Sci-Fi Stranger Things (Netflix) - Part 1

Season 3 was great. Steve and Robin are the best, the whole show could be about them and I would be totally okay with that. The pacing was really good. Felt like the quickest Netflix binge ever. I usually feel burned-out after a few episodes because of the Netflix Bloat, but not here. I'm excited for Season 4. :up:

I loved how they used the Day of the Dead score during that Steve/Robin scene in 3x06.


 
The long wait for season 4 has begun. This binge really did felt faster
 
It took a while to get things going, but after episode 3 this has been one hell of an entertaining ride. The cinematography was particularly a highlight for me.
 
Just finished it all.

Okay... That was a hell of a ride. Really, really enjoyed it and really, really enjoyed being back with this cast and these characters and the world of Hawkins.

More in depth analysis follows:

I'm gonna just go Pros and Cons here. FULL SPOILERS FOLLOW.

Pros: Production values.

Let's start off with how good this season looked, and how it kept with the times that the show is set in. Yeah, the opening for sure was the Duffers, Levy and Co. showing off their budget. And the SFX all over and the recreation of the era were obviously not cheap and it all looked great. And I think that You can see that this production design blends into the overall vibe of the show as a love letter to a time and place. This is 1985, and I have always said that the "80's" as people think of them don't really start until 1984. The begining of Reagan's second term (Side note... I'm also of the mind, and sorry 90's kids, but... The 80's didn't really end until 2001. The 90's were just the 80's on steroids, with some important trends and cultural shifts, sure, but all still very much following the path of what the American society was treading in the wake of Reagan's second term.) is what we really think of when we think of the culture, music and movies of the era. And you can see it in the way this season was shot and things like the color pallete and clothing styles.

Cons: Overdoing it a bit.

I will say and this does extend to the recreation of the times that they did so well... This was the season that for my money might have went "to the max" with the 80's nostalgia thing in a way that I felt the previous seasons were a bit more sublte with. Granted... The big things in culture at the time were not subtle so maybe that's why. Still... Things like the use of music were in my view a bit more restrained in the first two seasons. I mean in this season the first episode alone felt like EVERY scene change had a pop music intro. It felt a bit on the nose. So too with the bringing attention to the styles etc. Even for the times this season went a bit overboard. I mean, yeah, some of the fashion, especially for young people looked like that, and a lot of 80's fashion draws attention to itself but having lived through the time I can tell you not everyone looked like they all shopped out of a JC Penny catalog and I know that's how these shows do a lot of their research. Go to Google and punch in fashion for the year and the stuff that they wore on the show comes up... But again, what's recorded online from a catalog doesn't totally reflect what kids and adults wore. Maybe a peeve but this was, like with the music, something that for the first time made me feel a sense of artificiality more often than not with the show. And... This was something that was an issue in other aspects, the over the topness, in other facets of the show this season for me. I understand how what I just described might play into the overall idea of the season as taking place at the ascent of the Go-Go 80's but for all the nostalgia vibes of the first two seasons I never felt it was being shoved down my throat, more it was a pleasant accent in the over all flavor of the show.


Pros: New Players and expanding the roles of established ones.

Steve Harrington is my spirit animal. So I loved his teaming with Robin as played by Maya Hawke. The daughter of Ethan Hawke and Uma Thurman, I'm just gonna say it... Right now she is already a better actor than her mother and father combinded were at the same age she is now. And at first, I wasn't sure how this character was going to fit in and she was seamlessly integrated into things before I even knew it. And then they throw a huge curve by not doing the expected thing by making her Steve's obvious new romantic partner. Sure... Sucks for Steve, but my man didn't dwell on it and soon found a platonic partner in crime by the end, and he showed his immense growth as a character in his reaction to Robin revealing her sexual orientation to him. Also used well was Dacre Mongomery as Billy. Like Steve originally it was easy to assume he was just no good through and through when he first showed up and while we did get some sense that he was a product of his abusive environment, even then I would say for myself I didn't necessarily have all that much empathy for him. But despite him turning into an unwilling vector for the Evil Of The Upside Down and doing terrible things all season long, man... They made you feel sorry for him by the time he died. Eleven's peak into his soul was a reminder that innocence is a state we all spring from. Also expanded this year was the use of Murray the investigative reporter played by Brett Gelman, who saw more involvment "in the field" and who seems destined to be the guy that breaks down through his sharp observational powers our various romantic duos. Hopefully he'll be on hand to diagnose Eleven and Mike's more serious relationship issues in the future.

Cons: Some things were shoved too much to the side though.

The seeming ever expanding roster of heroes in Hawkins however is now getting a might bit unwieldy. The addition of Max to the core kids group for sure needed to happen to add another female to the mix and to develop others in the group like Lucas or Eleven to mirror how we all grow and change as we age through childhood into our teens. Max gets more fleshed out in interacting with Eleven and Eleven gets to develop in ways that are healthy and understandable as a girl going into her teens. Things that are not necessarily going to be even on the minds of our male protagonists who are still quite young and ignorant of the female of the species. Eleven NEEDS Max as a female friend and influence she's not getting to much of anywhere else. Adding Billy filled the role of the hot shot "king of the cool kids" that Steve had abdicated by the end of season one and then was solidified by becoming one of the "hero" group during his Adventures In Babysitting arc in season two and becoming tight with Dustin. All that is fine. But we are getting a bit over loaded and it's affecting things. It's affecting the way the arcs for our core characters are being handled. To my great surprise it's not the adult characters of Joyce and Hopper that were given the short end because of this. No, it's what I think many would consider key cornerstone members of the season one original younger characters. Jonathon has now seemed to be totally subsumed into a mere adjunct character to Nancy. The awkward but soulful and intellectual guy shouldering the responsibility of being the man of the house to his family is now kinda just Nancy's sidekick on her path to self actualization. Part of that's a given, sure. He's her romantic partner. He should be there for her. But you don't get a sense of that smart outsider persona with his own dreams and aspirations we got in season one. Sure, I guess he had an arc of trying to balance out things like needed a job and believing in Nancy, but that felt rather weak, and then, well of course all that is gonna pale in the face of the threat of inter-dimensional monsters. But I chalk that up to the growing roster again. Going back to Lucas, we see that he to is kinda only defined the whole season as Max's boyfriend and as the only other member of the party that's got a girlfriend in Hawkins, of course he's going to be the sounding board and wingman to Mike as he navigates his budding relationship with Eleven. But that feels kind of diminishing to me. More like they just didn't know what else to do with him after he linked up with Max. This brings us to another aspect and another character. As anyone that saw the trailers might think, the growing pains expereinced by our band was an inevitable part of going through years with them, especially since they were so young at the start of it all. The trailers made you think that the pressures of changing status and relationships was going to be a key thing and the early episodes of this season hinted at it, seeming to focus on Will... But then that just fizzles out since it's never given any room to breath, and then BOOM, monster ****, so that's all resolved rather quickly. And I think it really shouldn't have and did a diservice to Will. Will, the character that after Eleven, perhaps moreso even if you think about it, that has been the most traumatized of the core kids. Abducted to the Upside Down and then a host for the evil living there, of course he's going to want to retreat into a safe space and want to remain ensconced in the shell of childhood longer than the others. But like I already mentioned... It doesn't really go anywhere and is dropped altogther. So too with Mike as character on his own. He's completly defined by his borderline obsession with Eleven. And sure... He seems to learn a lesson by the end but it wasn't illustrated all that well for me. They needed some more time to establish that he needed to see Eleven as more than just HIS girlfreind. And these and a few other things are probably a result of things like say, bringing Lucas' sister Erica into the mix, who I honestly knew from the get go would be embraced by the audience, and who I knew right from the get go would annoy the ever loving **** out of me because frankly, I find that kind of precoscious writing for kids to be bull****, and no, I didn't find that to be the case with the core group or teens on this show in the least. Now suddenly, there's this sitcom level character running around with our heroes and it's just too cute. No... Strike that. Cute is fine. Lots of the show has been cute. This was... "cutesie". This was a case of that over the topness this season that undercut things somewhat and had it's apotheosis perhaps in the truly ridiculous and utterly uneeded moment when Dustin sang Limahl's Never Ending Story. Stuff like that or suddenly needing to fill an 80's nostalgia quota (Hey! Remember Back To The Future? Remember New Coke? Remember...) to often was in my mind time in the story that could have been used to further arcs and development for any number of our cast of characters. Again, surprisingly, they didn't cut into stuff like Joyce and Hopper to make more room for development of the kids.

And that's just in thinking on the characters. There's aspects to the overall mythology that were plainly on the back burner or are now permanently consigned to a folder labeld "No... We are NEVER going to get into that or give you an explanation." I was very much of the feeling that the Mind Flayer and the Upside Down needed to be either given a rest or we should be given more information to define it all in some way. Season one and season two beg all kinds of questions... Which despite the threat from this other dimension returning yet again... We got ZERO amounts of any real insight into. The Mind Flayer and his dimension are just an implaccable evil force. Why it is a strange nightmare relfection of our own physically only with no people in it? Who knows? Why does it seem compelled to keep returning to our dimension? They have yet to tell us. What was the purpose exactly of why the U.S government, and now we know the Soviet government, was trying to access this parallel reality anyway? Season three has no anwers to give on that front. I don't think it's unreasonable for me to expect questions that the show inherently asks in presenting the story it does in the way that it does to actually have some kind of answers to them and be given something, anything to quench that questioning with, even if it's a little vague. Mysterious for the sake of being mysterious doesn't have a good track record for series TV (I'm looking right at you LOST and THE X-FILES). **** or get off the pot. If you are just teasing me with this genre setting and these tropes but going nowhere with them in the end, regardless of how much I love the cast of characters, I'm gonna tend to side eye a show.


Pros: Tackling the realness of the characters and their world.

This is always and immensely entertaining and engaging show. And a huge part of it is that the characters come off as being very viscerally real. Joyce's frantic put upon fragility as well as her absolute dedication to her children. Hopper's obviously deeply scared emotions and anger as well as his deeply held morals and dedication to those around him. Mike's youthful ignorance but deep faith in his friends and love for Eleven. This season saw us look under the hood quite a bit. And I think it's always satsifying when it does so because these characters flaws are as on display as their heroic "good guys" side. I have often noticed, not just here, but using this as an example, that fans often have issues when protagonist characters in genre work are as layered as something that might be considered a more grounded and legitimate drama. Mike seems to get a lot of criticism when he gets whiney or obsesses about Eleven. Well... He's a ****ing kid. Kids are ignorant as to how they come off. Kids are whiney. Kids are self centered. It totally tracks that Mike doesn't have all the tools in his emotional toolbox to not know when he's going over the line with his feelings. I have seen online as well some shade thrown at Hoppers way for his *****ey behavior. And there's no denying... He was ofent an *******. Well... This is not some white knight perfect hero. He's a damned fine example of manhood but he's got some deep scars and flaws. He's not a product of the modern day world where men are encouraged to be more in touch with themselves and their emotions and less prone to simply dominating a situation into what they expect from others in terms of relationships, either parental or romantic. And... That's fine by me. I loved when we got to see him get eaten up by being stood up by Joyce. I loved that, no, he couldn't hold himself back from practically threatening Mike when he flet disrespected by him and Eleven. No, he's not absolutely ideal at all times. And that's what makes him great as a character. So too with Eleven. I think it's personally quite valid if you looked at how she approached the tribulations of her relationship with Mike this season and state that she was being a catty little brat following Max's lead... And guess what? Teenage girls are often catty brats. She's also still learning to be who she is in society. She takes it too the max (no pun) because she's still learning the ropes of humanity in a way. The show is still doing a great job of making our heroes flawed and real enough but still ultimately characters we root for and want to be around.


Cons: I know it's a sci fi horror show but I'm having to turn up my suspension of disbelif to 11.

It's funny but in the lead up to this season I was really hoping for a Cold War era tie in. I honestly thought they should give the Upside Down a rest and bring in genre aspects from the time that played into the rivalry between the U.S. and the Soviet Union. I thought perhaps more on the experiments that produced Eleven and the other numbers would be expanded upon or perhaps we'd get a confrontation between Soviet "meta" agents and our heroes in Hawkins. Well... I was only partially right. They brought in the USSR alright... But man, even in a series like this, I don't know... It was a pretty over the top. I mean... I get it. As stated I wanted to see a Cold War component introduced but seriously? A Russian secret base built inside the mall with what looks to be at least a staff of, what... close to a hundred? And... They are wearing their uniforms like they are stationed at a base back on their home soil? This was something that was less Stephen King/X-Files in the shadows paranormal into Roger Moore Bond/Austin Powers parody territory almost. Yeah... I know. Some of you are rolling your eyes. I can accept the Upside Down and the telekinetic mutant but I can't accept this? Maybe that's valid. But it goes back again to that over the top, too on the nose aspects of the show that cropped up this year. We are now crossing the line from momentary homages to just outright going full on "I LOVE THE 80'S!" and to hell with any logical considerations or restraint. How was this pulled off? It's one thing to say that the U.S. Government set up a secret facility in Hawkins. I mean, sure, one could look at say, season one and think since it's 1983, the Alien homage aspects are played up, and they were, and then we get to season two and it's obvious they are going for making it the Aliens to season one's Alien. That didn't bother me for some reason. Sure they did a great riff on the Colonial Marine masscre from Cameron's timeless sequel. But in season two we literally get a Soviet Arnold ripoff with not a single hint that this is anything other than going for the easy nostalgia points. And it's not just in like a one off moment. This is something from the first episode to the last. And this is all done in a contrived way just to have these things in the show, when they could have had them in there in ways that were a lot more low key and less likely to pop the fragile bubble that is suspension of disbelief. You want a badass Soviet agent or agents in Hawkins? Fine. But... seriously? A secret base under the mall? A total ripoff of Arnold? And I mean TOTAL. This facility was built and the mall up and running in the time between the end of the last season and where we pick up here? The Soviets where able to accomplish this how exactly? Cuz if they could do that, again for reasons we never really understand, then I am not sure how the U.S. wasn't obliterated during the Cold War.



Finally...

Pros: Anything can happen and anyone can die (***sobbing*** Hopper's death. ***continues sobbing***)
Cons: (***still sobbing*** Hoppers death. ***sobbing some more***)

Whatever else I might have criticisms about that this event made me so mad and sad shows that the show sitll has magic and still can play me like a fiddle. But I'm not gonna lie... This ****ing stung. David Harbour does a phenomenal job as Hawkins resident surly but determined peace officer. And you just felt for this guy and his struggles throughout and those around him and part of this life like Joyce and Eleven you don't want to see go through anymore trauma... But the Duffers want you to suffer. And boy... Mission accomplised bros. I don't know quite what to feel right now since I think a great reasoning is that wonderfully poetic letter we saw Jim write to Eleven at the end of the final episode of the season, not knowing it would be an emotional legacy for his adopted daughter. Change is what was inevitable in a show centered around kids growing up. And an event like this makes one uncomfortable but also shows that the creators are not just going through the motions, whatever one might think of the criticisms of the season I laid out above. This was a gut punch and sends you into a tailspin as a fan. Which in hindsight is why I get why the Joyce/Hopper material was given so much time to percolate on screen. They needed to draw you into this two seasons in the making relationship that much more to wallop you with this. And this event maybe more than anything is what's going ot have the ripple effects on season four I think. There's no doubt in my mind that Joyce was going to stay had Hopper lived but now, this is just one death too many for her. And this then breaks the kids up. It breaks up Nancy and Jonathon. It forces Eleven into yet another home life and leaves a status quo where currently there is no chance for the kids to ever go back to the simpler times of season one and probably forbodes complications to all kinds of relationships. I mean, Mike is severed from Eleven and Will from his buddies. Do they seek solace in each other? Will Jonathon move on from Nancy, or perhaps she from him? Does this disolution continue on? Will Mike, Lucas and Dustin find themselves moving apart now too? How does Eleven respond to having a full time maternal authority figure since all she's known was fathers? As much as it hurt to see Jim "die", it's quite frankly the biggest hinge point of the show, so even if, as suggested by that mid-credit sequence, it might not be permanent (Or maybe it is and that obvious allusion to an imprisoned American at the Russion base is a ruse to give us hope only to hit us even harder with later on at the permanence of Hoppers loss) it's already changed everything we've become comfortable with on the show. And as badly as it stings as a fan to think of the show without David Harbour... Damn if I don't respect the Duffers and Levy for going that route. Now, outside of the obvious continuation of the Upside Down as source of all antagonism on the show, I'm not sure where they go with the story in season four, and that's exciting. What ever else I might have said about the show I still really enjoyed the ride and still love these characters and cannot wait to spend time with them all again and see what the show's creators come up with next. For any flaws I may have talked about this is still one of the absolute best shows out there now and has never failed to entertain or give me enjoyment.
 
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So as I stated before, finished the season on July 4. Really enjoyed it. A couple days later I pretty much feel the same. Some thoughts
Pros:
-Pretty much everything not really that many serious gripes that detracted from the season
-I liked that Jonathan was more like his season 1 self. Nancy may be the "muscle," but he wasn't a wimp. Season 2 came around and when the demodogs were going to attack he didn't even grab a weapon. This season, I liked that he got back into being ready for a fight.
-The new characters were all really good. And the characters who aren't new like Bauman or Erica who got more to do were great as well.
-The season felt way more brutal with some of the fights and I liked it. Especially the hospital fight

Cons:
-Not really a con, but Mike needed to get popped in the face this season. Dude gets a girlfriend and he thinks he's Johnny Big Balls all the sudden :ninja:
-Felt a bit bloated at times. Like they had too many things to do. And as others pointed out it took a bit too long to get started. I'm sure if I go back, I could find things that could've been cut. But the whole Billy/Mrs. Wheeler thing (which is still creepy) even though not that long, could've been taken out or repurposed.
-They didn't play around with character pairings that much. I think most everyone agrees that the random pairing of Dustin and Steve paid off big time last season. With that success I was hoping they'd take more risk and throw more characters together. Mike and Hopper I hoped would get more to do together. Since Will wasn't missing or possessed for all/most of a season like the previous ones, I was hoping and getting more of him and Jonathan actually being brothers rather than just in flashbacks. Steve and Hopper I thought could've been interesting. I was hoping Steve would become a cop or something
-I feel like Lucas kinda got sidelined as just the comedy relief this season. I did like his relationship with Max. The whole "couple who always fights" thing.

But yeah I really liked this season. Probably gonna wait another 1.5-2 years for another one. I hope next season is the last. 4 great (or 3 if season 4 isn't good) seasons is a great run for a show and they've told a great story. No need to run it into the ground and 5 seasons is usually when shows start to slip.
After some of the things that transpired, I do hope there is a timeskip. Not a huge one, but maybe like 2-3 years. Let some characters change some more

Now for the more spoilery stuff
-Billy should've gotten more screentime with Max or something. Would've made his death more sad I think. Goes back to the bloating point, that was something that could've been expanded upon more. I don't think we ever see them interact until Billy is possessed. We didn't even see their parents again other than Billy's dad in that flashback
-Wish we saw more of the group's reaction to Hopper's death.
-Jonathan needs more to do. I'm glad he went back to more of his season 1 self, but he basically is there only to be Nancy's sidekick. He rarely gets scenes by himself anymore. Pairing him with Steve, Dustin, and them would've been an interesting idea this season I think. Get him out of his element and away from the "Monster Flick" portion of the series. Also will give a chance for more unique character interactions.
-I am glad Will kinda got a break. I mean he did have a big emotional moment at Castle Byers. Question: was that "Not my fault you don't like girls" moment supposed to be the outing of Will or just saying that Will isn't interested in girls yet. I would've thought the latter, but that beat before anymore dialogue made me think it was the former. I know in season 1, they say that people think Will is gay and apparently in the show bible and in a script for the Snow Ball scene there are more hints of it
-Speaking of gay, damn Steve can't catch a break with the ladies.
-The Russian "Terminator" was really good. It's so weird that non Terminator movies are doing Terminator better than the current actual Terminator series
-Alexei was great
-I did like Erica, but they went a little overboard with her sometimes
-So Hopper's "death": in the stinger when they said "No not the American," my dumbass didn't even think Hopper. I thought it was Dr. Brenner. Idk why. If Hopper is really alive...I don't know. I always suspected that the series will end with Hopper's death, but to fake his death just seems really cheap.
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I thought so too about the pairings. After they all met in the mall near the end, I thought "well now they have a nice chance to pair them all in different ways". But no, they kept them all the same! I mean WTF. It made sense on a story level I guess, but just to shake things up a bit, I don't know.
 
-Not really a con, but Mike needed to get popped in the face this season. Dude gets a girlfriend and he thinks he's Johnny Big Balls all the sudden :ninja:
I actually thought he was much worse last season. Mike was a **** to pretty much everyone in season 2.
 
I’m on episode 6 and loving this season. This show is just a master craft in character building, tension building, atmosphere, horror, adventure, sci-fi, humor, romance....The Duffer Brothers just juggle all these different tones and themes so well and seamlessly. I’m in love with these characters and find myself scared for them when they're in danger and I’m emotionally invested in their interpersonal relationships.

I would love for the Duffer Brothers to get their hands on a certain Wall Crawler because they have a much better hold and understanding on adolescence than those recent movies have demonstrated.
 
8 hrs is a breeze. The previous seasons had 10 episodes, so not sure why netflix cut this season to 8.

Anyway its the best season yet. BTW, I liked Steve and Robin's chemistry though it did not end as expected.
 
Just finished. Absolutely fantastic. Near perfect. Ive loved all three seasons but this may be the best one. I cannot think of another show—or movie series for that matter— where i am this attached to the characters and their arcs, journeys and relationships. Bravo, Duffer Brothers. You guys rock. Wtf do I watch now?
 
8 hrs is a breeze. The previous seasons had 10 episodes, so not sure why netflix cut this season to 8.
They did not. Season 1 also had 8 episodes while Season 2 had 9 (which probably also would have been 8 if not for the episode where Eleven went to Chicago). Eight episodes is a good number, especially since this is a show that's designed to be binged and each season feels like a movie.
 
They could still technically do a time jump without delaying filming because I believe that the actors are all older than their characters are supposed to be with the exception of Will. Besides, we already had a nearly two year wait between seasons 2 and 3. I hope we don't have to wait as long for season 4. I'm guessing it'll be out October 2020 at the earliest.

None of them could pass for 18 year olds. Even when Millie is dressed up fancy shes still got that coltish young teen look. The boys definitely cant pass for high school seniors or college freshmen.
 
None of them could pass for 18 year olds. Even when Millie is dressed up fancy shes still got that coltish young teen look. The boys definitely cant pass for high school seniors or college freshmen.
Outside of Noah and Millie, they will all be 17 or older by the time filming for season 4 comes around. Galen, Finn, and Sadie were all born in 2002. Caleb was born in 2001. So I do think it is funny that they couldn't pass for high school seniors. They literally will be. :hehe:

Also the kids all look older then they did during the season. Which makes sense, they ended filming last November. 8 months ago.



I am hoping, with the talk of Thanksgiving and Christmas, we see the next season by December 2020. But considering how long this past season took, probably will be waiting until 2021.
 
I liked the season, but I absolutely despised the ending. Moving seems like it's all about Joyce. I highly doubt Will wants to leave his best friends and Jonathan wants to leave Nancy. And poor El. She's with a family that she barely knows and away from Mike and Max. I hated this ending so much.

That said, now that I know there's a season 4, there might be redemption for this ending, but I still hated it.
 
I liked the season, but I absolutely despised the ending. Moving seems like it's all about Joyce. I highly doubt Will wants to leave his best friends and Jonathan wants to leave Nancy. And poor El. She's with a family that she barely knows and away from Mike and Max. I hated this ending so much.

That said, now that I know there's a season 4, there might be redemption for this ending, but I still hated it.

Its aggravating that
Joyce split the gang up, indeed. But I think Joyce did it because it was the responsible thing to do. That town is dangerous as ****, and secret experiments, and Upside down stuff has killed two men Joyce cared about and nearly killed her kids countless times. Its extremely toxic for El. Russians have shown up, and disappeared to god only knows where. And if that isnt enough Joyce now knows that that point on earth is predisposed to being a doorway to a hell dimension occupied by eldritch horrors. Everything that's happened could happen again. Teenage love and childhood friendships arent Joyce's priority once all that is factored in. Besides, the kids can stay in touch by phone, and visit each other. Plus my head canon is Joyce isnt the only parent in that town that will choose to relocate their family. That town is likely to experience a mass exodus between season 3 and 4.
 
Welp I just finished season 3, aside from the ending I was quite satisfied. Seriously though that ending sucks. But the 80's nostalgia, production values, and villain were all top notch. Can't wait for season 4 in 2021!

-_-
 
Its aggravating that
Joyce split the gang up, indeed. But I think Joyce did it because it was the responsible thing to do. That town is dangerous as ****, and secret experiments, and Upside down stuff has killed two men Joyce cared about and nearly killed her kids countless times. Its extremely toxic for El. Russians have shown up, and disappeared to god only knows where. And if that isnt enough Joyce now knows that that point on earth is predisposed to being a doorway to a hell dimension occupied by eldritch horrors. Everything that's happened could happen again. Teenage love and childhood friendships arent Joyce's priority once all that is factored in. Besides, the kids can stay in touch by phone, and visit each other. Plus my head canon is Joyce isnt the only parent in that town that will choose to relocate their family. That town is likely to experience a mass exodus between season 3 and 4.


I totally agree here Marv. Joyce is traumatized by Hawkins by now and who can blame her, really? And the theme of the seasom was about "change"and it's inevitabilitiy. Yes, Joyce's choice due to Hopper's death (***Sobs uncontrollably on the inside***) has this giant ripple effect and it absolutely has a selfish aspect to it... Joyce Byers is a human being... Damn her to HELL!!! Joking aside, Joyce has a lot on her plate and other obligations also to consider. Jonathon even has the consideration that he feels responsible to his family, and right now that trumps his obvious feelings for Nancy. ( Jon could stand to get back some of that rebel/intellectual vibe from season one, so maybe being away and not just being the Hardy Boy to Nancy's uh... Nancy Drew.... God those newspaper guys were *******s... will be good for him?

I for one am devastated by Hopper's death, especially since after the curse of "B" death happened I was assuming the worst had past but then... They did it... They BLEW IT ALL UP! Damn you all... DAMN YOU TO HELL!!!!

...

...

...


But, uh... Yeah, I admire the guts to go all in on change and not just keep the characters and show in a caccoon of childhood familiarity. If anything I have to say.... Hopper's speech at the end is kind of a counterbalance to the undending stream of nostalgia that this season was. I've gotten quite suspicious of nostalgia over the years. Now... I love long established IPs as much as anyone and when I think of how cyclical culture has been I honestly know that even our current era of re-boots and re-imaginings, despite all the fanboy/girl complaints online, is actually nothing new. And yet... I think there is a new wrinkle in the way the soceity, tech and loss of stigma of the unironic embracing of all this stuff we all love doesn't have a negative, even infantilizing impact on us individually and as a group in some way socially so I say kudos to the Duffers for trafficking in the nostalgia big time but also I think calling our attention to the downside. I have said it once and I will continue to say it until the end of time, but "mythologies" can only deliver on the value and importance we place on them, the time and energy we invest in watching and analyzing these various stories that grab our souls, so long as they do more than just comfort us, but also help us to confront the challenges and pressures of life. If all they do is flatter us, spin tales to assuage our weariness but don't ask more of us in terms of considering the tougher questions of life, or look into the "darkness" of our souls so as to be more forgiving of others around us and not just to say to yourself "You are okay skipper! No need to look at your flaws! It's all the other people that are always wrong!" When they do that, and assure us that righteousness is easy, not transformative, not complicated, that wisdom will often if not always be something hard won and never a gift or a given...When the tales we tell ourselves stop only to comfort and never confront, never push us out of our cocccoons, well... They stop being what mythologies are.
 
I liked the season, but I absolutely despised the ending. Moving seems like it's all about Joyce. I highly doubt Will wants to leave his best friends and Jonathan wants to leave Nancy. And poor El. She's with a family that she barely knows and away from Mike and Max. I hated this ending so much.

That said, now that I know there's a season 4, there might be redemption for this ending, but I still hated it.

Well look at it as Joyce's point of view

She almost lost her son in Season 1. She lost Bob in Season 2 and she lost Hopper (Supposley in Season 3). 3 Times this has happend in this town so who wouldn't want to get the hell out of there. I have always said in shows why do people stay in a town or city when this stuff just keeps happening all the time just get the hell out of there. Maybe now the move will be good for everybody and maybe we could actually see some stuff happen outside of Hawkins for a change.
 
I still don't like the ending. I get all of your arguments regarding
Joyce's decision to leave and maybe it's because I disliked her character this season, but I still think it's a poor choice. In reality, everyone in that town would leave, but this is a TV show and she's isolating her kids and El even more. Besides, do we really think the Mind Flayer wouldn't have tracked El down to wherever she was living?
 
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I too thought the ending was bum drops but I understood her reasoning [Joyce]
why can't El stay with Max I mean they have a spare room now [too soon]
and Jonathan seem old enough to be on his own him and Nancy could move in together

and I know I'm suppose to not take things so seriously about a show about open dimensions and kids with god like powers but still those must be the dumbest military in existence to let Dustin and a little girl infiltrate a top secret military base I couldn't buy none of that How does our military not intercept those messages after the events of the first 2 seasons

I was rooting for Steve that whole time but couldn't take those scenes seriously
 
Its aggravating that
Joyce split the gang up, indeed. But I think Joyce did it because it was the responsible thing to do. That town is dangerous as ****, and secret experiments, and Upside down stuff has killed two men Joyce cared about and nearly killed her kids countless times. Its extremely toxic for El. Russians have shown up, and disappeared to god only knows where. And if that isnt enough Joyce now knows that that point on earth is predisposed to being a doorway to a hell dimension occupied by eldritch horrors. Everything that's happened could happen again. Teenage love and childhood friendships arent Joyce's priority once all that is factored in. Besides, the kids can stay in touch by phone, and visit each other. Plus my head canon is Joyce isnt the only parent in that town that will choose to relocate their family. That town is likely to experience a mass exodus between season 3 and 4.

I hope Season 4 addresses that because yeah, Hawkins is pretty much a cursed town at this point. And I don't know how they can continue to cover up everything that's going on there, considering it was just attacked by a 30-foot monster and a sizable portion of its populace vanished. But I guess that's what the lab people coming back were meant to do. All that to say I could easily see S4 opening with Hawkins in dire straits.
 
Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
The incident at Hawkings Lab in S01 ( 1983 ) was caused by the Russian experiment in S03 ( 1983 ) and Eleven was brought in by "doctor creepy white hair" to help solve the problem because he is an "expert" in weird stuff. Correct ?
 

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