Arrow Arrow S3 Episode 11, "Midnight City"

[Mike Murdock]

No one really brought up Laurel's Blackmail #317 this episode with the Coolieo wannabe. Now I know,a lot of you are probably law students and will probably find a loophole making what she did possible,but--I thought there was a little thing called "Probable Cause" which prevented cops from just writing down "Joe Smith just robbed a convenience store" and arresting him,when there was no evidence that Joe was anywhere near the scene.

Any law student that has taken professional responsibility shouldn't defend her. What she did was unquestionably unethical. Then again, prosecutors also shouldn't go out and become vigilantes at night* so there's more than one unethical thing going on. However, under the circumstances, I'm glad she at least used her unethical actions to further her illegal nighttime activities rather than trying to pervert the court system instead.

* Defense attorneys named Matt Murdock, on the other hand, are different

I looked at it as bluffing. Not to mention cops try to use scare tactics all the time when interrogating someone so I didn't look at it any different here.

She's not a police officer. The police are allowed to do things prosecutors are not:

Rule 3.8 Special Responsibilities Of A Prosecutor

The prosecutor in a criminal case shall:

(a) refrain from prosecuting a charge that the prosecutor knows is not supported by probable cause;

(b) make reasonable efforts to assure that the accused has been advised of the right to, and the procedure for obtaining, counsel and has been given reasonable opportunity to obtain counsel;

That's all that's needed right there. No need to go into the others. Threatening to charge a crime the prosecutor doesn't believe has probable cause is enough. Frankly, prosecutors shouldn't be leading interrogations, but quite a few break that rule (including some high profile New York ADAs on big cases over the years).

 

[zenith16]

yeah but we all know the writers don't care cause they don't think this will be questioned. which is their mistake
As I said before this show won't win any major awards for it's stories it'll just get teen chose awards cause people like how Amell looks and felicity look for best kiss maybe ratings.

 

[Mikelus]

I looked at it as bluffing. Not to mention cops try to use scare tactics all the time when interrogating someone so I didn't look at it any different here.

Producer Marc Guggenheim is a lawyer too, although is not a guarantee against bad writing. But I agree Laurel was probably bluffing.

Back on the Lazarus Pit, Amell said: We just saw him fall. We’ve seen Oliver survive. So, [we don’t know] whether he went straight off the cliff, whether something broke his fall, whether he hit the ground. We have mystical herbs on the show that have healing powers. We’ve seen a Lazarus Pit, although that’s not something that’s going to be used for Oliver.

http://collider.com/stephen-amell-arrow-interview-tca/#ZXjkJHaqBzW0ZDXF.99

And Guggenheim confirmed Oliver was not dead, quote: "Just very badly hurt. Maseo was speaking poetically."

http://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/post/108958877959/hello-marc-i-was-wondering-did-oliver-really-die

 

[zenith16]

Originally Posted by Primal Slayer I looked at it as bluffing. Not to mention cops try to use scare tactics all the time when interrogating someone so I didn't look at it any different here.

Producer Marc Guggenheim is a lawyer too, although is not a guarantee against bad writing. But I agree Laurel was probably bluffing.

Back on the Lazarus Pit, Amell said: We just saw him fall. We’ve seen Oliver survive. So, [we don’t know] whether he went straight off the cliff, whether something broke his fall, whether he hit the ground. We have mystical herbs on the show that have healing powers. We’ve seen a Lazarus Pit, although that’s not something that’s going to be used for Oliver.

http://collider.com/stephen-amell-arrow-interview-tca/#ZXjkJHaqBzW0ZDXF.99

And Guggenheim confirmed Oliver was not dead, quote: "Just very badly hurt. Maseo was speaking poetically."

http://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/post/108958877959/hello-marc-i-was-wondering-did-oliver-really-die

yeah primal knows this BTW what you quote doesn't fit with what primal said there.

 

[kguillou]

I just saw the episode and really liked it. I'm very much enjoying Laurel's hero journey, she's got that fighting spirit which I like. I'm glad Felicity came to her senses as well. Also, Brick is such a GREAT villain, he's menacing and confident, I'm hoping we see much more of this character in the future.

Now...the big gripe I have... is Oliver. WOW did they rush the s*** out of his recovery. I mean, I get it, the show's called ARROW and they don't wanna spend the rest of the season showing Ollie bandaged and laying on a bed but the preview for next week shows him back in action like nothing ever happened. To me, that very much lessens the impact of Ra's brutal beatdown, that Oliver was able to recover fully in just TWO episodes. I mean come on, that storyline is such wasted potential. I was SO looking forward to seeing Ollie gradually heal and train himself back to full strength and make his epic and triumphant return back to Starling stronger both mentally and physically but...I suppose this just isn't that kind of tv show that wants to spend several episodes with its main hero out of action. Such a shame.

If I sound harsh its because I really love this show and it really irks me when crazy creative decisions like that are made.

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

It is more than likely that Oliver been missing for more a few weeks.......two episode=seperate out for 2 weeks period

This is all about rating.......

 

[zenith16]

I just saw the episode and really liked it. I'm very much enjoying Laurel's hero journey, she's got that fighting spirit which I like. I'm glad Felicity came to her senses as well. Also, Brick is such a GREAT villain, he's menacing and confident, I'm hoping we see much more of this character in the future.

Now...the big gripe I have... is Oliver. WOW did they rush the s*** out of his recovery. I mean, I get it, the show's called ARROW and they don't wanna spend the rest of the season showing Ollie bandaged and laying on a bed but the preview for next week shows him back in action like nothing ever happened. To me, that very much lessens the impact of Ra's brutal beatdown, that Oliver was able to recover fully in just TWO episodes. I mean come on, that storyline is such wasted potential. I was SO looking forward to seeing Ollie gradually heal and train himself back to full strength and make his epic and triumphant return back to Starling stronger both mentally and physically but...I suppose this just isn't that kind of tv show that wants to spend several episodes with its main hero out of action. Such a shame.

If I sound harsh its because I really love this show and it really irks me when crazy creative decisions like that are made.

what you said is fine & understandable

It is more than likely that Oliver been missing for more a few weeks.......two episode=seperate out for 2 weeks period

This is all about rating.......

they said some closet to that when felicity had her break down well a few days the week before was the last the heard from Oliver . But ether way from the viewer perspective it was too fast.

We'll see next then

 

[Agent Orange]

I'm thinking that Ra's let Oliver live. Stabbed him juuuuuuust right to make Merlyn believe that he was dead (though that doesn't explain him surviving the excessive fall). There's no way that the world's greatest assassin flubs that. Ra's doesn't believe that Oliver was Sara's killer and he's trying to draw the real killer out into the open.

 

[DarkKnightSiv]

I'm thinking that Ra's let Oliver live. Stabbed him juuuuuuust right to make Merlyn believe that he was dead (though that doesn't explain him surviving the excessive fall). There's no way that the world's greatest assassin flubs that. Ra's doesn't believe that Oliver was Sara's killer and he's trying to draw the real killer out into the open.

I guess this is a very valid theory..

 

[DCnightwing23]

Let's not forget the writers basically retconned how/where Oliver got stabbed. They initially had him stabbed in the chest on his right side as well as his stomach. Then they end up changing it to him just getting stabbed in the stomach area. Utterly stupid on the writers part.

 

[zenith16]

Let's not forget the writers basically retconned how/where Oliver got stabbed. They initially had him stabbed in the chest on his right side as well as his stomach. Then they end up changing it to him just getting stabbed in the stomach area. Utterly stupid on the writers part.

I did notice when he was walking around & when they showed shirtless talk lying down or drinking that scar was missing and no bandage under his nipple rib cage area just the large one where his abs are with the blood stained gut wound. your right

 

[the dmg]

Loved the episode, I'm starting to enjoy the flashbacks as they begin to tie-in with Ollie's current situation, Amell was right about patience.

I really liked how Roy, Laurel, Digg and Felicity came together across the course of the episode to get the City a win over Brick, it showed their resolve as a team and for me it enhanced all 4 characters.

I am glad Thea stood her ground with Merlyn but I was irritated that he didn't just tell her Ollie was the Arrow, at this point if he thinks he's dead I can't see why he'd not tell her since she knows he is not being fully truthful. I'm also glad that DJ floppy is a member of the LOA, it means he's not far from an arrow or sword!

As usual the action was very good, I particularly liked Ollie's sliding gunplay in the club. t:

Yeah, this episode was firing on all cylinders.

I really don't like how Ollie was "revived" but there seems to be more than they're letting on. Maybe the flashbacks will tie into it. I was kind of hoping there would be some kind of two or three month time jump and Ollie waking out of a coma still healing from the major injuries. Without the use of the Lazarus Pit, maybe they changed the properties of her Soultaker blade, or something. I don't know.

 

[zenith16]

Yeah, this episode was firing on all cylinders.

I really don't like how Ollie was "revived" but there seems to be more than they're letting on. Maybe the flashbacks will tie into it. I was kind of hoping there would be some kind of two or three month time jump and Ollie waking out of a coma still healing from the major injuries. Without the use of the Lazarus Pit, maybe they changed the properties of her Soultaker blade, or something. I don't know.

If she has the sword at all . I still think it's Ras that has the sword

 

[SpideyVille]

What I would like to know is when did Maseo call Tatsu. It sounds like he called her to be there for the sole purpose of reviving Oliver. It seems to imply that he knew that Oliver would "die". It really makes me feel like Ra's set this all up, and "killing" Oliver and having him get better was part of the plan.

 

[coluanprime]

I'd like to pay my compliments to Christina Cox. She's obviously stuck in a tiny role but she's managed to interject some actual personality into a paper-thin character. Her farce line was excellent and it's a pity she caved.

 

[zenith16]

I'd like to pay my compliments to Christina Cox. She's obviously stuck in a tiny role but she's managed to interject some actual personality into a paper-thin character. Her farce line was excellent and it's a pity she caved.

I loved her acting since I saw her in FX the tv serise

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

anyone think we see the mayor again...they wouldn't introduce her to let disappear again. Maybe not this season but perhaps next

 

[Herolee10]

Out of all of the dumbest moments that this show has had in its entire syndication so far, I think the scene featuring Thea telling Malcom that Ra's should be scared of them ranks on top at the moment.lol

Yeah Thea, even though his daughter managed to take you hostage without any trouble and when you had to run away from fighting "Green Arrow"..the guy that Ra's ended up demolishing in a duel.....you think that Ra's should be afraid of you.lol

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

Thea must be manipulate or brainwash by Malcolm.......seem out of character for her to say that......hope there is a reason for the scene

 

[Big Lob]

For the most part, I've always hated street level villains on this show... they finally have a good street level villain in this Brick guy.

He's SUCH a great contrast to Black Canary, who's just starting out. Putting her up against someone she is in no way ready to face, just great stuff.

 

[Mike Murdock]

Producer Marc Guggenheim is a lawyer too, although is not a guarantee against bad writing. But I agree Laurel was probably bluffing.

He is. And I'm looking forward to his Daredevil comic. That being said, the last court scene that felt authentic was in the first season. I actually liked the legal stuff back then. And I think Laurel as an ADA is a good place for her. It just has problems to me and they usually have to do with Laurel acting tough. She just had more credibility as a lawyer in the first season, I guess.

Let's not forget the writers basically retconned how/where Oliver got stabbed. They initially had him stabbed in the chest on his right side as well as his stomach. Then they end up changing it to him just getting stabbed in the stomach area. Utterly stupid on the writers part.

Technically, it's the production staff that decides things like stunt work and where Ollie would be stabbed - unless it's in the script.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Producer Marc Guggenheim is a lawyer too, although is not a guarantee against bad writing. But I agree Laurel was probably bluffing.

Back on the Lazarus Pit, Amell said: We just saw him fall. We’ve seen Oliver survive. So, [we don’t know] whether he went straight off the cliff, whether something broke his fall, whether he hit the ground. We have mystical herbs on the show that have healing powers. We’ve seen a Lazarus Pit, although that’s not something that’s going to be used for Oliver.

http://collider.com/stephen-amell-arrow-interview-tca/#ZXjkJHaqBzW0ZDXF.99

And Guggenheim confirmed Oliver was not dead, quote: "Just very badly hurt. Maseo was speaking poetically."

http://marcguggenheim.tumblr.com/post/108958877959/hello-marc-i-was-wondering-did-oliver-really-die

Yeah...and unfortunately that one moment has incredibly soured this entire season for me. It was such a bad writing choice. It turned what was a great mid season finale into a cheap shock moment to keep viewers around. If they wanted to go with the "he was just badly hurt" angle, they should have filmed it differently.

I'm still legitimately bummed out about that whole thing. The writers cheapened their show, and it's made my enthusiasm for the entire season drop drastically. The Arrow writers have never been amazing, but it's really disappointing that they've regressed after an improved second season.

 

[Jedi Arrow]

Yeah...and unfortunately that one moment has incredibly soured this entire season for me. It was such a bad writing choice. It turned what was a great mid season finale into a cheap shock moment to keep viewers around. If they wanted to go with the "he was just badly hurt" angle, they should have filmed it differently.

I'm still legitimately bummed out about that whole thing. The writers cheapened their show, and it's made my enthusiasm for the entire season drop drastically. The Arrow writers have never been amazing, but it's really disappointing that they've regressed after an improved second season.

In my experience, Season 3 is usually a bump in every show that writers struggle to get over. Once they do, the show gets back to its greatness. For example, the first half of Season 3 of LOST dragged, but by the time the S3 finale came around, it had its legs back under it. I have confidence that Arrow will do the same.

(A notable exception, in my opinion, is Once Upon a Time; IMO, Season 3 has been their best season yet.)

 

[antsman41]

Well, you could say the first 1/3 S3 of 24 and Smallville dragged yet... became their best seasons for both when everything payed off.

 

[fire117]

I continue to be disturbed with how Laurel as well as the team are going to these great lengths to hide the fact Sara is dead from her own father. Going as far as copying her voice and using it in this episode??! WTF?? Just tell him already, it's disgusting.

Agreed.

The whole keeping Sara's death from her dad is really dragging on.

They should just have him find out already.