Season 6, Episode 6 "Blood of My Blood" Discussion Thread

[Schlosser85]

^ Pretty much sums it up. Except with the latest addition of "let's all join a cult, clearly this will solve all our problems!"

Tommen's gone from being just useless to an active obstacle.

I suspect he and High Sparrow are both not long for this world.

 

[Pink Ranger]

I'm not trying to start anything here, but it's interesting that the show, in its current incarnation, has most of its fans rooting for people born into relatively immense privilege trying to regain it (the Lannisters, the Starks) and condemning as villains the poor and middle class trying to get ahead in a fairly barbaric culture (Littlefinger, the Boltons, the High Sparrow). It's amazing to see American-style liberals suddenly acting as British-style conservatives when the lives of attractive actors in period costumes is at stake.

 

[chamber-music]

If anyone opposed Tommen he'd start polishing the crown and throne for the new guy and start working on a welcome feast.

Tommen would probably give Danenarys the Iron Throne if she asked nicely

 

[Pink Ranger]

Tommen would probably give Danenarys the Iron Throne if she asked nicely

He'd give her the throne if she let him ride one of the dragons around the city. And maybe if she agrees to make out with Margery.

 

[wampa1]

Care to elaborate? Am curious.....

Spoiler

Wildfire

 

[Iceman]

Tommen would probably give Danenarys the Iron Throne if she asked nicely

He'd give her the throne if she let him ride one of the dragons around the city. And maybe if she agrees to make out with Margery.

These actions would certainly prove her worthy.

 

[Pink Ranger]

Tommen is the last "Baratheon" we know about, right? No brothers, no uncles, no cousins. If he dies, the kingdom basically descends into chaos within the hour, right?

 

[Matt]

Tommen is the last "Baratheon" we know about, right? No brothers, no uncles, no cousins. If he dies, the kingdom basically descends into chaos within the hour, right?

Actually, and a bit ironically, if Tommen were to die and we do not accept the claim of Baratheon bastards (one of whom still lives on the show), Tommen's next of kin would be Dany. Robert was the Mad King's second cousin. That is how he justified his claim to the throne after the rebellion. Tommen has no remaining siblings. He has no remaining cousins of the Baratheon bloodline because his only one, Shireen, is dead and produced no heirs. Dany, Tommen's fourth cousin, is his closest living relative of the Baratheon bloodline due to Robert's maternal grandmother.

In other words, if Tommen dies, Dany will have a claim to the thrown that is legitimate through the Baratheon line of descent. Chew on that for a bit.

 

[Iceman]

Ha, that's pretty cool. I hope someone in the book/show brings it up (if it hasn't already been brought up).

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

I mean, he may. But I don't think he is looking for a clean battle. His strategy is to let his enemies fight one another then swoop in and clean up the remnants. If the Lannister/Tyrell alliance and the Faith Militant fight each other to near decimation, it would be easy for him to swoop in and take the city from the survivor. Especially if he can get the commoners rallied behind him (which would be easy if Cersei wipes out the Faith).

Let's not forget Dorne. I mean I wish we could because I dislike that part of the show, but they could attack King's Landing and perhaps seize the Iron Throne too.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

Poor Tommen is going to die. A kid that nice doesn't last long in this world. He has already been used as a pawn a couple times

Cersei's old prophecy is coming to fruition and there's a "gold shroud" reserved for Tommen. I'd be surprised if he even survived this season...

 

[Matt]

Cersei's old prophecy is coming to fruition and there's a "gold shroud" reserved for Tommen. I'd be surprised if he even survived this season...

I stand by my prediction:

- Tommen dies in a manner that is inadvertently caused by Cersei as part of her clash with the Faith

- Cersei defeats the Faith but at the expense of her son

- This causes civil unrest/disdain toward the Lannisters and the Tyrells

- Littlefinger uses the civil unrest to take the throne for himself

 

[chamber-music]

Actually, and a bit ironically, if Tommen were to die and we do not accept the claim of Baratheon bastards (one of whom still lives on the show), Tommen's next of kin would be Dany. Robert was the Mad King's second cousin. That is how he justified his claim to the throne after the rebellion. Tommen has no remaining siblings. He has no remaining cousins of the Baratheon bloodline because his only one, Shireen, is dead and produced no heirs. Dany, Tommen's fourth cousin, is his closest living relative of the Baratheon bloodline due to Robert's maternal grandmother.

In other words, if Tommen dies, Dany will have a claim to the thrown that is legitimate through the Baratheon line of descent. Chew on that for a bit.

Who is next in line after Dany?

 

[Matt]

Who is next in line after Dany?

No clue.

As far as I am aware, in the context of the show anyway, she is the last legitimate Targaryen and would be the last legitimate blood relative of Robert. I'd imagine there would be several claims in that situation, ranging from distant relatives of one family or the other (through marriage, distant cousins, etc) to bastards.

In that situation, assuming we are going based solely on Robert's line of inheritance, I'd say that Gendry has the best claim. Even if R+L=J turns out to be true, unless Jon was somehow legitimized, they are both bastards. That gives Gendry the better claim because he is Robert's son, where as Jon would be his fifth cousin. If Jon were legitimized (say R&L married), he would have a better claim per Westerosi laws.

Now if we are going based on Targaryen succession, Jon has a better claim than Gendry in that situation.

 

[Pink Ranger]

Actually, and a bit ironically, if Tommen were to die and we do not accept the claim of Baratheon bastards (one of whom still lives on the show), Tommen's next of kin would be Dany. Robert was the Mad King's second cousin. That is how he justified his claim to the throne after the rebellion. Tommen has no remaining siblings. He has no remaining cousins of the Baratheon bloodline because his only one, Shireen, is dead and produced no heirs. Dany, Tommen's fourth cousin, is his closest living relative of the Baratheon bloodline due to Robert's maternal grandmother.

In other words, if Tommen dies, Dany will have a claim to the thrown that is legitimate through the Baratheon line of descent. Chew on that for a bit.

Fast forward to Season 7, Episode 2. After a long and arduous sea voyage, Daenerys arrives on the shores of Westeros. Flanked by her three mighty dragons, her wise counsel Tyrion, her skilled warriors Daario and Gray Worm, her most loyal servant Ser Jorah, who now has become a powerful human-dragon hybrid due to his grayscale treatments, and her combined army of Unsullied, Dothraki and Second Sons, along with the allied armies of House Martel, the she-conqueror stands to speak.

DAENERYS: I claim this kingdom for the Targaryen dynasty! All who oppose us shall perish! My people, we may need to wage war upon the traitors, for years, for decades, even for generations, but we shall prevail!

Suddenly, Grand Maester Pycelle stumbles out of a nearby bush.

PYCELLE: Oh, hello there. King Tommen choked on a chicken bone last night, and died. According to my records, the Iron Throne is now yours. So, welcome back, your majesty.

DAENERYS: Huh, lucky, that. Oh well, I guess that's it then.

[size=+3]THE END[/size]

 

[Iceman]

You can see that Tommen and Joffrey are brothers, so alike they may be twins.

 

[Fist of Khonshu]

I stand by my prediction:

- Tommen dies in a manner that is inadvertently caused by Cersei as part of her clash with the Faith

- Cersei defeats the Faith but at the expense of her son

- This causes civil unrest/disdain toward the Lannisters and the Tyrells

- Littlefinger uses the civil unrest to take the throne for himself

Not sure about the Tyrells because Margaery is one, she is rather popular, and she certainly cannot be discounted in what unfolds here. She's clearly playing everybody at this point in order to take revenge on Cersei and establish her power (per her original ambition) as "The Queen".

 

[Pink Ranger]

It's safe to say Margaery has a male child very soon, the story almost demands it. That cements her power and totally changes the dynamic.

 

[kane9321]

Tommen is safe till last season. He needs to be in power for Dany or John to oppose.

I'm thinking we'll discover Jaqen is or was the water dancer. Too much coincidence with Arya

that would be pretty sweet IF that happened

 

[Marvolo]

Care to elaborate? Am curious.....

Finale spoilers:

Spoiler

Wildfire. According to leaks, she roasts their asses with wildfire in the season finale.

 

[Marvolo]

Actually, and a bit ironically, if Tommen were to die and we do not accept the claim of Baratheon bastards (one of whom still lives on the show), Tommen's next of kin would be Dany. Robert was the Mad King's second cousin. That is how he justified his claim to the throne after the rebellion. Tommen has no remaining siblings. He has no remaining cousins of the Baratheon bloodline because his only one, Shireen, is dead and produced no heirs. Dany, Tommen's fourth cousin, is his closest living relative of the Baratheon bloodline due to Robert's maternal grandmother.

In other words, if Tommen dies, Dany will have a claim to the thrown that is legitimate through the Baratheon line of descent. Chew on that for a bit.

Wouldnt [blackout]Jon[/blackout] be ahead of her in the line of succession since [blackout]he is the son of Prince Rhaegar[/blackout]?

 

[Matt]

Wouldnt [blackout]Jon[/blackout] be ahead of her in the line of succession since [blackout]he is the son of Prince Rhaegar[/blackout]?

No, for two reasons:

1) He is a bastard; and (more importantly)

2) You are looking at the Targaryen line of succession, which stopped mattering when the Mad King was overthrown, the Targaryen dynasty ended and the Baratheon dynasty began. Based on Robert's family tree, Dany is closer to Tommen. She is his fourth cousin (like Rhaegar). Jon would be Tommen's fifth cousin (assuming he actually is a Targaryen, who was legitimized before Rhaegar's death). Because Dany is closer in relation to Tommen and the Baratheon bloodline, she would be next. If she died, and he is legitimized, Jon would be next.

 

[Marvolo]

No, for two reasons:

1) He is a bastard; and (more importantly)

2) You are looking at the Targaryen line of succession, which stopped mattering when the Mad King was overthrown, the Targaryen dynasty ended and the Baratheon dynasty began. Based on Robert's family tree, Dany is closer to Tommen. She is his fourth cousin (like Rhaegar). Jon would be Tommen's fifth cousin (assuming he actually is a Targaryen, who was legitimized before Rhaegar's death). Because Dany is closer in relation to Tommen and the Baratheon bloodline, she would be next. If she died, and he is legitimized, Jon would be next.

Spoiler

The Targaryen line is all that matters because it is the only truly legitimate one. They created the united kingdom and the throne. It is their throne and kingdom. The Baratheon line is nothing but a bunch of thieves and usurpers.

And if taking a throne makes a dynasty end then the throne would revert back to the Targ line the moment Jon or Dany claimed it so the Targ line would still supercede the Baratheon line.

And we dont know that Jon is a bastard. Rhaegar and Lyanna had enough time to marry before Jon was born.

 

[Matt]

Spoiler

The Targaryen line is all that matters because it is the only truly legitimate one. They created the united kingdom and the throne. It is their throne and kingdom. The Baratheon line is nothing but a bunch of thieves and usurpers.

And if taking a throne makes a dynasty end then the throne would revert back to the Targ line the moment Jon or Dany claimed it so the Targ line would still supercede the Baratheon line.

And we dont know that Jon is a bastard. Rhaegar and Lyanna had enough time to marry before Jon was born.

But the question was who would be Tommen's heir. Your point may all be true but it wasn't the question asked.

 

[Marvolo]

But the question was who would be Tommen's heir. Your point may all be true but it wasn't the question asked.

Oh gotcha.