The "Keep Hope Alive" (that the rights can revert back to Marvel) thread - Part 5

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They were optioned seperately - not lumped together.

Fox had to check with Marvel to see if including the Surfer in FF2 counted as a SS movie in terms of the option - which it did.

Fox let DD slip away through carelessness - so it could happen again here - but it would be very easy to slip SS into this movie, so I guess we must wait and see...

Do you have a link or source saying they are separate entities? I have never seen or heard that they were separate.

As with the X-Men characters and their respective "universe", the characters of the Fantastic Four "universe" are batched together in their own contract. It's not feasible to introduce hundreds of characters in a 7 year span, let alone have individual film contracts for those 100+ characters. So far, the only unique contracts known are for the shared characters, such as Quicksilver, Scarlet Witch, possibly Madame Hydra/Viper, etc.
 
Just got back from the Marvel News Week! ... this thread is still moving...yup...get the rights back!
 
So this thread will keep going until at least 2022?
That is about the time when Fox will have to get production rolling on another reboot.
 

There's a lot of speculation and "sources at Marvel" in that link. The closest I could find to the film properties was from 2/9/99...which has very little substance. It does mention the negotiations and approval of the two-year extension, going from five years to seven.

Logically, the rights to SS would revert right now during this production unless he is either used in FFINO or on a longer period than seven years.
 
Agreed. I think a lot of the ire towards Fox and their FF reboot would have been cooled if they didn't tell Marvel to screw themselves when they asked to share the rights to the Big G and his herald. If we live in a world where we have two Quicksilvers on the big screen, why in the world could that not happen?

As it is I think Marvel is moving on - in the MCU, the Celestials and Adam Warlock will probably take the place of Galactus and Norrin Radd respectively.

Not true. I like Daredevil better than the Silver Surfer.
 
There's a lot of speculation and "sources at Marvel" in that link. The closest I could find to the film properties was from 2/9/99...which has very little substance. It does mention the negotiations and approval of the two-year extension, going from five years to seven.

Logically, the rights to SS would revert right now during this production unless he is either used in FFINO or on a longer period than seven years.

I do get the feeling the SS & Galactus are part of the FF package (at least now if not before). If so this film would continue Fox's hold regardless of them being in it or not.

I would love to be wrong on that though, and if so then Fox should lose the rights to the SS & the Big G sometime this year (and if so they'd have lost both Daredevil & the SS & Galactus back to Marvel instead of cutting a deal when it was offered), but I suspect that won't be the case.

Having said that...Given all the talk regarding the direction & tone of this thing it's hard to see how anything resembling either the Surfer or Galactus would fit into it. If they baulked at using a giant armoured Space God for Story's flicks, they sure as hell aint gonna use one for the 'grounded' efforts here.
 
I remember when a Silver-Surfer film was being discussed around 2008 a Fox exec. specifically said that if they made such a movie it would extend their FF rights. I don't know the exact chain of events, but I'd be willing to bet at this moment the rights are linked.

And if they're not, expect Fox to include some reference / images in the upcoming film to hold on to those rights, so there's absolutely no point in getting your hopes up under any circumstances.
 
Based on Feige's recent quote about crossovers with characters not in their possession:

My answer to that question has always been the same, which is when I started at Marvel 14 years ago the notion of us becoming our own studio, becoming more successful than other studios doing this, and bringing The Avengers to the screen, would have seemed like the pipe dream of all pipe dreams. And because we are sitting here talking because this has all happened, I’m not going to rule out anything. It has been unbelievable – the Marvel experience for me in particular over the years, so anything’s possible. But I would say for the immediate future, Fox is very busy building their X-Men universe and redoing the Fantastic Four universe. Sony is well underway with their Spider-Man plans. And we clearly have a long-term vision for the cinematic universe. And thankfully have so many characters and so many possibilities that we don’t find ourselves in a position going ‘Will we ever get these other characters in here because we don’t know what to do.’ There’s lots to do.
I think it's pretty clear that Marvel is very dead set on moving on without their heavy hitters for the near term. They don't expect to get Spidey and the FF back anytime soon and if they do it'll be a windfall ala Daredevil.

The only way FF goes home is if the Tranktastic Four bombs badly. If it pulls in numbers similar to the first two then Fox will cling to these rights yet. That's an uncomfortable outcome to me and here's my feeling on it:

If Trank and co. actually pull a truly amazing film out of their hats, then let's face it - Fox deserves to keep the franchise. FF intertwined with the awesomeness of the MCU of course would be the best result but the FF done well is better than them being relegated to ignominy. Frankly, I just want to see a great FF film at this point (even if it means waiting for Redbox - I still haven't seen DOFP for various reasons - among them my disgust at the state of the FF under Fox's stewardship).

At that hypothetical point where the FF are restored to their proper glory with Fox, Marvel might even reevaluate their collaborations with them for some potentially bigger stories down the road. A big if of course and again if Fox is in fact able to right the ship on both properties in their possession.

For many of us though, all the news surrounding this project indicates the opposite of all of that happening. I'm very anxious to see what (if anything) gets revealed at Comic-Con but I haven't liked anything I've heard about this reboot - with the possible recent exception being all the positive buzz surrounding Kebbell's performance in DOPOTA.

But here's the thing - if this film is anything short of amazing - and I mean AMAZING as in critics don't have a leg to stand on if they attempt to make merciless jabs at the fact that this film is called the Fantastic Four the way they did the first two times (and the way they've done with the Amazing Spider-Man movies) - if it is anything short of FANTASTIC - why would true fans even think of supporting it? What is Fox bringing to the table other than denying fans the opportunity to see a more epic Marvel Universe on the big screen?

And the recent reports that Fox is still "trying to figure out what they are doing" with the movie and what direction they are going to go with it smacks of nothing more than playing keep away with these film rights. And if that is really true? Well IMO that is *****e-baggery at it's finest. Or just plain full on incompetence (take your pick).

If the FF film is average, mediocre, half way decent, "not as bad as the last two", etc. etc. that is not nearly good enough. Then as fans we need to try and help make sure that it bombs and bombs hard. Hard enough to send a message. Do not support it in any way shape or form because a mediocre FF film that keeps the first family in the hands of Fox for another seven years is the worst possible outcome.

This film either needs to be mind blowingly awesome or be a box office dud of epic proportions. There is no middle ground here.
 
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Spot on, Ragnaroknroll. This is true for any product that gathers an overwhelmingly negative expectation before its official release, not just movies. Unless that product is absolutely incredible, people will be disappointed, in part due to sticking to the image they previously formed about that product, and in part because they were right in claiming it would be a failure. It's a tough situation to get out of, which requires either a mind-blowing marketing plan (which evidently is not the case here) or top level quality (also doubtful due to production problems), only to prevent it from being a complete failure.

I don't see Fantastic Four becoming a smashing success either way, as it has two big factors working against it - the fact Fox has done little to spread awareness about it even though we're one year from release, and that those who do know about it are expecting little for the most part. Trank would have to be a miracle worker to guarantee a financial success.
 
"Fox is very busy building their X-Men universe and redoing the Fantastic Four universe. Sony is well underway with their Spider-Man plans. And we clearly have a long-term vision for the cinematic universe. And thankfully have so many characters and so many possibilities that we don’t find ourselves in a position going ‘Will we ever get these other characters in here because we don’t know what to do.’ There’s lots to do. " Kevin Feige~

Thank you Kev! ^^^

Just needed this reminder that if Fox continues to play around with this franchise it's no sweat off my back or money out of my pocket.

GOTG is shaping up to be a good if not better replacement in the MCU. And with Antman coming up we've got plenty of Doctors and geniuses in the lineup already.

So if this comes down to Fox being jackasses by holding out to the very end of the reseted contract end date then so be it.
 
Spot on, Ragnaroknroll. This is true for any product that gathers an overwhelmingly negative expectation before its official release, not just movies. Unless that product is absolutely incredible, people will be disappointed, in part due to sticking to the image they previously formed about that product, and in part because they were right in claiming it would be a failure. It's a tough situation to get out of, which requires either a mind-blowing marketing plan (which evidently is not the case here) or top level quality (also doubtful due to production problems), only to prevent it from being a complete failure.

I don't see Fantastic Four becoming a smashing success either way, as it has two big factors working against it - the fact Fox has done little to spread awareness about it even though we're one year from release, and that those who do know about it are expecting little for the most part. Trank would have to be a miracle worker to guarantee a financial success.

Well the way people gush about Trank after his one and only found footage film, they apparently seem to believe he's a miracle worker. "I trust Josh Trank" this, "Josh Trank is a great director" that, "Josh Trank's 'vision'", etc. etc. I'm like WTF? Who died and made him Kubrick?
 
Thank you Kev! ^^^

Just needed this reminder that if Fox continues to play around with this franchise it's no sweat off my back or money out of my pocket.

GOTG is shaping up to be a good if not better replacement in the MCU. And with Antman coming up we've got plenty of Doctors and geniuses in the lineup already.

So if this comes down to Fox being jackasses by holding out to the very end of the reseted contract end date then so be it.

You know you're exactly right. As a fan of the FF this whole situation is very ulcer-inducing but as a fan of the MCU there's plenty to be chipper about. They just announced 5 new films in the pipeline and I'm dying to know what they are.

GOTG is getting tremendous positive buzz. It really sounds like Gunn hit it out of the park. Give me Celestials, Kree, Thanos, Nova Corps, Adam Warlock etc. and I'm pretty happy. It would have been cool to have the Big G in there but whatevs. I like Willie's thought that if he ever does get introduced way way late in the game it would actually enhance his threat level and provide some cool context.

The future of Ant-Man seems shakey right now but I was encouraged by Feige's recent comments. It remains to be seen how much Edgar Wright's plan impacts things but there certainly is the potential to introduce a cool family element with Scott/Cassie Lang etc. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes down.
 
You know you're exactly right. As a fan of the FF this whole situation is very ulcer-inducing but as a fan of the MCU there's plenty to be chipper about. They just announced 5 new films in the pipeline and I'm dying to know what they are.

GOTG is getting tremendous positive buzz. It really sounds like Gunn hit it out of the park. Give me Celestials, Kree, Thanos, Nova Corps, Adam Warlock etc. and I'm pretty happy. It would have been cool to have the Big G in there but whatevs. I like Willie's thought that if he ever does get introduced way way late in the game it would actually enhance his threat level and provide some cool context.

The future of Ant-Man seems shakey right now but I was encouraged by Feige's recent comments. It remains to be seen how much Edgar Wright's plan impacts things but there certainly is the potential to introduce a cool family element with Scott/Cassie Lang etc. It will be interesting to see how it all shakes down.

Speaking of new release dates, I really wish Marvel could've made their July 2017 date before July 14th which is the supposed date of this crappy reboots sequel. (Which is just trolling anyway)

But hopefully Wonder Women will release on that date or at least the week before, ultimately crushing this franchise permanently if they're too stubborn (stupid) to move it.
 
I want to see Doom and the Avengers/Iron Man/F4 fight :(

Why oh why does Doom have to be automatically linked in the F4 contract? He's big enough of a character that he should have been his own contract! Sorry I just want Doom home and DONE RIGHT!
 
Speaking of new release dates, I really wish Marvel could've made their July 2017 date before July 14th which is the supposed date of this crappy reboots sequel. (Which is just trolling anyway)

But hopefully Wonder Women will release on that date or at least the week before, ultimately crushing this franchise permanently if they're too stubborn (stupid) to move it.

Any release dates this far out are subject to change, but yeah, Marvel announcing a flick for that same sequel date would have been a nice little 'shot across the bow'.
 
Any release dates this far out are subject to change, but yeah, Marvel announcing a flick for that same sequel date would have been a nice little 'shot across the bow'.


. . . but not announcing something will show how they scoff at the idea that Fox will even make a sequel. :cwink:
 
Disney not concerned about that sequel. Anybody really believe that crap will get made. Disney already got a Pixar film that will kill the reboot film opening weekend in 2015 anyways. Parents will take the kids to see the Pixar joint, the GA won't give two damns about a FF reboot like they do most comic book reboots and FF fans like me will wait till it debuts on Redbox. Everyone else will see it out of curiosity because they really are looking forward to it or want to see how bad it really is.
 
Has a date been set for Incredibles 2? It being given the same release date as the FF sequel , now that would really be a 'shot across the bows'.
 
I seriously doubt Disney will swap one Pixar movie for another, given that Incredibles 2 almost certainly won't be done yet.
 
I seriously doubt Disney will swap one Pixar movie for another, given that Incredibles 2 almost certainly won't be done yet.

I believe he's talking about July 14, 2017 though, not next June. A mid credit short feat. the Incredible's would prove more damaging to this reboot's already poor reputation though.
 
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Disney not concerned about that sequel. Anybody really believe that crap will get made. Disney already got a Pixar film that will kill the reboot film opening weekend in 2015 anyways. Parents will take the kids to see the Pixar joint, the GA won't give two damns about a FF reboot like they do most comic book reboots and FF fans like me will wait till it debuts on Redbox. Everyone else will see it out of curiosity because they really are looking forward to it or want to see how bad it really is.

Agreed, this is more about Fox than about Disney. They are the ones to put this head to head with a Pixar film, telling you they really don't care about this film. As I've said before, it's the same thing Warner did with Jonah Hex.

I would be surprised if OW is over 30M. Fox will kill this film and take a write off on the loss.
 
Well the way people gush about Trank after his one and only found footage film, they apparently seem to believe he's a miracle worker. "I trust Josh Trank" this, "Josh Trank is a great director" that, "Josh Trank's 'vision'", etc. etc. I'm like WTF? Who died and made him Kubrick?

Yes but Kubrick didn't have MBJ. Trank + MBJ = awesome super-hit.
 
A grounded movie with Silver Surfer?

Not likely but then this is FOX and bastardizing Marvel characters is like an art form to them so maybe.

There are ways to ground the Silver Surfer. I've never been bothered with a grounded take on the FF. The word that has me worried is, "gritty." I don't want some incredibly dark take on what's otherwise a very lighthearted series. Trying to explain the Silver Surfer to the audience in a way that makes sense is one thing. Making the Silver Surfer this grizzled, scowling antihero is something which I never hope to see in my lifetime.
 
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