The Dark Knight Rises The 80th TDKR General Discussion & Speculation Thread - - - - - Part 85

[The_Raganork]

Exactly. Just because criminals are scared of him, doesn't mean he's out nabbing up every-single-one of them. I mean, that is the point of Batman, to scare off criminals, and inspire good. Not to personally deal with every criminal in Gotham.

Sure but it doesn't mean he didn't fight petty crime either.

Saying that he didn't fight petty crime doesn't really have any proof from the films.

At least with the scene I mentioned it can be seen that he does fight petty crime.

No where in this story does it imply he doesn't fight average crime and just goes after Jokers and Banes.

When he came back to Gotham he was facing big crimes but still petty in his mind in comparison to Ra's ultimate plot.

 

[The_Raganork]

Reese had a pretty good idea that Batman was connected to WE, so its not out the question why the main owner of WE wouldn't want to be connected to the most wanted vigilante in Gotham.

What?

Reese didn't suspect Bruce he found plans to the Tumbler in R n' D, that outed him. There's no reason to think he suspected Bruce.

And there's no indication in any of the rest of the films that suggest people think Bruce is Batman more than Joe Shmo

 

[The Joker]

I don't think we ever saw Bale's Batman combat any petty crime. Keaton's Batman was shown taking down common back alley muggers. But Bale's Batman is only ever shown going after big fish.

 

[The_Raganork]

I don't think we ever saw Bale's Batman combat any petty crime. Keaton's Batman was shown taking down common back alley muggers. But Bale's Batman is only ever shown going after big fish.

Agreed.

But that doesn't mean he didn't.

Also read the Gotham times and remember the story of ARG between BB and TDK were written by J. Nolan.

 

[Travesty]

What?

Reese didn't suspect Bruce he found plans to the Tumbler in R n' D, that outed him. There's no reason to think he suspected Bruce.

And there's no indication in any of the rest of the films that suggest people think Bruce is Batman more than Joe Shmo

I never once said Reese knows Bruce is Batman. I said Reese knew that Batman was connected to WE, and since Bruce Wayne owns WE, it would be a good idea to get the stench of Batman off his back, especially when Batman is the most wanted man in Gotham.

 

[Carnotaur3]

Except Gordon couldn't even deduce Wertz and Ramirez as criminals..
Just because he has power that doesn't mean Gordon is suddenly going to be without failing. There's still a lot of work to be done. The Harvey Dent act is probably to combat corruption.

"I was trying to fight the mob!"

He and Batman's actions sidelined the corruption of the Cops and Joker's rise to power. Gordon's not making the same mistake twice.

Dent's inspiration kept the people from raging but didn't fight crime. Crime still existed but people kept hope that things could get better. That support allows people like Gordon to keep fighting.

That quote doesn't support what you're saying anymore than it accept mine.

TDK plus 6 years = We were in this together.

2 years before TDKR = Then you were gone.

Bane's actions in the present = Now this evil rises. The Batman has to come back.

Bruce being out of the game for two years thinking about how his life passed him by and not having Rachel now, not having Batman = what if he doesn't exist anymore.

See?

I can use the quote just as effectively as you can

Except you're making more of an assumption than I am. 2 Years? Where's that in the dialogue?

We've got Nolan's quotes to back up what I'm saying. 8 Years. Enough time to make an impact. Bruce Wayne is frozen in time. He's hanging out in the mansion without anything to do. That's it. We've got nothing to suggest he's been active in those 8 years.

 

[The_Raganork]

I never once said Reese knows Bruce is Batman. I said Reese knew that Batman was connected to WE, and since Bruce Wayne owns WE, it would be a good idea to get the stench of Batman off his back, especially when Batman is the most wanted man in Gotham.

The only reason he knew Batman was connected to WE is because he found the tumbler plans in WE.

he didn't know the connection independently

 

[Travesty]

Except you're making more of an assumption than I am. 2 Years? Where's that in the dialogue?

We've got Nolan's quotes to back up what I'm saying. 8 Years. Enough time to make an impact. Bruce Wayne is frozen in time. He's hanging out in the mansion without anything to do. That's it. We've got nothing to suggest he's been active in those 8 years.

Agreed.

 

[The_Raganork]

"I was trying to fight the mob!"

He and Batman's actions sidelined the corruption of the Cops and Joker's rise to power. Gordon's not making the same mistake twice.



Except you're making more of an assumption than I am. 2 Years? Where's that in the dialogue?

We've got Nolan's quotes to back up what I'm saying. 8 Years. Enough time to make an impact. Bruce Wayne is frozen in time. He's hanging out in the mansion without anything to do. That's it. We've got nothing to suggest he's been active in those 8 years.

Granted I'm only saying two years as an alternate not as a fact.

No where in Nolan's comments does it require Batman be gone for all 8 years.

only that it's 8 years later from TDK and Bruce has been Frozen in time.

You surely could draw the conclusion you're drawing but one could also say.

He's frozen in time, his life becomes about Batman trying to rectify the harvey situation and for a significant amount of time he quits Batman.

That COULD be 8 years. That could be 6 years, or 5 or 2

 

[Carnotaur3]

Agreed.

But that doesn't mean he didn't.

Also read the Gotham times and remember the story of ARG between BB and TDK were written by J. Nolan.

You're making assumptions again. We don't see it in the films. Ever. There is no evidence to prove this is true.

Remember what Rachel told Bruce in Batman Begins? "Look beyond your own pain." Rachel knew that, yes, Chill did kill his parents. But it was Falcone who was responsible for the bigger picture. And Bruce realized this when he threw that gun in the river. It's all a god damned crime tree. The mob was at the top. If you want to take out crime, take out the instigator of it.

 

[The_Raganork]

I'm not going to continue this anymore though.

You guys are locked as in your idea as if Nolan said outright: "Bruce retired right after TDK"

There are clear ambiguities that can suggest your being right and my ideas being right but its like you don't see them or don't want to acknowledge them.

In time we will indeed see.

 

[craigdbfan]

"I was trying to fight the mob!"

He and Batman's actions sidelined the corruption of the Cops and Joker's rise to power. Gordon's not making the same mistake twice.

Except you're making more of an assumption than I am. 2 Years? Where's that in the dialogue?

We've got Nolan's quotes to back up what I'm saying. 8 Years. Enough time to make an impact. Bruce Wayne is frozen in time. He's hanging out in the mansion without anything to do. That's it. We've got nothing to suggest he's been active in those 8 years.

I remember when you and several other people said I was wrong about Wayne literally being frozen in time and no longer actively Batman.

Oh how the tables have turned.

http://lax.forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?p=22071773

 

[Norek]

The only reason he knew Batman was connected to WE is because he found the tumbler plans in WE.

he didn't know the connection independently

Wait, what about this:

Let me get this straight. You think that your client, one of the wealthiest, most powerful men in the world, is secretly a vigilante who spends his nights beating criminals to a pulp with his bare hands; and your plan, is to *blackmail* this person?

Who is this guy who's one of the wealthiest, most powerful men in the world, and is Reese's client? Doesn't Fox imply it's Bruce openly?

 

[Carnotaur3]

I'm not going to continue this anymore though.

You guys are locked as in your idea as if Nolan said outright: "Bruce retired right after TDK"

There are clear ambiguities that can suggest your being right and my ideas being right but its like you don't see them or don't want to acknowledge them.

In time we will indeed see.

I'm only acknowledging the evidence at hand, Rag. I can acknowledge I could be wrong. But the evidence isn't pointing that way.

 

[ggghhh]

He's out of commission.

Comes back

Gets beaten

Taken away

Comes back

gets Caught

Gets sprung out
Comes back?

Too much.

I suspect the bolded is just him using a prisoner hood to get back control of his tech guy. (Fox/ Pavel parallel)

 

[Carnotaur3]

I remember when you and several other people said I was wrong about Wayne literally being frozen in time and no longer actively Batman.

Oh how the tables have turned.

http://lax.forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?p=22071773

Where did I say you were wrong? And my opinions have changed over the past few months by everything that we now know. That does happen.

 

[Travesty]

The only reason he knew Batman was connected to WE is because he found the tumbler plans in WE.

he didn't know the connection independently

But what's your point? Reese knew Batman was connected to WE, that's a fact. And this was before Batman was considered the most wanted man in Gotham.

You wanted to know how anybody could possibly think Bruce could be Batman, and there it is. If someone like Reese can figure out ties to Batman, it's not hard for others. And again, since Bruce owns WE, don't you think he may try to divert attention away from himself? I don't think he wants to go to jail, especially for crimes he didn't commit.

 

[jonnywhc]

Also read the Gotham times and remember the story of ARG between BB and TDK were written by J. Nolan.

What happened in that story? Always tried to find it.

 

[craigdbfan]

Where did I say you were wrong? And my opinions have changed over the past few months by everything that we now know. That does happen.

Excelsior said that he had been Batman aimlessly and you agreed. So, yeah you were wrong but hey we've all been there.

 

[Norek]

But what's your point? Reese knew Batman was connected to WE, that's a fact. And this was before Batman was considered the most wanted man in Gotham.

You wanted to know how anybody could possibly think Bruce could be Batman, and there it is. If someone like Reese can figure out ties to Batman, it's not hard for others. And again, since Bruce owns WE, don't you think he may try to divert attention away from himself? I don't think he wants to go to jail, especially for crimes he didn't commit.

I think Reese knows Bruce is Batman. Not that Batman's just tied to WE.

 

[venus_ice]

Good to see you back and raising hell, Rags.

 

[The Joker]

I think Reese knows Bruce is Batman. Not that Batman's just tied to WE.

I thought that was obvious between the dialogue from Lucius, and the little knowing nod Bruce gives Reese after he saves him in the Lambo.

 

[Carnotaur3]

Excelsior said that he had been Batman aimlessly and you agreed. So, yeah you were wrong but hey we've all been there.

Oh, I thought you were saying I was condemning you or something lol!

Glad I didn't seem to be in there. But yeah I also had a crazy notion that Bruce was getting in the Batman costume for 8 years, beating petty criminals to a pulp for the sake of not having anything else to do. Just a bored sap. lol

 

[Travesty]

I think Reese knows Bruce is Batman. Not that Batman's just tied to WE.

I thought that was obvious between the dialogue from Lucius, and the little knowing nod Bruce gives Reese after he saves him in the Lambo.

Oh, I agree. Plus, he was going to go on the news to say he knew exactly who Batman was.

 

[Norek]

I thought that was obvious between the dialogue from Lucius, and the little knowing nod Bruce gives Reese after he saves him in the Lambo.

Exactly. I think that was the point of the whole thing.