The Dark Knight In Heath We Trust: A Ledgerbration: The TDK Joker Appreciation Thread - Part 1

[Gothamsknight]

I feel you man.

To fair, you can say this was Nolan's choice. He made a brave decision to end the story so conclusively, and a result WB/DC probably feels like it's a dead-end commercially speaking. And maybe Nolan himself would prefer it not to be touched or messed with. I also wonder if Nolan's recent falling out with WB has anything to do it.

But either way, you'd hope they would find a way to include such a big part of their flagship character's history in some way when it comes to these FanDome events, even if it's just little things.

It's key to remember that Batman Begins quite literally saved the movie franchise after years of WB aimlessly trying to figure out what to do with it. Most casual viewers I know were kind of rolling their eyes at the idea of another Batman movie when Begins was announced. And a lot of fans weren't too keen on the realism angle. The hard reboot idea had never really been attempted before. It was completely uncharted territory. Sure, it's inevitable that something would've been done with it eventually, but to the same level of success as what the trilogy achieved? I'm not so sure. It was exactly the right vision for the time IMO, especially because it differentiated itself so well from all the other cape flicks and blockbusters of the time. It was the first time a complete vision for the character was able to be seen through from beginning to end without having the plug pulled or having it creatively hijacked. I know the trilogy also re-ignited an interest in the comics and broader world for a lot of people, myself included.

We've seen examples of what can happen when a relaunch doesn't exactly go right. Superman Returns, BvS. It makes you wonder where the franchise might be today if Batman Begins hadn't been able to restore audience faith.

Oh yes, absolutely. I remember in 2005, a few people were telling me they were more excited for Fantastic Four than Batman Begins due to Batman and Robin years earlier. It's pretty crazy to think about how Nolan really changed the landscape of superhero cinema. When Batman Begins came out, I loved it. I really really loved it, and I actually preferred it to Burtons 1989 film, though i don't think people were quite ready to say THAT yet at the time. I think once people finally saw the movie though, and that beautiful ending tease, the hype started to grow for where that new world can go to next. We all know what TDK hype train was like, and the build up and eventual release exceeding all of our expectations. All of it was pretty much a perfect storm for the time, so I can certainly get why "leaving it alone" could be the best option. I just wish it'd be included more in compilations and stuff. I mean, I actually like Batman Forever, but come on man, that's in there and not even one of Nolans movies?

 

[BatLobster]

Oh yes, absolutely. I remember in 2005, a few people were telling me they were more excited for Fantastic Four than Batman Begins due to Batman and Robin years earlier. It's pretty crazy to think about how Nolan really changed the landscape of superhero cinema. When Batman Begins came out, I loved it. I really really loved it, and I actually preferred it to Burtons 1989 film, though i don't think people were quite ready to say THAT yet at the time. I think once people finally saw though movie though, and that beautiful ending tease, the hype started to grow for where that new world can go to next. We all know what TDK hype train was like, and the build up and eventual release exceeding all of our expectations. All of it was pretty much a perfect storm for the time, so I can certainly get why "leaving it alone" could be the best option. I just wish it'd be included more in compilations and stuff. I mean, I actually like Batman Forever, but come on man, that's in there and not even one of Nolans movies?

Yep, that's all I'm saying, it should be included when they're doing a montage of DC films and preaching this idea that all canon is canon.

Although I do hope the inclusion of Forever was a hint that maybe the Schumacher Cut is indeed coming, hehe.

 

[I Am The Knight]

A 4-hour version of TDKR where Heath was able to reprise his role and we got to see some of the delicious scenarios we're talking about play would pretty much be my ultimate.

I wish I lived in a timeline where that existed instead of the Snyder Cut...

Lawd.

 

[BatLobster]

Lawd.

Hey, power to anyone who loves it and Zack's vision. I respect that he got to complete his vision and it was the right thing for WB to do after the way that whole situation played out. Just wasn't for me at the end of the day and there's a pretty long list of 'what if' scenarios and alternate cuts I'd trade it for, including the Schumacher Cut of BF. The fact that fans of that universe got utterly spoiled with a 4 hour cut of a movie that wasn't ever supposed to be seen from their favorite director-- a total pipedream...and still so many of them couldn't just take the W and leave it at that. That's where they lose me.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Hey, power to anyone who loves it and Zack's vision. I respect that he got to complete his vision and it was the right thing for WB to do after the way that whole situation played out. Just wasn't for me at the end of the day and there's a pretty long list of 'what if' scenarios and alternate cuts I'd trade it for, including the Schumacher Cut of BF. The fact that fans of that universe got utterly spoiled with a 4 hour cut of a movie that wasn't ever supposed to be seen from their favorite director-- a total pipedream...and still so many of them couldn't just take the W and leave it at that. That's where they lose me.

I certainly thought it was neat to see that "Snyder Cut". That version of the DC universe is not quite for me but still, interesting to see, so I wouldn't wish it away. Stuff like Birds of Prey and WW84 also aren't quite for me, but I do appreciate that WB can allow those kinds of films to exist and then also release something like the new Batman. Quality is all over the place, but the DCEU and whatever the Batman is are a diverse lot.

Anyway, not sure if I'd want more from the Nolan version of Batman as it's a complete story. I know the Burton Batman has a sequel comic, but I think that makes sense since there was never an "ending" for that version (even though Forever and B&R can be considered as loose sequels).

 

[Brother Jack]

Part of me likes the fact that TDKT exists within the franchise on this kind of hermitic island. Nolan told his story in three parts with a definite conclusion and that's that. No spin-offs, no proposed sequels down the line. As much as I love that world and that interpretation of the mythos, part of why I love it is that it is a complete and self-contained story. Having said that, if WB decides to do something with the "Nolanverse" at some point, and Nolan gives it his blessing, then I won't be able to stop myself from getting hyped.

 

[BatLobster]

I certainly thought it was neat to see that "Snyder Cut". That version of the DC universe is not quite for me but still, interesting to see, so I wouldn't wish it away. Stuff like Birds of Prey and WW84 also aren't quite for me, but I do appreciate that WB can allow those kinds of films to exist and then also release something like the new Batman. Quality is all over the place, but the DCEU and whatever the Batman is are a diverse lot.

You're right, it was a bit petty of me to say. I meant it more in the sense that, "if given the option..." there are other "holy grails" for me. Including things that simply just never came to pass, like a third Burton Batman film or a fourth Raimi Spider-Man film (still up for both- just sayin' ). But also thought the SC offered a cool, very rare thing to get to see a completely alternate version of the same film. And it might actually be my favorite Snyder DC film...although the Knightmare ending sequence really irrationally soured me on it.

Part of me likes the fact that TDKT exists within the franchise on this kind of hermitic island. Nolan told his story in three parts with a definite conclusion and that's that. No spin-offs, no proposed sequels down the line. As much as I love that world and that interpretation of the mythos, part of why I love it is that it is a complete and self-contained story. Having said that, if WB decides to do something with the "Nolanverse" at some point, and Nolan gives it his blessing, then I won't be able to stop myself from getting hyped.

I definitely try to focus on that as a positive. The fact that it's a complete story with a clear beginning, middle and end is possibly one of the most rare things to exist in the genre at this point, so I completely do value that and try to remind myself of that when I find myself pining for more.

I just don't want to see it completely recede as DC saturates us with content, that's all. At the very least I hope there are plenty of more theatrical screenings of the films in the years to come because I will always be down to watch those on the big screen if given the chance.

Or seeing the films with a live orchestra would be amazing. I saw Star Wars ANH and Empire that way and it was a wonderful experience.

 

[I Am The Knight]

You're right, it was a bit petty of me to say. I meant it more in the sense that, "if given the option..." there are other "holy grails" for me. Including things that simply just never came to pass, like a third Burton Batman film or a fourth Raimi Spider-Man film (still up for both- just sayin' ). But also thought the SC offered a cool, very rare thing to get to see a completely alternate version of the same film. And it might actually be my favorite Snyder DC film...although the Knightmare ending sequence really irrationally soured me on it.

I got ya. And by the way I think a lot of us, back then (10 years ago basically!) had a very different image of what a third Nolan Batman was going to be like versus what Nolan actually made, so I definitely do wonder sometimes about this stuff.

Just this morning I was thinking about the cancelled live action Batman Beyond movie. That's something I would love to see one day, especially since it would be so different. Not sure I'd call it my holy grail, but I do want to see a bold filmmaker make that film.

As for the Knightmare sequence in the SC, that was just bull****.

 

[Rick190293]

Oh and there's Nolan rupture with WB. Pretty sure this influenced the lack of TDK trilogy content at Fandome.

 

[Gothamsknight]

Hey, power to anyone who loves it and Zack's vision. I respect that he got to complete his vision and it was the right thing for WB to do after the way that whole situation played out. Just wasn't for me at the end of the day and there's a pretty long list of 'what if' scenarios and alternate cuts I'd trade it for, including the Schumacher Cut of BF. The fact that fans of that universe got utterly spoiled with a 4 hour cut of a movie that wasn't ever supposed to be seen from their favorite director-- a total pipedream...and still so many of them couldn't just take the W and leave it at that. That's where they lose me.

Agreed. And I think, for me, it's less about the Snyder Cut being released and more about how portions of that fanbase have harassed and insulted the very people who greenlit the project in the first place.

the Schumacher cut of Batman Forever is the only cut I'm honestly interested in lol.

 

[Kane52630]

 

[antsman41]

I miss his vibes… so much.

 

[Gothamsknight]

Such an incredible talent gone way too soon.

 

[BatLobster]

A week late, but just wanted to send a shout out to Heath. 14 years since he passed. Crazy to think it's been that long now. This performance doesn't astound me any less than it did 14 years ago. It still feels like something of a miracle, and a gift.

Cheers to a legend.

 

[Gothamsknight]

A week late, but just wanted to send a shout out to Heath. 14 years since he passed. Crazy to think it's been that long now. This performance doesn't astound me any less than it did 14 years ago. It still feels like something of a miracle, and a gift.

Cheers to a legend.

Yup. Just rewatched The Dark Knight the other day for the millionth time as part of my "lead up to The Batman rewatch" and his performance is just as brilliant and terrifying as it was back then. His performance will live on, and will always be a reminder of what a brilliant person and actor he was and also how committed too.

 

[Brother Jack]

I'm a couple years older now than Heath ever was. It's strange. I was a teenager when the film came out and though I knew how young he was when he died, I couldn't really quantify how young 28 really was until I passed it myself. That he'd done so much stellar work at his age, and played Joker when he was 27 for God's sake is now so much more impressive to me. Impressive and tragic knowing he still had so much of his life ahead of him.

 

[antsman41]

Gosh, there are so many A24 or Neon roles I wish Heath was around for.

 

[Gothamsknight]

I'm a couple years older now than Heath ever was. It's strange. I was a teenager when the film came out and though I knew how young he was when he died, I couldn't really quantify how young 28 really was until I passed it myself. That he'd done so much stellar work at his age, and played Joker when he was 27 for God's sake is now so much more impressive to me. Impressive and tragic knowing he still had so much of his life ahead of him.

Same. I'm 28 now and it hits me even more than before what an incredible talent he was.

 

[DoomRulz]

A week late, but just wanted to send a shout out to Heath. 14 years since he passed. Crazy to think it's been that long now. This performance doesn't astound me any less than it did 14 years ago. It still feels like something of a miracle, and a gift.

Cheers to a legend.

The man and the role that inspired me to become an actor. I wish I could have told him that

 

[BatmanBeyond]

"Beautiful... Isn't it ??"

I heard this

 

[Gothamsknight]

I don't think I've ever seen this pic.

 

[The Joker]

That's awesome. I've never seen that pic before.

 

[BatLobster]

Yup, that's a new one for me as well. Nice find!

 

[Matt.S99]

I'm a couple years older now than Heath ever was. It's strange. I was a teenager when the film came out and though I knew how young he was when he died, I couldn't really quantify how young 28 really was until I passed it myself. That he'd done so much stellar work at his age, and played Joker when he was 27 for God's sake is now so much more impressive to me. Impressive and tragic knowing he still had so much of his life ahead of him.

Whoa, he was only 28?? I honestly thought he was in his 30s when he passed.
I’m turning 30 this year and just like you said, you don’t even realize how young that is until you are that age or older.
Pretty wild that he accomplished something so ground breaking at such a young age.
No matter who comes after and no matter how well they do in the role, Heath has solidified his place in not only Batman history, but movie history as a whole.

 

[Sawyer]