• Secure your account

    A friendly reminder to our users, please make sure your account is safe. Make sure you update your password and have an active email address to recover or change your password.

  • Xenforo Cloud has scheduled an upgrade to XenForo version 2.2.16. This will take place on or shortly after the following date and time: Jul 05, 2024 at 05:00 PM (PT) There shouldn't be any downtime, as it's just a maintenance release. More info here

"The Joker" in development with Todd Phillips and Martin Scorsese attached? - Part 1

Status
Not open for further replies.
This is a one movie kind of deal. Not everything needs to be part of some giant shared universe. And with that, it can play by any rules it wants as long as it tells a great story. Think of Logan as the only Wolverine movie you ever need to see.

Let one movie speak for itself. No sequels. No prequels. No 10 part mini-series. No 6 seasons on TV. Just a good old fashioned two hour story. Beginning, middle and end. Remember those? What movies do best.
 
...because it apparently won't affect the DCEU movie universe?

What are people going to get confused over, exactly?

I could see a world in which this movie is thought to connect to Leto's Joker. Or maybe audiences will think they are recasting, and Phoenix is now the new Joker. Or they might find that they prefer this Joker and resent having to go back to the other continuity. Or they could use this movie as evidence that WB is all over the place with DC, and there's no real point to see it in theaters. That's what drove me away from X-Men franchise.

If it's an Elseworld tale... fine... but they better market it that way. Otherwise, folks will get confused about how this fits, or worse, give up after the appearance of it not fitting.

Again, you could do this movie at any time. Wouldn't it make more sense to make an Elseworld Tale after you've gotten your Primaryworld Tale already established? This situation reads as a movie that wouldn't be made if a top billed actor wasn't interested. But is that a good reason to make a movie? Cause one guy wants to play the role? What about the plan? Let's stick to the main course before we get to the dessert.
 
What do you mean "technically Elseworld?" How will the audience know that this doesn't effect the DC Movie Universe proper?

Films are not comic canon, so it's Elseworld.

If you mean the DCEU, it should be fairly obvious that this movie isn't connected. I don't see how The Joker will "effect" the DCEU. Besides, I'm not concerned about what the audience thinks. It's not like that determines if the movie will be good or not.
 
Films are not comic canon, so it's Elseworld.

If you mean the DCEU, it should be fairly obvious that this movie isn't connected. I don't see how The Joker will "effect" the DCEU. Besides, I'm not concerned about what the audience thinks. It's not like that determines if the movie will be good or not.

I was talking about the movies, yeah. Well... I'm willing to admit that it sounds like there's a good movie to be found in this endeavor. But I do care what audiences think, because that determines the upcoming movie slate. And if this movie turns folks off or forces the creative team to write in an elderly joker because audiences loved the original so much... well that'll be a disappointment. WB needs to get away from this "create as you go" strategy that they have going with DC.
 
Okay, so right off the bat, folks are defending this movie right now because it's an Elseworld tale. Fine.. but that better mean that WB markets it as such. Because if they don't and the film breeds confusion, then there will be a backlash. Count on it.
That's what the rumors have told us. They said they have a label that'll differentiate them from the DCEU. They think it'll be called DC Dark or DC Black.



https://screenrant.com/dc-dceu-joker-movie-dark-black/
 
I could see a world in which this movie is thought to connect to Leto's Joker.

Because...

Or maybe audiences will think they are recasting, and Phoenix is now the new Joker.

And with a vocal majority condemning the Leto Joker, this is a problem because...

Or they might find that they prefer this Joker and resent having to go back to the other continuity.

This assumes that the other continuity will heavily feature Joker, or that the other continuity won't present something worth going back to if they do feature Joker. We don't know that at this point.

Or they could use this movie as evidence that WB is all over the place with DC, and there's no real point to see it in theaters. That's what drove me away from X-Men franchise.

I don't see how "making movies about DC characters" equals being "all over the place", but...ok.

There's no one approach that is going to thrill all audiences or get everyone into theaters. There are going to be people who like some of WB's approaches, and hate others. That's sort of the point. With this film, WB can reach an audience that perhaps they might not with their more mainstream stuff.

If it's an Elseworld tale... fine... but they better market it that way. Otherwise, folks will get confused about how this fits, or worse, give up after the appearance of it not fitting.]

It's essentially been marketed that way since the first news and rumors of the project.

Again, you could do this movie at any time.

And they're doing it now.

Wouldn't it make more sense to make an Elseworld Tale after you've gotten your Primaryworld Tale already established?

No, because this move is going to be its own, likely self contained story, and is likely going to play against what people know about The Joker from previous adaptions, films, etc, and the larger pop culture, not be reliant on what people know about the specific portrayal seen in the DCEU.

Beyond that, the primaryworld tale kind of is established. By the time this comes out, there will have been six DC Universe films. By any reasonable standard, that's a pretty well established franchise.

This situation reads as a movie that wouldn't be made if a top billed actor wasn't interested. But is that a good reason to make a movie? Cause one guy wants to play the role? What about the plan? Let's stick to the main course before we get to the dessert.

I don't see why that matters. Lots of movies are made as star vehicles, or because of some combination of star power and an interesting story.

I doubt that's the only reason that everyone involved in the project is making the movie, though.

You're assuming that this wasn't part of a broader plan regarding the DC characters to begin with. Which is just that...an assumption. Regardless, it's clearly part of the plan now, so I'm uncertain as to why it would be an issue that it may not have been part of the plan at some arbitrary point in the past.
 
That's not a quantifiable requirement.

.

It bloody is for the general audience, who are just going to be confused when this movie comes out...

And not to sound like a broken record, but it's them who make these movies successes... not people on superhero forums.

They'd better make a HUGE deal out of this film being off in another continuity for the audience to not be confused as ****. This is WB, so I don't hold out that much hope.
 
I don't see how "making movies about DC characters" equals being "all over the place", but...ok.

Of course they're all over the place! Do you really think they'd be making this movie if the DCEU was popular and a success? :whatever:
 
They need to refilm the BvS fight scene where Superman can now say "Save Melania" and Batman can ask "Why did you say that name???"
 
It bloody is for the general audience, who are just going to be confused when this movie comes out...
Can you prove that right now?

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Fans on the internet overstate just how hung up general audiences get on these sorts of things. If the movie bombs and the general consensus is that it did so because the audience was confused, then you'll have an argument. However, I'm more inclined to believe that if the movie were to bomb, it would do so because the film simply wasn't very good or audience interest just wasn't there. But neither of those factors have anything to do with the current state of DC's main properties.
 
Last edited:
Of course they're all over the place! Do you really think they'd be making this movie if the DCEU was popular and a success? :whatever:

Seriously. I highly doubt that, when BvS and Suicide Squad were in production and WB was thinking they were about to kick off their shared universe in a big way, anyone was like, “Hey, what if we also did a Joker movie with a completely different actor that’s set in the early 90s and doesn’t connect to any of this?”
 
Of course they're all over the place! Do you really think they'd be making this movie if the DCEU was popular and a success? :whatever:

Exactly. Jared Leto would be in this role right now, not Phoenix.
 
As someone who is defending this spin-off, arguing that the DC universe somehow isn't all over the place is blatant intellectual dishonesty. But that's just par for the course for those who have been leaping to WB's defense for the past several years.
 
That movie's never happening, we all know it, and that's exactly his point.

His point is that Leto should be getting his own solo movie in an elseworlds setting?
 
Announcing the Leto Joker movie felt like nothing more than a PR stunt. It placates the fans in the short term, but will eventually fade away into obscurity.
 
His point is that Leto should be getting his own solo movie in an elseworlds setting?

His point is that if the "plan" had worked, Leto would either be helming a solo movie or at the very least there wouldn't be another version of the Joker offered up so quickly.
 
That movie's never happening, we all know it, and that's exactly his point.

His point is that Leto should be getting his own solo movie in an elseworlds setting?

No, Flint is right. This Phoenix movie wouldn't be happening if Letoker was a success. Or if WB was dead set on doing a Joker spin off then Leto would be the only Joker getting a spin off.

Common sense dictates that you don't announce a whole new Joker actor just 2 years after you've cast a brand new one. Elseworlds tale or not, unless you're looking to reinvigorate the character after a poor reception to your previous version.

And as others have said, we all know the Letoker spin off isn't going to happen.
 
His point is that if the "plan" had worked, Leto would either be helming a solo movie or at the very least there wouldn't be another version of the Joker offered up so quickly.

We're getting both supposedly.
I'd have the DCEU collapse sooner if they were going to finally do concurrent elseworlds.
 
No, Flint is right. This Phoenix movie wouldn't be happening if Letoker was a success. Or if WB was dead set on doing a Joker spin off then Leto would be the only Joker getting a spin off.

Common sense dictates that you don't announce a whole new Joker actor just 2 years after you've cast a brand new one. Elseworlds tale or not, unless you're looking to reinvigorate the character after a poor reception to your previous version.

And as others have said, we all know the Letoker spin off isn't going to happen.
None of these movies are happening until they happen. Welcome to Hollywood.
 
You're assuming that this wasn't part of a broader plan regarding the DC characters to begin with. Which is just that...an assumption. Regardless, it's clearly part of the plan now, so I'm uncertain as to why it would be an issue that it may not have been part of the plan at some arbitrary point in the past.

I think this film was definitely NOT part of the original plan and is born out of a need to reinvent themselves and save their reputation.

However, like you said, it is what it is. It doesn't really matter anymore and has no bearing on the quality of the film.
 
Of course they're all over the place! Do you really think they'd be making this movie if the DCEU was popular and a success? :whatever:

How are they all over the place? Their previous announcements were, sure. But since then, there is no indication that that's the case. Hamada seems to be tightening things up, and the only items receiving attention are movies that have been green lit and have tentative production dates.

Or do you just deem that it's "all over the place" because some of the movies they're making don't align with the "main story" :whatever:
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Users who are viewing this thread

Staff online

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
200,687
Messages
21,787,137
Members
45,616
Latest member
stevezorz
Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"