I don’t know if Hatter is in this but I’d make him the drug dealer and Joker the one who created the drug in the first place for A) his own amusement and B) to screw up the minds of citizens. It’s not my theory but it’s the one I’d go with, because Joker wouldn’t deal drugs I don’t think. And Scarecrow making drugs that put a smile on your face but has awful side effects seems like the opposite thing to shoot for. Crane usually inflicts terror through hallucinations. It’s not a drug that ppl want to keep buying. It’s not a good trip.
Crane does not enjoy making people smile, he gets his rocks off on pure hallucinogenic terror.
But of course this could be somewhat similar to Joker’s toxin that sends people into a convulsing laughing death and their corpse frozen in a permanent grin. It’s not exactly the same of course, but I could see it being an adaptation of it, and there is precedent in the comics for Joker having chemistry knowledge, so him being a drug dealer wouldn’t be that much of a stretch.
Crane does not enjoy making people smile, he gets his rocks off on pure hallucinogenic terror.
But of course this could be somewhat similar to Joker’s toxin that sends people into a convulsing laughing death and their corpse frozen in a permanent grin. It’s not exactly the same of course, but I could see it being an adaptation of it, and there is precedent in the comics for Joker having chemistry knowledge, so him being a drug dealer wouldn’t be that much of a stretch.
But they have introduced a new street drug into the comics called "Cheerdrops" that have an effect similar to Joker gas, leaving victims with creepy smiles when they OD. But the drug is discovered to be a modified version of Scarecrow's Fear Toxin that has the opposite effect of his toxin, making the user experience extreme happiness and pleasant hallucinations. The drug is super dangerous though and people are accidently harming themselves as a result of taking it among other traditional drug side effects.
Now it's possible this plot line was done with knowledge of the movie plot line, especially how DC has talked about creating synergy among different mediums. There is no way of knowing whether this is the exact same Drug and background for it from the film or not. I assume there will be key differences though. But I've made a new theory based around this possibility for Drops and a few other key pieces of information.
I think Joker might be a type of serial killer who has existed in Gotham for years. This lines up with the Hannibal Lecter influence but is also based on this pic Matt Reeves posted when filming wrapped:
The card contained is a Valentine's Day card obviously left by Riddler at another crime scene. The most simple way to analyze this is that Riddler leaves a crime scene around each holiday. This would tell us the movie takes place over a span of at least 5 DIFFERENT MONTHS. Although this is most likely, I do have another possible theory for the cards.
We can reasonably assume the film starts around Halloween, with the first card being a Halloween card corresponding to the first killing, and the set leaks that show a Halloween party. But nothing has leaked to indicate they have shot a winter scene, and imo if you are doing Batman during Christmas, you make Gotham snowy. Snowy Gotham is classic and I don't see Matt skipping out on that. The other problem I have is that Matt said this film's plot moves like a snowball rolling down hill. To me, a plot that picks up speed like that, rarely takes place over such a long span of time.
So my theory is that the Joker is an infamous serial killer in Gotham, who has committed holiday themed killings, or some of his biggest kills took place around holidays, and have been branded with names like "The 1999 Valentines Day Massacre" etc. Joker as a serial killer makes sense on a lot of levels. In his first appearance he was a serial killer who left his victims' corpses with a smile (actually using a chemical, although I lean more towards scarification here, but it could be a mix of both depending on his mood lol). Also Clowns and Serial Killers just go hand in hand in American urban legends. I think Joker would be like Gotham's Jack The Ripper. He'd commit horrible weird crimes and then disappear for months to years before striking again. People thought he would never be caught, until Batman shows up and takes him down in his FIRST YEAR. Taking down Joker is what builds his relationship with the police, and especially explains why the FBI would allow him on the crime scene (FBI are always brought in for serial killers, so they'd have also been involved and known his role in taking down their Most Wanted).
So with the first card found on Halloween, and it being a Halloween card, nothing is TOO strange about that. But imagine in a couple weeks, they find another body, and now there is a Thanksgiving Card, the next crime scene, there's a Christmas Card. Soon it's the end of November and they're already up to Valentine's Day. All of a sudden a pattern emerges, and other strange clues start to become obvious: the cards and clues are pointing towards Joker. And this is what leads Batman to visit Joker in Arkham. What I think is also cool about this, is in TLH it's the holiday theme that leads the detectives to visit Calendar Man in Arkham, and this would be very similar in that way.
How Joker being a Serial Killer ties to Drops Set photos have indicated that Drops have been around for years. It's possible a young Crane, obsessed with the power of fear, and understandably infatuated with the infamous serial killer Joker, makes Drops in Joker's image, designing it to mimic Joker's M.O., allowing him to capitalize on Joker's terrifying presence in Gotham for his own sick amusement. Joker's presence would be felt throughout Gotham, with even those Goons dressing in his likeness to take advantage of his infamous image.
I think a Scarecrow focused sequel would show Crane finding his identity and M.O., as he tries to create his own urban legend, taking up the mantle as Gotham's symbol of fear that Joker's capture has left vacant.
I think it's mainly being derived from how in the Arkham-verse, Joker was the one who shoved the bottle into Penguin's eye socket giving him a makeshift monocle.
I'm all for world-building and texture and stuff like that, but it's still sort of early to make these types of inferences.
What I’d most like to see is more horror influence. I’m all for prosthetics for the chin and cheekbones (unless they cast Harry Melling who wouldn’t need it). The original, Gwynplaine-inspired design was already so scary. Some horror influence I’d like to see would be from The Babadook, The Exorcist, and of course The Man Who Laughs.
I support the return of the perma-white and the perma-grin. I’m open to a few different directions, I just want him to be scary.
Kelley Jones does a really creepy Joker
My favorite Joker design is Dave McKean’s from Arkham Asylum. With prosthetics, you could definitely achieve something along these lines.
Then you have the 80s design from Aparo and Bolland. It’s classic, traditional, and sinister. It feels like a very respectful evolution of the original design.
Harry Melling is probably the best visual fit for the Joker that I’d like to see.
I kind of hope Batman has already fought The Joker in the Matt Reeves universe so if and when they introduce him we don't have to have another "Batman fights The Joker for the first time" type of story.
I kind of hope Batman has already fought The Joker in the Matt Reeves universe so if and when they introduce him we don't have to have another "Batman fights The Joker for the first time" type of story.
Especially considering how closely TDK adhered to Joker’s first appearance in the comic. It’s a very faithful adaptation.
What I’d like to see is a movie inspired by the general concept of the Arkham Asylum (2009) game and Arkham Asylum: A Serious House on Serious Earth. We haven’t seen nearly enough of Joker in Arkham on film.
I'm slowly coming around to being more open to the idea of Melling as Joker, even though I think he'd be a better pick for Mad Hatter. That photoshop looks great.
I don't know if anyone has already proposed him (I'm a new user), but I think Adrien Brody could be the perfect choice.
In a dirty city like Reeves' Gotham, Joker may be interesting as a classy (but not-so-sober) gangster clown/showman who wears makeup to hide acid burns.
A mix between Nicholson and Phoenix, but also a version of Monaghan's Joker with an higher budget (and a better script!).
So, basically... BTAS' Joker!
Look how similar he is to Mask of Phantasm's Jack Napier!
Also, I think he could be possible, because:
1. He won an Oscar: considering this Joker will be contemporary to Phoenix's one, I think Reeves and Warner will choose a big name.
2. He is famous but not exactly a star: he was also in a lot of medium-little projects and often in noir movie. Just like Turturro, Dano, Farrell... and Pattinson himself!
3. He would be a perfect charismatic guru-serial killer, boss of a "clown Family" just like Charles Manson or Hannibal Lecter!
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