistic clairvoyance, then that would make him, at least to a small extent, a supernatural character...
Except that he was spoonfeeding Harvey bull**** when he was saying that stuff. He was saying whatever he thought would push Harvey off of the deep end, which he reveals to have been his goal at the end of the film. This is why he didn't care if Harvey or Batman killed him (even going so far as to hand Harvey a gun). He'd have proven his point by corrupting either of them.

I realize all of that. I know that his goal was to push Harvey or Batman off the deep end and that he was spoonfeeding Harvey that BS.

I was merely mentioning some of his other actions. I don't think he would have cared if Batman found the firing squad tied up or if Batman would have captured Lau or not, it wouldn't have affected his ultimate goal, which was the corruption of Batman or Dent as you already stated.

 

[DaveMoral]

No, your finger could come in contact with the bullet. Only part of it is covered with the casing.

Here:

"1" in the diagram is the bullet itself. As you can see, it's possible to have touched it.

Regardless, I agree the technology is preposterous, I just can't believe THIS is what you're hung up on.

That kind of bullet would flatten and be basically impossible to pull a print from. Let alone a shattered bullet, not matter the scanning tech.

Morningstar is correct in saying it would make more sense and be more realistic and more plausible for Batman and the GCPD for that matter, to find the casings on the crime scene and pull prints from those. Even if we are going with the idea that the shooters covered their tracks by picking up the casings, Batman could have more easily been shown to be a more observant and thorough detective than the GCPD's detectives by spotting and pocketing a lone, forgotten casing and take it back to the bunker to pull prints from. They could even use a nice hi-tech gadget to do it without creating this set up with Batman just happens to have a goram Gattling Gun forensics set up in his bunker. Because that's a hugely practical thing for him to have and all.

It would be more plausible for him to do much more practical detective work, rather than pull this weird Gattling Gun and scanner device out of his ass just for the sake of doing that.

 

[itsthebatman]

Batman: This city (heavy breathing) just showed you (catches breath) that it's full of people ready to believe in GOOOOOOOD.
The Joker: Until their spirit breaks completely. Until they get a good look at the real Harvey Dent and all the heroic things he's done. You didn't think I'd risk losing the battle for Gotham's soul in a fistfight with you? No. You need an ace in the hole. Mine's Harvey.
Batman: What did you do?
The Joker: I took Gotham's white knight and I brought him down to our level. It wasn't hard. You see, madness, as you know, is like gravity. All it takes is a little push!

He doesn't just do things to cause chaos like what he tells Harvey. He isn't just a dog chasing cars... he has an agenda.

Corrected

 

[Doc Phosphorus]

It would be more plausible for him to do much more practical detective work, rather than pull this weird Gattling Gun and scanner device out of his ass just for the sake of doing that.

But isn't that the beauty of Batman? "Shark repellent" and the like, heh.

To me the point of that scene was to illustrate that Batman can solve a crime that would've otherwise stymied ordinary detectives. "Well, a shattered bullet, no shell casings to pull fingerprints off, what now?" He thinks outside the box, even baffling a seasoned cop like Gordon with his unconventional (and successful) method. Plausability be damned, I guess. It's science fiction.

 

[MoonChild]

Well it's obvious what we have to do to answer this thread's question...

A mythbuster episode dedicated to Nolan's Batman films.

 

[Doc Samson]

Really, this is only a problem for people that enjoy a more "comic-booky" Batman. Perhaps they want Mr. Freeze or Clayface in a proper film or something, but I can't understand why anyone would attempt to nitpick every instance of something "unrealistic" happening? It's totally missing the point.

The story of Bruce Wayne lends itself to a more grounded interpretation than any other popular superhero, outside of maybe the Punisher. John Walsh for all intents and purposes is Bruce Wayne, someone who experienced personal tragedy and decided to fight injustice. The only thing Nolan did was attempt to explain where these gadgets might come from in the real world and how it could possibly work on a technical level. He also tried to bring the villains down to the same level of plausibility so yes, a Lazarus Pit would go against some of the conventions of the universe he established.

Is it farfetched for a burn victim to survive with massive facial damage? Of course not, but on the same token they won't be up out of bed exacting revenge with their eye hanging out either, what's wrong with the best of both worlds? The action, the plot, things of that nature are just as silly and impossible as most other comic films, but the characters are reasonably grounded. Besides, if your going to go through all the BS to change the Joker from a permawhite clown, a villain almost as iconic as Batman himself, why would you then turn around and include something even more outlandish in the Lazarus Pits?

 

[KRIM]

Besides, if your going to go through all the BS to change the Joker from a permawhite clown, a villain almost as iconic as Batman himself, why would you then turn around and include something even more outlandish in the Lazarus Pits?

It's not turning around if the basis for altering his chemical origins had nothing to do with realism. Nolan has stated plenty of times he was attracted to the idea of literally putting on a clown visage. A concept that is a bit diluted if Joker was created that way already.

 

[truth]

I don't like this notion I am reading of "It's Batman" "It's a Comic Book"

Did anyone read Year One? Or Arkham Asylum? Those are pretty realistic takes on the character. I though Nolan would come and offer a FULLY realistic take on a man being so affected by his parent's death that he would train himself and do something as preposterous as dressing up as a Bat to fight crime. It's mad, but it ain't impossible to happen in the real world. Yes, you can take SOME liberties...but that bullet detective work was pretty shallow. I think Nolan felt he HAD to put some detective work in the film because the fans asked for it and just shoved that in there. I mean, is that the best detective work Batman can do?

The two films do suffer from being contradictory because the real-world elements are stronger and more over-bearing than the fantastical ones. I mean, there are buildings in Tdk with Chicago on them. So when you start seeing comic-book elements happening in such a real-wrold setting, it really just doesn't go.

In Burton's and Shumacher's world, it would throw you off if you had guys in suits talking about RICO and extradition terms. It just would not go with the fantasy world that the directors created.