The Flash The Barry Allen/The Flash Thread - Part 3

[Midnight Black]

AOS has actually been quite a bit better the past two episodes. It's been steadily improving, much the way Arrow did in S1. Arrow is still my favorite as of now, but it's had two seasons to grow. Let's not forget that Arrow in the beginning was rough. REALLY rough. Honestly, the only thing that kept me coming back through the first 6 to 10 episodes was because it had awesome fight choreography. It wasn't until about halfway through S1 that it really found it's stride, but once it did, it continued to skyrocket in quality.

AOS is going through a similar path right now. It's really started to build on everything established earlier in this season and tighten it's storytelling. It's very different from Arrow, but if it keeps improving, we'll have two quality superhero shows on our hands. Which honestly, is pretty freakin cool. When was the last time two good live action superhero shows were on at the same time? Honestly, I don't think that's happened...ever.

I do hope they handle Flash well also. I'm really liking the world Arrow is creating, and Flash would just expand it more. And I enjoyed Gustin as well, so I'd like to see the show succeed.

I agree with pretty much all of that. I liked Arrow from jump though. I thought it had a good cast and story...but then again it was an obvious copycat of the Nolan/Batman series.

I agree AOS is getting better...the chemistry took awhile to get there among the characters and the stories were okay at first. However, I enjoyed the last episode with Sif and like it when they rely less on the hokie campy comic stuff, and focus more on Coulson, powers and good storytelling. I still don't really care for the supporting cast, but can stomach the scientists and the female agent every now and then.

Lol.

Yeah there's really not been that much great as far as superhero TV shows go....even the best ones have just been ok compared to the movies.

The DCAU is still superior to any TV show and most movies, IMO. If we're counting those as TV shows and not just animation then they are the best, hands down.

DCAU is and has been the best thing to happen to DC outside of comics.

I'm all for a break from the bickering.....but what exactly do we have to talk about so far?

That Barry,yup.Nice guy.And smart.......

LOL....I knew Barry Allen back when he lived on Main St. What a fine young boy he was...he once painted my fence for a nickel and jar of lemonade. LOL.

 

[metaphysician]

DCAU is and has been the best thing to happen to DC outside of comics.

Fixed that for you.

 

[C. Lee]

If you guys want to talk about the costume....then wander on over to the costume thread http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=475247 and have yourself a ball.

Thanks for the notice Lee....I really appreciate it

 

[DrCosmic]

Fixed that for you.

Ouch.

But true.

 

[Kevin Smith]

Can't argue much with that.

 

[KillerMcQueen]

I'd agree with that if they'd made a Flash animated series.

 

[Kevin Smith]

I'd agree with that if they'd made a Flash animated series.

Fingers crossed for that one day soon. I think it'd do better than GL, personally (that GL CGI crap at least, but also the character as a whole somewhat).

 

[Spider-Aziz]

I'd agree with that if they'd made a Flash animated series.

Even if they did make a Flash animated series I'd disagree. Remember how slow the Flash is made in the cartoons?
I hope they don't slow this Flash too much for the sake of realism or another reason, the old show had Barry as fast as Wally was in the comics back at the time

 

[metaphysician]

They kind of have to slow him, at least somewhat, simply because in live action, it'd be much harder to hide weird disjoins between how fast he is in different scenes. Still, I hope they don't abuse the privilege, and focus more on plots where either the antagonist can legitimately challenge him, or the main obstacle of the plot is something that raw speed can't immediately overcome. High tech enemies that have plot devices of various kinds help with the former, and investigation-oriented plots could help with the latter. In theory, the best case scenario would be "Flash is faced with challenge that cannot simply be punched a thousand times in the face. Flash comes up with clever solution to untangle problem. *Then* Flash punches now-solvable problem a thousand times in the face."

 

[Midnight Black]

Fixed that for you.

Lol...thanks...haven't heard too many people side with the cartoons over the comics.

Fingers crossed for that one day soon. I think it'd do better than GL, personally (that GL CGI crap at least, but also the character as a whole somewhat).

I didn't like the CGI for GL at first, but the stories were good and after some time I was able to over look it and accept it as a different art form. It really wasn't that bad...now Beware the Batman...I couldn't get into that.

 

[Midnight Black]

Question for the group....would you be upset if the limit they flash's speed in the series in order to give the villains a chance in beating him and a possible obstacle for him to overcome in future seasons?

Basically, what I'm saying is they make it so that he can only go so fast until he exhausts himself and/or he can't exceed the speed of light in the first season because they he increases the chances of speeding up his aging process.

 

[metaphysician]

I'd say start even lower. Have the Flash's "reflex speed" be just into the supersonic range, with his running speed being higher, but with less maneuverability and more requirement for room to accelerate. That's still fast enough to be rather powerful, and fast enough to do all kinds of tricks, while being slow enough that you can work around it and challenge him.

His power level can proceed to grow over the course of the series. I'd save accelerating up to relativistic speeds, and dealing with the effects thereof, until a couple seasons in ( and have it be *far* from a casual effort ). Actually hitting or exceeding lightspeed can be a big milestone a few seasons later.

 

[Boy Scout]

I wouldn't object to slowing him down at all. It would just depend on how much they want to do so. The slowest he should be is probably the speed of sound.

 

[gugumugats]

Lol...thanks...haven't heard too many people side with the cartoons over the comics.

I think I'm one of those that side with the cartoons over the comics. I only started to become a monthly reader of comics ten years ago, but I'm starting to hate the issue to issue wait now that comics are heavily decompressed.

With animation, I appreciate that most episodes are pretty much stand-alone and they have that fresh/new feeling (even though most of them regurgitate comic storylines) but I love how they reimagine certain things from the comics.

Truthfully though, I appreciate the story being fed to me via animation or TV or movies versus having to actively read a comic. I'm lazy like that. Plus its ten times easier for me to get my fiance to watch any of that stuff versus getting her to read a comic book.

I didn't like the CGI for GL at first, but the stories were good and after some time I was able to over look it and accept it as a different art form. It really wasn't that bad...now Beware the Batman...I couldn't get into that.

GL took a while to grow on me too, but they actually have some really good stories despite the changes to the mythos.

I actually enjoyed Beware the Batman from the very beginning and I respect what they attempted to do by using lesser known villains. I just didnt appreciate the fact that its CG. I really don't think it adds much other than the occasional set piece (which can still be done as well, if not better in traditional animation)

 

[Kevin Smith]

Eh....depending on the universe they set him in, no slower than sound, if that. He's The Flash. He's got one freakin' superpower. Let him have it in all his glory.

The way you beat him is you overwhelm him. Flash needs to face guys who can do that on one level or another.

 

[Kevin Smith]

Definitely don't want to see some bs catch that sucks the fun out of it like the speed causing him to age prematurely put in there. That would suck.

 

[Midnight Black]

I think I'm one of those that side with the cartoons over the comics. I only started to become a monthly reader of comics ten years ago, but I'm starting to hate the issue to issue wait now that comics are heavily decompressed.

With animation, I appreciate that most episodes are pretty much stand-alone and they have that fresh/new feeling (even though most of them regurgitate comic storylines) but I love how they reimagine certain things from the comics.

Truthfully though, I appreciate the story being fed to me via animation or TV or movies versus having to actively read a comic. I'm lazy like that. Plus its ten times easier for me to get my fiance to watch any of that stuff versus getting her to read a comic book.




GL took a while to grow on me too, but they actually have some really good stories despite the changes to the mythos.

I actually enjoyed Beware the Batman from the very beginning and I respect what they attempted to do by using lesser known villains. I just didnt appreciate the fact that its CG. I really don't think it adds much other than the occasional set piece (which can still be done as well, if not better in traditional animation)

Thanks....I agree with all this except for the Beware the Batman part lol.

I wouldn't mind the premature aging being a reason as to why he can or should not approach lightspeed yet. There is so much known of Flash, yet even more unknown to the GA that you can play with his abilities while still remaining true to the character.

The problem with having him face villains who can only beat him by overwhelming him is there aren't a lot of criminal masterminds running around. For mob bosses the big thing is going to be beating him by exhausting him with multiple thugs he has to fight or making him get to one side of town to thwart some scheme.

Then once some big baddies come along we will see him put through feats of strength and intellect.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Question for the group....would you be upset if the limit they flash's speed in the series in order to give the villains a chance in beating him and a possible obstacle for him to overcome in future seasons?

I didn't like that in the Justice League animated
If anything, the rogues should be like they are in the NU52

 

[Kevin Smith]

Lol...thanks...haven't heard too many people side with the cartoons over the comics.



I didn't like the CGI for GL at first, but the stories were good and after some time I was able to over look it and accept it as a different art form. It really wasn't that bad...now Beware the Batman...I couldn't get into that.

I felt the CGI GL show was terrible and a wasted opportunity. Should have drawn from the episode "In Brightest Day" of Superman: TAS (but been a pure Hal and/or Kyle instead of an amalgamation) as far as tone and things went (like LOSH should've drawn from New Kids In Town but was also bad) but it didn't. It ignored most the classic aspects of the GL mythos and became an immensely boring show that was like Clone Wars 2.0. Wasn't as intelligent as the DCAU stuff, either.

Beware The Batman was just bad, other than them trying to use obscure villains. Gun toting super action hour ex secret agent Jason Stratham bodyguard Happy Hogan Alfred who trained Bruce Wayne was one of the worst things they could do with Batman and the suit and design for Batman looked pretty bad Batmobile was cool though.

The CGI animation route can be cool though, the animation itself just needs more weight to it though because as is it feels less "real" than a 2D cartoon. Glad both the shows are gone. Nothing but wasted potential. :-/

 

[Midnight Black]

I felt the CGI GL show was terrible and a wasted opportunity. Should have drawn from the episode "In Brightest Day" of Superman: TAS (but been a pure Hal and/or Kyle instead of an amalgamation) as far as tone and things went (like LOSH should've drawn from New Kids In Town but was also bad) but it didn't. It ignored most the classic aspects of the GL mythos and became an immensely boring show that was like Clone Wars 2.0. Wasn't as intelligent as the DCAU stuff, either.

Beware The Batman was just bad, other than them trying to use obscure villains. Gun toting super action hour ex secret agent Jason Stratham bodyguard Happy Hogan Alfred who trained Bruce Wayne was one of the worst things they could do with Batman and the suit and design for Batman looked pretty bad Batmobile was cool though.

The CGI animation route can be cool though, the animation itself just needs more weight to it though because as is it feels less "real" than a 2D cartoon. Glad both the shows are gone. Nothing but wasted potential. :-/

Agree with you on BTB, but disagree with you on GL. I enjoyed the show and thought it did a lot for GL in the wake of the terrible GL film.

I thought the stories were good and exposed the GA to more lanterns than previously seen. Also, Clone Wars was awesome! lol

Alfred as a jason statham gun toting ex agent of u.n.c.l.e. was pretty much spot on lol. I think it would've come off better if they didn't try and create this team with him Batman and the ninja girl. I don't mind a secret agent alfred, but this guy was more Brock Sampson and less James Bond than I would've preferred lol.

So how did you feel about Batman: Brave and the Bold and/or Justice League, since I take it you didn't like Legion of Superheroes.

 

[Rorschach2012]

I felt the CGI GL show was terrible and a wasted opportunity. Should have drawn from the episode "In Brightest Day" of Superman: TAS (but been a pure Hal and/or Kyle instead of an amalgamation) as far as tone and things went (like LOSH should've drawn from New Kids In Town but was also bad) but it didn't. It ignored most the classic aspects of the GL mythos and became an immensely boring show that was like Clone Wars 2.0. Wasn't as intelligent as the DCAU stuff, either.

Beware The Batman was just bad, other than them trying to use obscure villains. Gun toting super action hour ex secret agent Jason Stratham bodyguard Happy Hogan Alfred who trained Bruce Wayne was one of the worst things they could do with Batman and the suit and design for Batman looked pretty bad Batmobile was cool though.

The CGI animation route can be cool though, the animation itself just needs more weight to it though because as is it feels less "real" than a 2D cartoon. Glad both the shows are gone. Nothing but wasted potential. :-/

agreed. from the episodes of GL i watched, it seemed really childish compared to the DCAU. Would've been cool if GL TAS was set in the DCAU, before the events of Justice League.

GL TAS had so much potential, yet they wasted it with the childish storylines, miscast voice actors, and weird animation. I love GL. And i couldn't get through more than 4 episodes. Why don't tv networks understand that the Spider-Man TAS, X: Men TAS, and DCAU tone works best for animated superhero shows?

 

[Midnight Black]

agreed. from the episodes of GL i watched, it seemed really childish compared to the DCAU. Would've been cool if GL TAS was set in the DCAU, before the events of Justice League.

GL TAS had so much potential, yet they wasted it with the childish storylines, miscast voice actors, and weird animation. I love GL. And i couldn't get through more than 4 episodes. Why don't tv networks understand that the Spider-Man TAS, X: Men TAS, and DCAU tone works best for animated superhero shows?

I felt that way at first...especially since YJ was going on at the same time and comparing the two was apparent. However, GL grew on me, especially as the storylines got way better and more mature. The Steampunk and Blue Lantern episodes were awesome.

 

[Boy Scout]

Young Justice was perfect.

 

[Paradox1]

I don't see what's the hate behind 3d animation for cartoons. It's the animation style of the future. GL was a good show, it was pretty mature And it was produced by the great Bruce Timm. Talking remotely bad about him is sacrilege he was the common denominator behind everything DCAU.

Beware the Batman was okay they wanted to go down a less popular/less familiar route. I didn't have a problem with any of the depictions and I like Alfred as more of a partner/mentor. I don't see him as a Jason stratham whatever I saw like a Denzel Washington in a Man on Fire.

 

[gugumugats]

I think that CG was really good fit for the GL series (which I hated at first but eventually became a huge fan of during the Manhunter arc). The constructs feel like they had more substance, different effects were exploited for the different color lanterns and their auras, spaceships are usually CG'd anyway, and the sparse nature of props and characters in CG shows were justified given that they're in outer space.

However, CG was NOT a good fit for Beware the Batman. Gotham looked empty half the time and characters felt stiff and statue like when there was no action going on. The only advantages that CG provided are the novelty of it all and the fluid action scenes.

I did like the storyline in Beware the Batman though and admired that they went down the unfamiliar route. I really wasn't aware that bad-ass Alfred was not popular with fans. I enjoyed it a lot, and my fiance thought it was the most logical depiction for Alfred. I liked it because it kind of reversed the Batman Beyond dynamic with Bruce as the younger man on the field.