More Talking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Chris Wallace]

We've established that the Hulk can speak. I want to hear more from him next time than grunts & growls. If he can say "Leave me alone" & "Hulk smash", he can talk in every scene.
I now refer anyone who disagrees to my sig.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Am I alone on this one?

 

[Leto]

"Hulk is the strongest one there is!"

I'd like to see that.

 

[Gamma Ra]

Am I alone on this one?

No, I agree 100% and have been saying it since Ang Lee's Hulk 2003! A non-speaking Hulk is not interesting to the average movie goer, no matter how good the animated emotions are portrayed.

The scene that seemed to catch most people off guard, myself included, was in the bottling factory when Hulk says 'leave me alone.' It felt like eveyone in the theater was thinking, 'did he just say...' That was fantastic because it's one of his signature lines. It brings a different and unique dimension to the character. Think about it, this angry, surly force of nature will be just as docile as a new born child, if you'd just leave him alone. But when provoked...'his bite back is legendary'word: Ed Norton view).

I still think the right Hulk for the movie franchise is the Gravage version. And if Marvel Studios wants the right board of trustees that the script writers and film makers should go to, it should be Tom Defalco, Len Wein, Roger Stern, Peter David and Greg Pak, guys who know what makes the Hulk tick.

 

[Chris Wallace]

My main thing is, if I wanted a non-speaking, grunting & growling Hulk, I'd watch some Ferrigno reruns & be done with it.

 

[kedrell]

^Exactly! But I'd go further than that. I happen to not want the silly 3rd person speach from the Hulk and catch-phrases don't impress me, nor am I slavishly devoted to them. I want him speaking like Lee and Kirby originally envisioned him, which is also how Peter David was so successful in his run on the comic. Focus more on the Jeckyl/Hyde aspect and less on the Frankenstein aspect. Hulk isn't a side-effect, he's a fully formed character. Until they do this, Hulk will not be very interesting to anyone except people who are already fans. And the movies can't succeed with just them.

 

[Gamma Ra]

^That's the Hulk that has been dubbed Gravage by Hulk fans. He can articulate as normal as the average person but can become as savage as any animal. I love Savage Hulk, but the critics would have a field day with him.I believe that if Hulk voices his opinions people will accept him more. Heck as you've pointed out with Peter David's Hulk run, and more recently Greg Pak's, I think most people prefer the normal speaking Hulk. Imagine the Culver State battle and Hulk bellowing "didn't I tell you to leave me alone. Now look what you made me do." or Betty asking him why did he go ape **** on those soldiers and his reply "Because they started it." or her calling him Bruce and his reply while in deep thought 'I'm not Banner. Banner's weak.'Oh, the possibilities.

 

[Chris Wallace]

I don't want the childish, third person speech all the time. I like Gamma Ra's ideas. But at the same time, I got a chill when I heard "Hulk smash!" Then again, I loved hearing "Take it all!" in the original film. There has to be a workable middle ground. Reasonably intelligent speech, but not quite on Banner's level.

 

[kedrell]

^That's the Hulk that has been dubbed Gravage by Hulk fans. He can articulate as normal as the average person but can become as savage as any animal. I love Savage Hulk, but the critics would have a field day with him.I believe that if Hulk voices his opinions people will accept him more. Heck as you've pointed out with Peter David's Hulk run, and more recently Greg Pak's, I think most people prefer the normal speaking Hulk. Imagine the Culver State battle and Hulk bellowing "didn't I tell you to leave me alone. Now look what you made me do." or Betty asking him why did he go ape **** on those soldiers and his reply "Because they started it." or her calling him Bruce and his reply while in deep thought 'I'm not Banner. Banner's weak.'Oh, the possibilities.

I like those ideas. That would've given this movie that extra something special that it needed. Utilizing a character like Rick Jones for good comic relief effect would have been a smart choice as well. I'm not saying make it a comedy but even Batman Begins used Alfred in a comic relief role.

 

[Chris Wallace]

I wouldn't mind seeing Rick; perhaps the Hulk could save him at some point & he pals around with Bruce because of it.

 

[Gamma Ra]

I don't want the childish, third person speech all the time. I like Gamma Ra's ideas. But at the same time, I got a chill when I heard "Hulk smash!" Then again, I loved hearing "Take it all!" in the original film. There has to be a workable middle ground. Reasonably intelligent speech, but not quite on Banner's level.

One thing about the Gravage persona, especially when Stan Lee wrote him, is that he tends to refer to himself as Hulk. So he could deliver on the goods.

And Hulk Smash gave me the chills too. t:

I like those ideas. That would've given this movie that extra something special that it needed. Utilizing a character like Rick Jones for good comic relief effect would have been a smart choice as well. I'm not saying make it a comedy but even Batman Begins used Alfred in a comic relief role.

To me Rick Jones' importance to the character is that he's Hulk's voice to the outside world and to all who won't give him a chance because of his raw power and non conformance to the status quo. Rick sees what the audience sees, the up close and personal Hulk view and tries to translate that to a world of characters that views Hulk as one dimentional dangerous threat.

I wouldn't mind seeing Rick; perhaps the Hulk could save him at some point & he pals around with Bruce because of it.

I'd like that too.

 

[Chris Wallace]

It's already been established that they aren't following the letter of the comics. That's fine. They've also shown us how they can incorporate several elements & not quite lose the uninitiated viewers. I feel like they've been keeping his lines few & far between for the benefit of the TV show fans. I don't think it's necessary. They'll adapt. They adapted to the Hulk being a giant monster & not a 300 pound bodybuilder. The same way Batman TV fans adapted to a grim, brutal vigilante who barely spoke. So Batman-less talk, Hulk-more talk. It's that simple.

 

[Chris Wallace]

One thing about the Gravage persona, especially when Stan Lee wrote him, is that he tends to refer to himself as Hulk. So he could deliver on the goods.

And Hulk Smash gave me the chills too. t:



To me Rick Jones' importance to the character is that he's Hulk's voice to the outside world and to all who won't give him a chance because of his raw power and non conformance to the status quo. Rick sees what the audience sees, the up close and personal Hulk view and tries to translate that to a world of characters that views Hulk as one dimentional dangerous threat.



I'd like that too.

Were you watching the 90's animated series when you wrote that bit about Rick? I was watching the Ghost Rider episode last night & it so beautifully illustrated what you're talking about.
"There's a grave injustice...against the Hulk!" "The Hulk never wants to hurt anyone! He just wants to be left alone!"

 

[Gamma Ra]

It's already been established that they aren't following the letter of the comics. That's fine. They've also shown us how they can incorporate several elements & not quite lose the uninitiated viewers. I feel like they've been keeping his lines few & far between for the benefit of the TV show fans. I don't think it's necessary. They'll adapt. They adapted to the Hulk being a giant monster & not a 300 pound bodybuilder. The same way Batman TV fans adapted to a grim, brutal vigilante who barely spoke. So Batman-less talk, Hulk-more talk. It's that simple.

I view the Marvel Studio movieverse Hulk as his own incarnation with his own unique origin. But there are certain unique qualities that should hold true to any incarnation of the Hulk.

I do like the idea that the Hulk is growing and learning as he goes, as Avi Arad put it. But I don't feel that the movie audience is getting that idea. Maybe a scene showing him struggling to get out a thought or him struggling to get out a 'stupid bone back' line after he choked Blonsky with the chain would have gotten the idea that there's more to this Hulk.

Were you watching the 90's animated series when you wrote that bit about Rick? I was watching the Ghost Rider episode last night & it so beautifully illustrated what you're talking about.
"There's a grave injustice...against the Hulk!" "The Hulk never wants to hurt anyone! He just wants to be left alone!"

No, I just view Rick's relationship to Hulk as so. I did like the 90's cartoon though.

Your last statement is key to the character. That's why I think I loved the 'Leave me alone' line so much. That's the Frankenstein aspect of the Hulk. Don't mess with him and he won't #### you up.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Quite true. It's just that that episode so greatly parallelled your point, better than any comic reference I could come up with off the top of my head.

 

[spacetrain]

No, I agree 100% and have been saying it since Ang Lee's Hulk 2003! A non-speaking Hulk is not interesting to the average movie goer, no matter how good the animated emotions are portrayed.

We need more dialog from the green guy. And I couldn't agree more.....A non-speaking, or practically non-speaking Hulk is not interesting to the general movie public. I thought that in 2003 too.

Even though Hulk is not much of a big talker, but give him more dialog, that will give more dimension, character, and personality to Hulk.

Imagine, spiderman or Ironman, once in there suits, become mute....this will make the movie less, interesting...because you dont know what they are thinking or feeling.

Talk Hulk! Talk!

 

[Chris Wallace]

I view the Marvel Studio movieverse Hulk as his own incarnation with his own unique origin. But there are certain unique qualities that should hold true to any incarnation of the Hulk.

I do like the idea that the Hulk is growing and learning as he goes, as Avi Arad put it. But I don't feel that the movie audience is getting that idea. Maybe a scene showing him struggling to get out a thought or him struggling to get out a 'stupid bone back' line after he choked Blonsky with the chain would have gotten the idea that there's more to this Hulk.

They touched on it a little bit, the way he struggled to say "Betty."

 

[Gamma Ra]

Imagine, spiderman or Ironman, once in there suits, become mute....this will make the movie less, interesting...because you dont know what they are thinking or feeling.

Talk Hulk! Talk!

Excellent point.

Even King Kong didn't make as much as the studio had hoped. The old growling monster bit is out dated for this movie audience.

 

[Gamma Ra]

They touched on it a little bit, the way he struggled to say "Betty."

Yeah they did but I wish they would have shown more of it, if they are trying to show Hulk learning.

 

[Chris Wallace]

The one upside to his having so few lines is that each one has impact. But I think this can be accomplished even more effectively if all the things mentioned in this thread were incorporated.
BTW-does anyone know who voiced the Hulk & Abomination?

 

[spacetrain]

BTW-does anyone know who voiced the Hulk & Abomination?

Abomination with voice by Tim Roth.
Hulk was voice by Lou Ferrigno.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Really? Cool.

 

[Gamma Ra]

All in all, the lack of Hulk dialog didn't hinder my enjoyment of this superb movie.

 

[Chris Wallace]

Nor mine. I'd just like more. It's like, Spider-Man's few-and-far-between wisecracks didn't hurt my enjoyment of his movies. But I wouldn't mind more of them.

 

[Gamma Ra]

One of the ironies of the character of the Hulk is that when angered, he's as powerful as the most destructive forces of nature, yet he's seeking peace, and his place in a world that misunderstands and hates him. It would have been interesting to hear him state that he thinks fighting, guns, weapons and violence are stupid, but being true to Hulk, have him state that if soldiers want to fight, he'll give them a fight to remember.

I think there are so many facets that can be touched on and explored with a vocal Hulk that are left out when he doesn't speak.