Live-Action The Little Mermaid

[THORin]

Since when was Disney's TLM set in Europe? Evidence please

Its not. I thought I had made that clear a while ago, but some people clearly didn’t get the memo. TLM is not set in Denmark, and probably not anywhere in Europe either. Most signs point to it being set in the Caribbean.

 

[RockSP]

So what is that supposed to mean? I find it funny that whenever a character is black washed people always bring up the white washing of Asian, Middle Eastern and Hispanic characters. If this is about making up for past white washing shouldn't those groups be first in line to replace white characters. But it always seems to be black actors that benefit.

LOL...so what are you saying here? You'd be cool with racebending as long as it's not with black actors? Heh, if so I at least appreciate the honesty. It's also hilarious and telling that you see playing a white character as a "benefit".

Pretty sure he was supposed to pass as white in the series.

Indeed. Most people didn't know Cain was part Asian at the time, and in story people thought the character of Clark was the biological son of the Kents, after all.

 

[chaseter]

No, actually you can't. Bruce/Batman are not defined by their race, they're defined by the wealth and characteristics. Black Panther and Mulan are both characters that you couldn't race swap while retaining the central ethnic components that make them who they are. Your argument of because the character has always been white in the comics has no grounds other than it's what you're use to.



Who said anything about make him black? Just because you race swap a traditionally white character doesn't mean the default is a black person. James Bond is a white old money Brit since when? We barely have had any references to his upbringing besides Skyfall. Prior to that, the theory was the '007' title was a codename passed down from agent to agent. Making him any other race wouldn't change his ability to be a deadly MI6 agent or womanizer.

1) No white character is intrinsically white. Any white character could be changed to any other race and that’s that. If anyone makes a stink they are called racists. All other races have stories told that define their culture and ethnicity. I get that part. That’s important for that race and it’s important for us as a larger society to understand each other better. What I don’t get is changing white characters just ‘cause. In this thread, we have people saying that mermaids don’t have any set race but also it’s in the Caribbean so the mermaid should be black. So, mermaids don’t have race but they do. It makes zero sense.

2) Now let me show you your logic. Why can’t Bond be a womanizing lesbian? What about him being a cis gendered man is central to his character? It’s not. Are you homophobic? Lesbians and LGBT don’t get near enough representation as whites or even black people do. Make Bond a woman. #Bondsostraight

 

[THORin]

2) Now let me show you your logic. Why can’t Bond be a womanizing lesbian? What about him being a cis gendered man is central to his character? It’s not. Are you homophobic? Lesbians and LGBT don’t get near enough representation as whites or even black people do. Make Bond a woman. #Bondsostraight

Yes, please! I never knew I needed this, but this would honestly be a fantastic idea. #MakeBondAWoman

 

[RockSP]

With this whole drama with skin color and race, it always amazes me how the **** Aquaman worked so well lmao.

That may play into a hypothesis I suggested earlier in this thread that people mostly have a problem with racebending when it involves black actors (specifically white characters being played by black actors. If a black character is played by a non-black actor the racebending naysayers get quiet). Momoa played Conan the barbarian too and most complaints I saw were about the movie sucking, not racebending. Not to say I saw all the complaints on the world wide web of course, lol.

 

[Sithborg]

And a special breed seems to come out when it involves women. Especially for those that I would consider... "formative" in some of their views.

 

[RockSP]

Never realized how common Hollywood tends to default casting a redhead/ginger character to an African American till now.

Saw a version of this on facebook the other day, but it didn't have quite as may characters in it. Who is the character between April and Ariel, and the "not actually racebent" character under Josie?

Also not sure why they included Zendaya's character since she isn't Mary Jane, or Anna Diop since her Starfire still has red hair.

 

[Zarex]

Pretty sure he was supposed to pass as white in the series.

1) No white character is intrinsically white. Any white character could be changed to any other race and that’s that. If anyone makes a stink they are called racists. All other races have stories told that define their culture and ethnicity. I get that part. That’s important for that race and it’s important for us as a larger society to understand each other better. What I don’t get is changing white characters just ‘cause. In this thread, we have people saying that mermaids don’t have any set race but also it’s in the Caribbean so the mermaid should be black. So, mermaids don’t have race but they do. It makes zero sense.

The point I was clumsily attempting to make is that mermaids don't have any set race, so a dark skinned version is a perfectly reasonably interpretation. And since the Disneyfied version is set in the Caribbean, which has a large population of similarly pigmented folks, Ms. Bailey's Ariel seems to fit the story they are attempting to tell.

 

[superion]

Its not. I thought I had made that clear a while ago, but some people clearly didn’t get the memo. TLM is not set in Denmark, and probably not anywhere in Europe either. Most signs point to it being set in the Caribbean.

Well this guy goes through a fairly ridiculous analysis of the Little Mermaid and believes it takes place in the Mediterranean probably Italy.

https://www.quora.com/What-country-is-the-Disney-version-of-The-Little-Mermaid/answer/C-R-Sierra

 

[THORin]

Well this guy goes through a fairly ridiculous analysis of the Little Mermaid and believes it takes place in the Mediterranean probably Italy.

https://www.quora.com/What-country-is-the-Disney-version-of-The-Little-Mermaid/answer/C-R-Sierra

Trust me, I already read through that entire thing. One of his crucial points is that “the people are white, therefore it can’t be the Caribbean”. That logic relies on the notion that Disney would be culturally accurate, not something they were known for in the 80s. The flora, fauna, dialogue, music, Sebastian’s Jamaican accent - these things point to the Caribbean. The reference to hurricanes points to the Caribbean. And I did actually point out that the Mediterranean was the only other conceivable option for where the film might be set, in which case we’re still looking at Italian or Hispanic inhabitants, not lily white.

 

[superion]

LOL...so what are you saying here? You'd be cool with racebending as long as it's not with black actors? Heh, if so I at least appreciate the honesty. It's also hilarious and telling that you see playing a white character as a "benefit".

I was responding to the person who used what happened with the Last Airbender and Dragon Ball as justification for the casting here. If you are going to say changing races of character is OK to make up for past wrongs than shouldn't the groups that got wronged be the ones who get compensated.

I never said playing a white character is a benefit so I don't know where you got that from. And for the record I don't care for racebending, white washing or changing the sex or sexual preference of any characters.

 

[chaseter]

Any movie with a casting controversy usually ends up being crap and/or it bombs at the box office. The list is long. This will likely not escape that.

 

[MovieSlave]

 

[Charzhin0]

The reason decades of Superman's iconography has been wrapped around a white person is because a black person wasn't allowed the privilege despite the fact a black person is every bit as capable of embodying the qualities which makes Superman an icon.

Regardless, the heavy lifting of the characters success was based on Supermans image - white, tall, male, deep voice and athletically fit. Thats a fact. To deviate significantly from any of this visual template is disrespecting half the character. Giving it to a black actor or a chubby actor or a ugly actor or a female actor (yes Supergirl is just a female tokinised superman) is cheap and an unearned accolade worthy of holding the Superman legacy. In the same way casting a white man for Blade is. Writers of Blade fought hard for decades to push the character in the mainstream. After finally being accepted and loved for who he is, aesthetic included , you think people would be okay if he was cast with a white actor? Would look like white saviour complex, swooping in to steal the kill from a black comic character whose worked hard to get to a high status. Same is true for superman or any other fictional character

 

[MovieSlave]

You all want black Superman? Well Elba is playing him in the movie Hobbs & Shaw.

 

[terry78]

Terry crews wants to be King Triton.

 

[Lily Adler]

Terry crews wants to be King Triton.

 

[The Guard]

I can't believe the whole "But what if a black character, whose identity largely depends on their race, was changed? Would people be okay with that?" is still a counterargument people make when it comes to these racial changes in casting.

Nor can I believe the amount of overthinking and underthinking that goes on during these debates.

"But Bruce Wayne is from old money!", for example.

Well, yeah. Traditonally, he is. Though if Bruce Wayne was portrayed as other than white or European, one imagines that the writers, IF their film intended to explore his family's history at all...would explore it in a slightly different manner. And would it be the same as the well known character's family history? Likely not. That's the point of new takes on things, Something new. And that will likely also be the point of this approach with Ariel.

 

[Primal Slayer]

Bruce's riches could be changed so easily, outside of his parents the rest of his family isn't touched upon that much, certainly not to the point where if you ignore anyone outside of the parents it would change anything about him. He could be black and dad be a self made man or also from family riches.

Not to mention that DC has a whole multiverse out there, one that includes a black Superman....

He been around for awhile, doesn't get used that much but...could easily place a film on his Earth and circumvent all the hate.

And it's just gender-bending a character, doesn't make them any less of a character and people can still connect to them. It all depends on how written they are at the end of the day.

 

[Legendver2]

No one's gonna cast a black Batman because so far all modern Batman portrayals were well received. Only reason a black Superman on film is even talked about now is because the last few reboots all sucked to the general audience, so those rumors are floating around as a way to "shake things up". This Ariel thing is getting flack now because all the previous live action princesses were translated accurately from their animated counterpart, so why change this up now? It's like, hey THAT person's favorite princess was accurately portrayed, so why is Disney ****ing with MY favorite princess?

 

[Legendver2]

He been around for awhile, doesn't get used that much but...could easily place a film on his Earth and circumvent all the hate.

Exactly. Not many are mad about a black Superman, they're just mad about a potential black Clark Kent when there's a perfectly good Calvin Ellis they can make a movie about.

 

[Motown Marvel]

Regardless, the heavy lifting of the characters success was based on Supermans image - white, tall, male, deep voice and athletically fit. Thats a fact. To deviate significantly from any of this visual template is disrespecting half the character. Giving it to a black actor or a chubby actor or a ugly actor or a female actor (yes Supergirl is just a female tokinised superman) is cheap and an unearned accolade worthy of holding the Superman legacy. In the same way casting a white man for Blade is. Writers of Blade fought hard for decades to push the character in the mainstream. After finally being accepted and loved for who he is, aesthetic included , you think people would be okay if he was cast with a white actor? Would look like white saviour complex, swooping in to steal the kill from a black comic character whose worked hard to get to a high status. Same is true for superman or any other fictional character

So now a black actor is "unworthy" of portraying superman? You're not making things easier on yourself, dude.

And no, people would not be okay with a white Blade, nor should they be. Changing a traditionally white character black is not equal to changing a traditionally black character white. There are endless white characters available to be portrayed by endless white actors. The same is not true for black characters and black actors. To take away one of the few black characters and give it to yet another white actor would be unquestionably wrong. it is a matter of equity, not equality. Equality only works if everyone started out equal, and that is unfortunately not the reality we live in.

 

[terry78]

It's the whole "white guys are under attack" thing that's causing this ****.

 

[daddydivine]

First of all no movie fails because of a race change. Lone Ranger, God's of Egypt, Ghost in the Machine, and Fantastic Four were all terrible movies. If the Little Mermaid fails it will be because it was a terrible movie not because Ariel was black. Doctor Strange and Iron Man did some pretty big white washing and it worked out just fine. People forgive great performances no matter what color you are. If Hailey and the movie does great but the only reason you don't like it is because she's black, then you have bigger issues.

I'm always surprised when people are like." Why not hire the best actress or director for a role?" Then are surprised when they see a minority actor not playing a minority role.

And yes. If Brad Pitt gets hired to play Black Panther he damned well better have an Oscar ready performance. He better be transcendent. I want to be like."I know T'challa is black but Brad Pitt played that role."

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Exactly. Not many are mad about a black Superman, they're just mad about a potential black Clark Kent when there's a perfectly good Calvin Ellis they can make a movie about.

Agreed. The problem isn't a black Superman. Kryptonians could be anything. it is a black Clark Kent. Clark Kent was raised as a rural white Kansas farmboy. It is who he is and who he becomes as an adult reflects that experience. A black man growing up in the middle of Trumpland like that would have a very different experience to the point where he would be essentially a completely different character. It simply isn't realistic to make that change without addressing it.

As for a black Ariel, I have no problem with that. Nothing about that character is dependent on race.