Supergirl Supergirl General Discussion Thread - - - Part 12

[BH/HHH]

I would've at least liked a flashback of Jon Cryer facing off against Tyler Hoechlin. Maybe we could get a whole flashback episode one day though.

Yeah that would work, maybe an episode where she’s been told what happened with Lex & Superman and it somehow ties into the modern day story. Maybe something as a parallel to her and Lena.

 

[Thome216]

I don't see it as pilfering. Supergirl has faced off against Lex without her cousin in the comics before. It would it have been nice, but I'm excited to see how they go up against each other.

 

[flickchick85]

Then why use Lex at all?

To show KARA face him, which she’s never done before in the show. Superman’s villains have always been Supergirl’s villains too, it’s the nature of the characters and their shared universe. It’s not “pilfering.” It’s sharing. They very well established Superman and Lex’s famous rivalry on this show. It lasted almost 15 years and Superman was victorious. This show is forever Kara’s story, and now she gets to face him for the first time with her cousin off-world.

 

[herolee10]

Moral of the story here folks; as long as its your show then you can do whatever you want.

So if it took Superman 15 years to beat Lex then I predict that it will take Supergirl about 5 episodes, maybe sooner. I mean, she is stronger than Superman and defeated Reactron which he was never able to do.

 

[flickchick85]

Uh, they already stated in the show that Superman defeated Lex CONSTANTLY. Just because Lex didn’t end up with a life sentence in prison until much later doesn’t take away that fact. So Supergirl defeating his latest ploy won’t take anything away from Supes either, especially since he’s already considered a fugitive now and will certainly end up back in prison no matter what (thanks to Supes getting him that life sentence in the first place).

And yes, on Kara’s show, Kara’s the star and they can do with her and Superman’s shared world and characters whatever the hell they damn well please to tell Kara-centric stories. That’s how it works. Insecure Superman fans can stay mad about it, or better yet, keep on “not watching.” Supes has had plenty of adventures and shows featuring these characters that they can watch. We who actually watch for Kara Zor-El will continue to enjoy seeing how she navigates this world and these characters.

 

[WhoMani]

I don't know why some fans are acting like Supergirl defeating Lex is the worst thing ever lol. I'm not biggest fan of Supergirl but show has established that Lex is one of Superman worst enemies and Supergirl beating Lex doesn't mean that Superman is inferior to Supergirl. I'm sure one of reason why it took Superman so long to put Lex behind bars is that they were friends at first (which Clark actually stated), so Clark probably gave Lex the benefit of the doubt many times until he realised that he was unredeemable and that Lex also had a lot of clout.

 

[herolee10]

Uh, they already stated in the show that Superman defeated Lex CONSTANTLY. Just because Lex didn’t end up with a life sentence in prison until much later doesn’t take away that fact. So Supergirl defeating his latest ploy won’t take anything away from Supes either, especially since he’s already considered a fugitive now and will certainly end up back in prison no matter what (thanks to Supes getting him that life sentence in the first place).

And yes, on Kara’s show, Kara’s the star and they can do with her and Superman’s shared world and characters whatever the hell they damn well please to tell Kara-centric stories. That’s how it works. Insecure Superman fans can stay mad about it, or better yet, keep on “not watching.” Supes has had plenty of adventures and shows featuring these characters that they can watch. We who actually watch for Kara Zor-El will continue to enjoy seeing how she navigates this world and these characters.

- Hmm, I must have missed the part where it was established that Superman haf taken down Lex more than once in this continuity. Thanks for thr update on that

- Yeah, I have honestly accepted the fact that this is her show so anything goes now. And while I understand that since they come from the same background and tread over familiar territory that they are most likely to share rogues as well.

However, there is a bug difference between sharing villains and stealing them. This show has converted the likes of Parasite, The Elite, Toyman, and Hank Henshaw all into Supergirl's villains only. I cannot recall any past show that featured both Clark and Kara where the former took the latter's established villains and made them into his own. But like othets have said, her show so her rules.

- And while I have several issues with this show, the one thing that I can acknowledge is that Melissa is perfect for the role. I honestly wish the film division could have gotten her for the role for the film adaptation. She makes the character very likable and appealing to all demographics.

 

[flickchick85]

Lol, you don't remember any shows where Clark "stole" Kara's villains because SHE'S the legacy character. She was a part of his world from the moment she was created. Her villains are his. And yes, on a show centered around her, if she gets to encounter a few of the smaller-time ones first herself, that's well within their rights and not remotely "disrespectful" of the writers to do. They established the most iconic ones to be his first (and for the record on the ones you mentioned, Henshaw even on this show was Superman's villain first, just not in his Cyborg form, and Toyman was also put in prison first by Supes), and established him as the great hero of Earth with statues and parks named for him, whose universally beloved by the public, with many famous victories under his belt, whose shadow Supergirl had to get out of. Superman's had multiple versions and encounters with those smaller time ones on his own shows/media, so it's hardly an injury to him for her to get a few them first on her show.

 

[herolee10]

Lol, you don't remember any shows where Clark "stole" Kara's villains because SHE'S the legacy character. She was a part of his world from the moment she was created. Her villains are his. And yes, on a show centered around her, if she gets to encounter a few of the smaller-time ones first herself, that's well within their rights and not remotely "disrespectful" of the writers to do. They established the most iconic ones to be his first (and for the record on the ones you mentioned, Henshaw even on this show was Superman's villain first, just not in his Cyborg form, and Toyman was also put in prison first by Supes), and established him as the great hero of Earth with statues and parks named for him, whose universally beloved by the public, with many famous victories under his belt, whose shadow Supergirl had to get out of. Superman's had multiple versions and encounters with those smaller time ones on his own shows/media, so it's hardly an injury to him for her to get a few them first on her show.

Just out of curiosity, how would you feel then if superman were to be killed in the crisis event and for Brainiac to be introduced as the new big bad for Supergirl without her cousin involved? Would you still consider that to be well within the rights of the show or for it to be in poor taste?

 

[flickchick85]

Just out of curiosity, how would you feel then if superman were to be killed in the crisis event and for Brainiac to be introduced as the new big bad for Supergirl without her cousin involved? Would you still consider that to be well within the rights of the show or for it to be in poor taste?

I mean, anything's well within their rights because the characters of Super-world are at their disposal, so that's not even a question to me. But would I like it? No, because I don't want to see Superman killed. I'm sick of seeing that. But for the villain part, you chose a unique case because I've always been of the unpopular opinion that Brainiac is better-suited as a Supergirl villain than a Superman one. He's more personal for her, like her own personal boogeyman. He's the one major Superman villain that I'd happily see transferred to her. But if it were any of his other big ones, like, say Zod, or even Mongul...I wouldn't like it. Thankfully, the show already established his history with those two, so that's not a risk. Now if they want to have Kara face either of those guys while Supes is off-world, I'd be happy to see that. As I said, the history with Supes established, so she wouldn't be getting any of the biggies "first."

 

[BH/HHH]

I just can’t agree on this for me the Supergirl writers constantly show a lack of originality. Pilfering from Superman’s stories and the terrible way in which they execute a lot of stuff is ultimately what’s turned me off the show. I’ll be back for odd episodes here and there like these Lex ones but that’s because I wanna see the Lex performance. They’ll do a character like him justice for a little while but I reckon they’ll **** that up like they do everything else. The writers on this show are the worst of the CW shows imo.

 

[flickchick85]

Strongly disagree, but what else is new.

 

[Micromind]

- And while I have several issues with this show, the one thing that I can acknowledge is that Melissa is perfect for the role. I honestly wish the film division could have gotten her for the role for the film adaptation. She makes the character very likable and appealing to all demographics.

Agreed.

 

[Kelly]

I don't really care who they pilfer from as long as the storylines are Kara centered.

Manchester has been Jonn centered with Kara watching on the side.

Liberty has been all over the place. At the beginning of the season there was some hope, more than I thought actually because Melissa was coming in late, but hell the episode that Melissa only did the facial shots for has been one of the strongest eps this season. And then they kill off the stronger of the villains this season. We have not had a good " hand to hand" battle that Kara is engaged in since that episode. When I spoke with one of her stunt doubles on Instagram she didnt argue she just said there is more of that to come as in we will see dome hand to hand in future eps....she said that is ramping up.... BUT when there are really no major threats except for Manchester what do they do? Give all his fights to Jonn, Mia got Menagerie and Brainy got Hats.....loved the scene of her joining Brainy in the march, but when the fight begins she disappears and shows up after the fighting is done.

It is just weird, its like they no longer want Melissa doing any kind of stunts except to stare, blow or fly everyonce in awhile.

So, long story short that needs to change quickly.....because I dont tune in to watch Supergirl run into to the battles, AFTER they are fought, or when she does she is taken out in 3 seconds only for a 14 year old boy to take out the threat. SMH....

 

[Kelly]

All of this discussion would be very interesting to me IF I ACTUALLY THOUGHT that Kara is the center of this series. That is up for debate as far as Im concerned. At times it seems she is, but that has been hard to determine this season.

 

[batdude]

Well, you could argue that Manchester ended up being Jonn's nemesis. I wish we had some tougher battles for Kara though. bring in Zod, borrow Grodd, or maybe get somebody to play Green Lantern villain Sinestro.

 

[batdude]

I just can’t agree on this for me the Supergirl writers constantly show a lack of originality. Pilfering from Superman’s stories and the terrible way in which they execute a lot of stuff is ultimately what’s turned me off the show. I’ll be back for odd episodes here and there like these Lex ones but that’s because I wanna see the Lex performance. They’ll do a character like him justice for a little while but I reckon they’ll **** that up like they do everything else. The writers on this show are the worst of the CW shows imo.

Really these guys are better than the Arrow writers. It could be argued that Supergirl deserved a shot at Lex, and that they would have turned Lena bad if he hadn't showed up.

 

[BH/HHH]

Really these guys are better than the Arrow writers. It could be argued that Supergirl deserved a shot at Lex, and that they would have turned Lena bad if he hadn't showed up.

I massively disagree, I’m not saying the writers on the other show are great. But Supergirl’s attempts at paralleling political issues, relationship dramas, dealing with potential overshadowing and balancing the Supergirl/Superman problem among other things just mostly always falls flat. The writers simply aren’t good enough to deal with all these types of issues.

 

[Kelly]

I have to disagree, I am glad they are taking on these political hot topics, and as unhappy as Ive been with this system its not because of the political aspect of the show at all. This season as opposed to last season with the immigration episode and the ridiculous gun episode this season has been far more well versed with the tough issues. As far as balancing Superman and Supergirl, I just dont see the need for them to even worry with that. Bottomline its her time....

 

[Kelly]

I dont see the need for a scene showing Clark and Lex, we got enough background on them in Season 2 when it was very well established that Supermanput Lex in prison.....also Lillian gave good background as well.

 

[BH/HHH]

I have to disagree, I am glad they are taking on these political hot topics, and as unhappy as Ive been with this system its not because of the political aspect of the show at all. This season as opposed to last season with the immigration episode and the ridiculous gun episode this season has been far more well versed with the tough issues. As far as balancing Superman and Supergirl, I just dont see the need for them to even worry with that. Bottomline its her time....

Bottom line it’s her time is just making a poor excuse for the poor writing with the Superman problem this show has had. End of the day the writers for everytime they’ve done good with Superman they’ve then gone and done poorly with him when it was totallt unnecessary. End of the day pilfering his stories and treating him as second rate so often just shows how poor the writers are.

The fact for me is with the political aspect when they’ve dealt with that they’ve done it poorly too. Again the writers fault who I feel are out of their depth.

I dont see the need for a scene showing Clark and Lex, we got enough background on them in Season 2 when it was very well established that Supermanput Lex in prison.....also Lillian gave good background as well.

I disagree they’ve teased it to this point that I think it’s a missed opportunity to not have any scenes with the two.

 

[Kelly]

I didnt say the writing was good or bad as far as Superman is concerned....there is no reason to worry about it as far as Im concerned. Its not about good or bad writing in how I look at it, nor is my opinion on how they treat Superman about anything other than, doesnt matter as far as Im concerned. He has had ample opportunitues for his story, told exactly the way his fans want it told in the big and small screen. As far as Im concerned, on her show as long as she is the central, most powerful force dramatically, physically and otherwise on her series, Im good. Which is why Im not happy with this season...she is none of those things, so honestly until those problems are fixed, people's problems with how Superman is depicted is the least of my concerns. I get it if fans of his are not happy, but honestly that is a problem for his movies, not the Supergirl series.

And again if Superman fans are not happy, and Ive heard from many Superman fans over the past seasons where some are very unhappy to those that see this depiction of him as how they have always seen him, so with anything based on opinions it runs the spectrum, Im cool with all of them. That is just not a major problem for me, I dont watch Supergirl for a chance to see Superman or any of his villains. I watch it to see Supergirl.....and their has been a VERY noticeable lack of her this season.

What if in the next solo Superman movie, all we got was Superman using his heat vision, and freeze breath, and all the actual fights were with Wonder Woman and Batman and the villains, and Superman flies in at the end to pat everyone on the back and tell them how awesome they are? His fans would be burning Warner Brothers down....well that is how I see this season of Supergirl, so peoples problems with how Siperman is written on this series just doesnt hold much of my attention....his fans need to worry about his movieverse....or lack of it.

 

[flickchick85]

I think they’ve done a great job with the political stuff this season, and I say that as someone who was VERY critical of the way they’ve handled that stuff in the past and was incredibly wary of their intentions to go more “real world issues” this season. The new writers are probably the reason for the improvement on that front. Compared to the godawful gun control ep last season, or Arrow’s equally awful attempt to handle such things, this season feels downright sophisticated in terms of that writing.

And as a hardcore Superman fan I love Superman on this show more than any other live-action version, so I’ve got no complaints there.

But Kelly’s complaint about the lack of Supergirl action, yeah I can see that. It just doesn’t bother me because I watch just as much for Kara as I do for Supergirl, and I think Kara’s had fantastic stuff to work with this season, from mentoring Nia, to redefining her relationship with Alex, to standing up for her convictions and going off on her own against the President/DEO, I’m just finding her journey and struggles this season really compelling, and certainly more so than the romantic drama/angst they gave her in all 3 of the previous seasons.

 

[Dark Raven]

Just out of curiosity, how would you feel then if superman were to be killed in the crisis event and for Brainiac to be introduced as the new big bad for Supergirl without her cousin involved? Would you still consider that to be well within the rights of the show or for it to be in poor taste?

They won't kill Superman, because they'll be killing off Oliver, and they're not going to have someone else take away from his big moment.

 

[Kelly]

I would love to see far more of the mentoring of Nia as well, but then what do they do....they give that to Brainy as well. *shrugs shoulders* I was excited for a second. Hell Brainy is even closer to Lena this season than Kara.

As far as the romantic stuff? Noooo do not miss that at all, Season 3 was great, then they ruined it bringing that stuff back into it.

And FC I can agree with quite a bit of your reasoning for enjoying this season. Its just not quite enough for me....so I dont want to rain on anyones parade, already got accused of that last week....lol, Im glad u are enjoying this season.