SM3 Lizard Discussion

[DOCock!!!!12345]

if only there was a way to e-mail sam raimi !!! and pitch ideas

 

[SpiderSensesTingling]

Originally posted by Spidey-Boy523
1) That rule only applies to the comics.
2) You always forget:
Rule #3: No one or thing can change rule 1 and/or 2

It's true that I care more about the comic books than I do about the movies, but that doesn't mean I think the movies have to be just like the comics.

But, for some reason I can never remember your rule #3.

Must be because of your rule #2. LOLIYF

 

[Spidey-Bat]

Originally posted by SpiderSensesTingling
It's true that I care more about the comic books than I do about the movies, but that doesn't mean I think the movies have to be just like the comics.

But, for some reason I can never remember your rule #3.

Must be because of your rule #2. LOLIYF

the 1) and 2) weren't rules. It's just my way of saying "First...Second..."

 

[SpiderSensesTingling]

Well, rules 1 and 2 originate from Marvel, actually, and not from me. If you're going to make up your own rule #3, then I figured you must have a rule #1 and #2.

 

[Advocate05]

Rami is not writing it ... Millar, Goulgh, and ??? are the writers.

 

[The Lizard]

I don't think that the Lizard should die at the end of SM3 (if he indeed is in the script) for several reasons:

1. The last two movie villains have "died" (yes, they both could still be alive, but we're supposed to think they're dead).

2. Since Lizzy's alter-ego is Dr. Connors, a friend of Peter's who has a family, the death of Lizzy would not be a "satisfying" villain death since an innocent man would also die.

3. The capture and containment of the Lizard would give a chance to show something new and interesting in the film, like a government-run lab to study Lizzy, or a supervillain prison a la' The Vault.

4. The tragedy of Curt Connors could enable Peter to put his own troubles in perspective and aid in the growth of his character in the film.

 

[Advocate05]

Th Lizard~ how about Shield comes in and picks up the Lizard for "Further study". Since they already mentioned that theres more than Spiderman in the city. And more heroes in the world. I think that would be cool to see. The Helipad hovering over the city and some Shield agnets capturing The Lizard and taking him away. Then, you see the billowing smoke and the eye patch. And Nick Fury thanks Spiderman for holding the creature long enough.

 

[spider-ryan8]

The Lizard should be in 3, and to be honest I would be oftly surprised if he wasn't. He should be viewed as a tragic uncontrollable monster figure but who does have a very real human and family side to him, moreso than Norman or Otto. I think Raimi could have a field day developing the human side of Curt and exploring his J/H complex, and I believe the result is a character the audience can sympathsize with. Three crazed scientist in a row does seem a lil repetitive but, i dont have a major problem with it since they each have their differences.

I would go for GG2 and The Lizard in #3. My story would go somewhat as Harry is very conflicted at the start of the movie, yes he knows he has to avenge his father, but he wants to have some work done on the performance enhancers (test them, improve them to fix his father's mistakes, tweak the goblin costume hopefully and so on). So Harry brings in Dr. Conners. Curt works on the performance enhancers but at the same time wants to use Oscorps facilities to further his regeneration study. One day Curt brings Billy to Oscorp with him for a take your child to work day or something, while there Curt shows Billy some of his work on his reptile study. Harry then comes by and sees the relationship Curt and Billy have, something that him and his father never had and it enrages him. At this same time he also learns of Dr. Conners side project that he didnt realize he was help pay for and lashes out at him physically and verbally infront of Billy. Eventually Curt does turn into the Lizard but alot of his rage is focused towards Harry who does take his new improved performance enhancers and becomes the next goblin. This sets up a relationship where The Lizard wants Harry dead, Harry as the Goblin wants Peter dead, and Peter is just stuck in the middle as someone who wants to save a person he respects (Dr Conners) and keeping him out of harms way and chases him all around town and such; while also trying to mend his relationship with his former best friend harry who is over the edge at this point as the goblin. Peter would be in such a tangled web, and i think its a truly intresting dynamic. Another idea that i would toss out there is that when trying to improve the performance enhancers of his father or after being unsuccessful in killing Peter, Harry combines Dr. Conners work on thinking it will make him unstoppable. Since his father as the Goblin was killed by Spider-Man he has to make improvements to avoid a similar fate and the result is an insane goblin/lizard hybrid. this would solve the problem of the goblin suit looking like a power ranger villan, and also show that Harry is completely over the edge in wanting to avenge his father... feel free to shoot that part down..... but venom in #4

 

[The Green Goblin]

Originally posted by The Lizard
I don't think that the Lizard should die at the end of SM3 (if he indeed is in the script) for several reasons:

1. The last two movie villains have "died" (yes, they both could still be alive, but we're supposed to think they're dead).

2. Since Lizzy's alter-ego is Dr. Connors, a friend of Peter's who has a family, the death of Lizzy would not be a "satisfying" villain death since an innocent man would also die.

3. The capture and containment of the Lizard would give a chance to show something new and interesting in the film, like a government-run lab to study Lizzy, or a supervillain prison a la' The Vault.

4. The tragedy of Curt Connors could enable Peter to put his own troubles in perspective and aid in the growth of his character in the film.

I agree, mostly because of reason #3. Although at one time I favored a TRUELY tragic "tale" in which Connors as The Lizard sacrifices himself to save his son (whom he has kidnapped) from his evil persona.
BUt we've already seen the reformed scientist turn good in the end and save the day with Ock (which by the way )

My question is how violent should the Lizard be? Should he kill? And if so how do you redeem Connors of that and put him back in to society. I'm not sure that in a film it will work for Connors to just go back with his normal life the way he has (at times) in comics and cartoons.

So alive or dead, I still see him as a tragic horror movie figure doomed to destroy himself or to be a lab specimen the rest of his life.

BUt hell, they've given us a "good" Doc Ock and everyone seems to be OK with it, so who knows?

 

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by War Eagle

My question is how violent should the Lizard be? Should he kill? And if so how do you redeem Connors of that and put him back in to society. I'm not sure that in a film it will work for Connors to just go back with his normal life the way he has (at times) in comics and cartoons.

Since I'm in favor of seeing the intelligent talking Lizard for at least part of Spider-Man 3, I'll say that I don't want Lizzy to be TOO bloodthirsty. Remember that in the comics Lizzy considered humans to be beneath him, and only went out of his way to kill Spider-Man. Now, if Lizzy devolves into a more savage Lizard in the McFarlane comics tradition, he will become much more deadly, but even then I would prefer to see him tear into a SWAT team or some bounty hunters as opposed to innocent people.

 

[TheLizard]

Amen.

 

[Tony Stark]

I think you could setup an interesting scenario with Lizzard in the next movie. By the time the next movie comes out, Peter would have graduated college and be moving on to graduate school, where he could work more directly with Dr. Conners.

 

[Advocate05]

I second that.

 

[Dr.Dude]

I'm all for Lizard in Spider-Man 3. He's always been one of my favorite villains since I about 4 years old, definitely deserves to be in a Spider-movie, and I'd love to see how Raimi approaches him. IMO, he really put to use his "horror-roots" for Doc Ock's tentacles and as result made them truly menacing... and I can imagine him doing the same, maybe even better, for the Lizard. Only without the tentacles, obviously.

 

[The Green Goblin]

Yes Raimi's love of the horror genre would be so fitting for The Lizard.

Would be classivc 50's sci-fi/terror at its best with tons of possiblities for scary moments. Not to mention the personal and tragic relationship between Peter, Connors and his family.

And I agree, there should be more to it than just a Macfarlane like velociraptor running around. The Lizard is one of the most complex villains in the whole gallery IMO. We should see him in various stages of decline.

 

[Boom]

We must find out what hotel Sam and Ted are staying at. We could send them fanmail asking for the Lizard.





I must be losing my mind.

 

[The Green Goblin]

Originally posted by arachnid-kid
We must find out what hotel Sam and Ted are staying at. We could send them fanmail asking for the Lizard.

We should send them a crate full of lizards.

 

[Boom]

That'd be brilliant.


Bellboy: "Mr. Raimi, a package came for you."
Sam Raimi: "Thank you."
Ted Raimi: "There's a note on it. What does it say?"
Sam Raimi: "It says, "Good luck coming up with the story for Spider-Man 3. We think we can help you out. You'll get the idea.""
*Sam opens crate*
Ted Raimi: "What is it?"
Sam: "It's a crate of lizards, dressed up in little white coats."

 

[LORD_GALVATRON]

What, no tattered pants?

 

[Dr.Dude]

Originally posted by arachnid-kid
That'd be brilliant.


Bellboy: "Mr. Raimi, a package came for you."
Sam Raimi: "Thank you."
Ted Raimi: "There's a note on it. What does it say?"
Sam Raimi: "It says, "Good luck coming up with the story for Spider-Man 3. We think we can help you out. You'll get the idea.""
*Sam opens crate*
Ted Raimi: "What is it?"
Sam: "It's a crate of lizards, dressed up in little white coats."

Ha.

 

[Venom o sity]

i'll tell u all why lizard is the best candidate for SM3.

Keep in mind the different themes of SM movies.

SM1 = origins/ birth of a hero
SM2 = struggles that come along w/ the mantle of being a hero

I havent read comics in a long time but i did watch the Animated Series. Dr. Connors has always been that friend Spidey relied on for help whenever he had problems ala the symbiote costume and his 6 arm ordeal.

SM3 should focus on Peter/Dr. Connors relationship. I dunno.. have lunch together. Dr. Connors inviting Pete to a backyard barbeque or picnic w/ special guest cameos by lizards that spoil the party. My point is Lizard is perfect choice for SM3 because he adds that other element of Peter's humanity. Spider-man/Peter Parker doesnt know everything about science. I dont mind if Peter and Dr. Connors go off on scientific jargon but the fact is there is a strong relationship between Spidey and Dr. Connors.

In a sense, Dr. Connors can be that living mentor that helps Spidey cope w/ his problems. SM3 should focus on the theme of family. Spidey cant just let Lizard go off on a killing rampage.. he has to save Dr. Connors, whatever humanity maybe left in the lizard creature.

 

[Figma]

Originally posted by The Lizard
The last two movie villains have "died" (yes, they both could still be alive, but we're supposed to think they're dead).

Yes... and the world must think that they ARE dead until they can control the raging spirit that dwells within them. den den DAAAAAAA!
~ Figma

 

[The Lizard]

Originally posted by arachnid-kid
Sam: "It's a crate of lizards, dressed up in little white coats."

Awwwwww...cute. I want one.

Originally posted by Figma
Yes... and the world must think that they ARE dead until they can control the raging spirit that dwells within them. den den DAAAAAAA!
~ Figma

Ooooo-- somewhat obscure TV Hulk reference!

 

[Figma]

Originally posted by The Lizard
Ooooo-- somewhat obscure TV Hulk reference!

I figure once it appears on Family Guy, it's somewhat less obscure... especially when Peter Griffin is referring to Jesus Christ. So very bad.

~ figma

 

[Boom]

You can't have a Spider-Man franchise using Classic villains without The Lizard.