The Amazing Spider-Man 2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2 General Discussion - Part 6

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Sorry, but you're saying two totally different things now. This:



Is a FAR different argument than this:



Figure out what exactly you're trying to say, and then we can talk.


It's all part of the same school of thought. The bottom comment is me breaking it down to the extreme basics because I keep getting the "softer" and "friendlier" responses, which has nothing to do with "looking heroic". Still haven't received an actual response/rebuttal to that yet. That's cool. I know exactly what I'm saying- Your inabilty to follow the argument is really no fault of mine.
 
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It's all part of the same school of thought. The bottom comment is me breaking it down to the extreme basics because I keep getting the "softer" and "friendlier" responses, which has nothing to do with "looking heroic". Still haven't received an actual response/rebuttal to that yet. That's cool. I know exactly what I'm saying- Your inabilty to follow the argument is really no fault of mine.

Uh, "Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man" lol that's what I said at the very beginning of this pointless argument lol I see someone can't handle not being the "right and most thought provoking" poster in a forum.
 
What's wrong with Gwen making the new suit for Peter because it better falls under the "Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man" motif? This movie is including some obscure things from the comics (Ravencroft isn't widely known), it appears that Webb is trying to make the most "Spider-Man inspired" Spider-Man movie yet. Like the definitive Spider-Man movie, but at the same time wrapping it up in the universe he's established. Peter didn't make the original suit with heroics in mind, so why not have him recieve a more "heroic" looking suit since he's become widely known and has to maintain a public image as a hero? No need to be so cyncial.


Looks like you did say it. Still trying to figure out what the elements are that make a costume look more "heroic".

And you don't keep responding and continuing the argument because you think you're right...gotcha.
 
Also you have recieved the responses you're looking for, you just refuse to accept them lol
 
It's all part of the same school of thought. The bottom comment is me breaking it down to the extreme basics because I keep getting the "softer" and "friendlier" responses, which has nothing to do with "looking heroic". Still haven't received an actual response/rebuttal to that yet. That's cool. I know exactly what I'm saying- Your inabilty to follow the argument is really no fault of mine.

Haha, I almost believe you - you're so intent on being right, you'll tell yourself anything. It's quite obvious you totally misunderstood the discussion, and instead of bowing out when you were corrected, you changed the point if your argument. Kinda sad, man.

They're similar schools of thought, but with distinctly different outcomes.

Compared to the new suit, ASM suit looks ragged, cobbled together and almost mean. Not what you'd really define as a picturesque hero's suit (in the sense that a superhero looks like a hero). The more refined suit, with larger, less intimidating eyes make the suit seem more legitimate for a superhero, ergo more "heroic". The light colors help, too. That's basic color theory and color tropes in art. These might seem "silly" to you, but these are all things discussed, dissected, and put into practice in creation of media, especially in comics.
 
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Oh come one. Can we give it a rest? The guy clearly isn't going to get it and it's not worth the argument.
 
It's almost like that discussion on the difference between direct and indirect responsibility.
 
Looks like you did say it. Still trying to figure out what the elements are that make a costume look more "heroic".

And you don't keep responding and continuing the argument because you think you're right...gotcha.

I never said I didn't say it lol I said that this costume fits better with the "Friendly Neighborhood..." title than the last suit. And I'm not trying to be right, you're the one ignorning everything that's being said to you. It's easy to just say "Yeah, whatever. I'll wait til someone says something that makes this seem legit." that's exactly what you're doing lol
Heroism is spirit, valor, bravery. All warmer color tinged words, which can be translated to warmer, brighter colors. Bright brings thoughts of pureness, being
clean, hence a brighter clean design. White is a more emotive color than yellow, since white is EVERY color. Wide eyes bring a sense of wonderment, adventure, and maybe even innocence, which connects to friendliness.
 
Haha, I almost believe you - you're so intent on being right, you'll tell yourself anything. It's quite obvious you totally misunderstood the discussion, and instead of bowing out when you were corrected, you changed the point if your argument. Kinda sad, man.

They're similar schools of thought, but with distinctly different outcomes.

Compared to the new suit, ASM suit looks ragged, cobbled together and almost mean. Not what you'd really define as a picturesque hero's suit (in the sense that a superhero looks like a hero). The more refined suit, with larger, less intimidating eyes make the suit seem more legitimate for a superhero, ergo more "heroic". The light colors help, too. That's basic color theory and color tropes in art. These might seem "silly" to you, but these are all things discussed, dissected, and put into practice in creation of media, especially in comics.


My point has been consistent from the beginning- The TASM2 suit looks more "iconic", brighter, friendlier, happier, whatever. I agree with that- More "heroic"? Definitely not. That's such a vague term that, in terms of visuals, is completely subjective. That's my real point. But hey, if you've got to keep using weak cop outs wherein you try to convince yourself that I've got no idea what I'm talking about, then go for it. Whatever makes you feel better (though it does absolutely nothing for your argument). Look how easy it is to do: lol! If you keep telling yourself that it's true, maybe someday you'll believe it. Contentless. But please, carry on.

In your OPINION, the TASM costume looks "ragged", "cobbled together" and "mean" (huh?). I think it looks like great and really well designed, not at all ragged or cobbled together- a great alternate take on the traditional costume that doesn't look at all "mean" (again, huh?). This is you making things up and trying to pass them off as though they are facts.

Again, you bring up the brighter colors and larger eyes, which make the suit "less intimidating" and more "legitimate for a superhero" in your opinion. Right, you keep bringing this up- Which is why I brought up Batman or how about Ghost Rider or Blade? Their costumes aren't "bright" or "unintimidating", yet they are still heroic. Your logic isn't working.

Now you're bringing up color theory and "color tropes" and just dropping them into your argument without expanding on WHY they mean anything. Looks like it. The only thing I said was silly is you guys trying to contrast how the TASM2 costume is somehow more "heroic" than the TASM one, when that's something you can't possibly do because there's no true visual definition of what it means to look "heroic". Bigger eyes? Brighter colors? lol. Good job trying to twist my words though.

Every valid point I've brought up, you've conveniently ignored. Is the Ben Reilly Spider-Man costume somehow less "heroic" than classic costume, but more "heroic" than the Iron Spider costume? You keep trying to put constraints on what does or does not look "heroic", when that's something you can't do.
 
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Am I the only one who thinks Gwen making Peter's new suit isn't that great of an idea? I mean, I think that in the next movie Peter will be struggling to keep Gwen safe and make sure she doesn't get involved in all the spider-man business, but having Gwen make the costume shows that Peter doesn't care about what Captain Stacy said. Or, they could have Gwen make it without Peter knowing, and Peter doesn't approve or something. I don't know. I just don't see how having Peter let Gwen make the costume would work with what happened at the end of TASM. And I'm not sure why Gwen would feel the need to make Peter an entire new costume, even if it is to help Spider-man's public image.

@Vid Electricz- I don't think you are actually reading what people are saying to you. You keep saying that having brighter colors and looking friendlier doesn't makes someone more heroic. No one is saying that it does. They are saying that the costume will look more heroic to the people of New York in the movie because they don't know Peter's life story and who Spider-Man really is. Some people in the movie might have just seen a few images of him or heard about him. They don't know squat about Spider-man, but if they see him in person and he looks friendly with big bright eyes and a clean, bright costume, they might think that he isn't a threat.
Then you keep bringing up Batman and how he is heroic even though he has a dark suit. Again, no one is saying that Batman is less heroic. Also, I'm pretty sure it is explained or implied in the movies that Batman made his suit to scare the **** out of criminals. He isn't supposed to look like a friendly superhero.
 
Am I the only one who thinks Gwen making Peter's new suit isn't that great of an idea? I mean, I think that in the next movie Peter will be struggling to keep Gwen safe and make sure she doesn't get involved in all the spider-man business, but having Gwen make the costume shows that Peter doesn't care about what Captain Stacy said. Or, they could have Gwen make it without Peter knowing, and Peter doesn't approve or something. I don't know. I just don't see how having Peter let Gwen make the costume would work with what happened at the end of TASM. And I'm not sure why Gwen would feel the need to make Peter an entire new costume, even if it is to help Spider-man's public image.

@Vid Electricz- I don't think you are actually reading what people are saying to you. You keep saying that having brighter colors and looking friendlier doesn't makes someone more heroic. No one is saying that it does. They are saying that the costume will look more heroic to the people of New York in the movie because they don't know Peter's life story and who Spider-Man really is. Some people in the movie might have just seen a few images of him or heard about him. They don't know squat about Spider-man, but if they see him in person and he looks friendly with big bright eyes and a clean, bright costume, they might think that he isn't a threat.
Then you keep bringing up Batman and how he is heroic even though he has a dark suit. Again, no one is saying that Batman is less heroic. Also, I'm pretty sure it is explained or implied in the movies that Batman made his suit to scare the **** out of criminals. He isn't supposed to look like a friendly superhero.

i think it's a safe assumption Peter and Gwen decide they know what's best for eachother and end up ignoring what Capt Stacy warned about and was afraid of... which ultimately leads to Gwen's death, and Peter stuck with a horrible life lesson
 
@Webface. Yeah your the only one. I wanted to see a progression since the first movie. I said this before but the Great Power and Responsibility comic as a costume that looks just like the Asm costume and then in the second issue(or so) he switches to the traditional costume.
 
Am I the only one who thinks Gwen making Peter's new suit isn't that great of an idea? I mean, I think that in the next movie Peter will be struggling to keep Gwen safe and make sure she doesn't get involved in all the spider-man business, but having Gwen make the costume shows that Peter doesn't care about what Captain Stacy said. Or, they could have Gwen make it without Peter knowing, and Peter doesn't approve or something. I don't know. I just don't see how having Peter let Gwen make the costume would work with what happened at the end of TASM. And I'm not sure why Gwen would feel the need to make Peter an entire new costume, even if it is to help Spider-man's public image.

@Vid Electricz- I don't think you are actually reading what people are saying to you. You keep saying that having brighter colors and looking friendlier doesn't makes someone more heroic. No one is saying that it does. They are saying that the costume will look more heroic to the people of New York in the movie because they don't know Peter's life story and who Spider-Man really is. Some people in the movie might have just seen a few images of him or heard about him. They don't know squat about Spider-man, but if they see him in person and he looks friendly with big bright eyes and a clean, bright costume, they might think that he isn't a threat.
Then you keep bringing up Batman and how he is heroic even though he has a dark suit. Again, no one is saying that Batman is less heroic. Also, I'm pretty sure it is explained or implied in the movies that Batman made his suit to scare the **** out of criminals. He isn't supposed to look like a friendly superhero.


Oh, I'm reading it, but they're not responding to the original argument.
I totally agree about the more streamlined design looking cleaner and the brighter colors appearing more "friendly" (though we really don't know what they'll look like on screen). The original argument though, was that the TASM2 costume is somehow more "heroic" than the TASM costume. My point is that this is a silly statement to make as pinning down what "looks" heroic and what doesn't is impossible.

As for the Gwen Stacy thing- my hope for *good* or logical writing as far as the Gwen/Peter relationship goes, went out the window when he revealed his identity on the first date and then with the "but those are the best kind" line. You've probably put more thought into it than the writers. lol.
 
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i think it's a safe assumption Peter and Gwen decide they know what's best for eachother and end up ignoring what Capt Stacy warned about and was afraid of... which ultimately leads to Gwen's death, and Peter stuck with a horrible life lesson
Yeah that does make sense for the plot of the trilogy. I just hope Peter and Gwen act like it wasn't an easy decision to let the promise go.
@Webface. Yeah your the only one. I wanted to see a progression since the first movie. I said this before but the Great Power and Responsibility comic as a costume that looks just like the Asm costume and then in the second issue(or so) he switches to the traditional costume.
I would love to see a progression from the first suit to the new suit, I just don't want Gwen to be the one that makes it.
 
Oh, I'm reading it, but they're not responding to the original argument.
I totally agree about the more streamlined design looking cleaner and the brighter colors appearing more "friendly" (though we really don't know what they'll look like on screen). The original argument though, was that the TASM2 costume is somehow more "heroic" than the TASM costume. My point is that this is a silly statement to make as pinning down what "looks" heroic and what doesn't is impossible.
It's not that complicated. Something that looks friendly will generally be seen as more heroic than something that looks scary. It's really that simple.
As for the Gwen Stacy thing- my hope for *good* or logical writing as far as the Gwen/Peter relationship goes, went out the window when he revealed his identity on the first date and then with the "but those are the best kind" line. You're probably put more thought into it than the writers. lol.
Peter probably realized that he will get caught by the cops at some point (which he actually does), Gwen's dad is a cop. He probably didn't want her to find out that he is Spider-man from her dad when the police catch him. Plus, Peter didn't want to keep secrets. Also, how could you say that some random fan put more thought into the story than the writers when they haven't even gotten to tell the full story?
 
@Webface.Well that part I agree with. I don't think she should make it. Maybe she can offer suggestions but I would like him come up with a valid reason for it.
 
Day 34. Marcus, VFX

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