The Avengers The Official 'Hulk in Avengers' thread. - Part 7

[Gamma Goliath]

the people who say TIH hulk's strength wasn't linked to his anger shouldv'e payed more attention, you can clearly see his eyes flicker and glow brighter when he over powered the sonic cannons, and when he was pinned against the wall by abomy.

 

[FrostBite]

the people who say TIH hulk's strength wasn't linked to his anger shouldv'e payed more attention, you can clearly see his eyes flicker and glow brighter when he over powered the sonic cannons, and when he was pinned against the wall by abomy.

Even without that, you can see the change in his demeanor, as Abomination beats on him he gets into this "Ugh, you kidding me? How am I going to do this?" rolling his eyes state, as soon as he's pinned fight-or-flight kicks in and all Hulk breaks loose.

Not to mention the "strongest one there is" almost killing Abomination moment.

 

[Spade]

I liked the "Incredible" look for a while. What makes it age horribly is how taut his skin is. It gives him the lean and vascular appearance some modern artists prefer, but since so few real people outside of the bodybuilding community have zero percent body fat, it sends off flags in my head that I'm looking at CGI. Well, more than a giant green muscular man does to begin with. He was also too specular. That perpetual gloss of modern video games doesn't look right paired with live action footage.

Two things sell me on Ruffalo's Hulk. Firstly, Ruffalo kind of looks like the Kirby Hulk. Not trying to diss the man, it's just true. He has the gangly hair, the large forehead, and the broad lips. Tweak his features and you get a Hulk- slightly Neanderthal, yet still leading man material. The second is ILM's attention to detail. They didn't miss the little things, like dust clinging to his follicles or the appropriate shading under different light sources. Hulk's a bit too olive and weightless in some of the clips I've seen. Aside from that, though, this is still the best attempt at a CG Hulk so far.

 

[FrostBite]

I liked the "Incredible" look for a while. What makes it age horribly is how taut his skin is. It gives him the lean and vascular appearance some modern artists prefer, but since so few real people outside of the bodybuilding community have zero percent body fat, it sends off flags in my head that I'm looking at CGI. Well, more than a giant green muscular man does to begin with. He was also too specular. That perpetual gloss of modern video games doesn't look right paired with live action footage.

Two things sell me on Ruffalo's Hulk. Firstly, Ruffalo kind of looks like the Kirby Hulk. Not trying to diss the man, it's just true. He has the gangly hair, the large forehead, and the broad lips. Tweak his features and you get a Hulk- slightly Neanderthal, yet still leading man material. The second is ILM's attention to detail. They didn't miss the little things, like dust clinging to his follicles or the appropriate shading under different light sources. Hulk's a bit too olive and weightless in some of the clips I've seen. Aside from that, though, this is still the best attempt at a CG Hulk so far.

I don't think the taut skin does. Mainly because (and, I'm part of bodybuilding/athletic community, so, I guess I am biased and already falling into what you just said t I'm no where near under 10%, and I still have striations in my chest and my arms look like spider-webs are flowing down them. Hulk should too. It's really not out of the realm of reality that a crazed monster produced from rage and the force of a gamma-bomb/radiation/whatever that is supposed to be a "super" version of physicality would have those traits, you know? He's supposed to be strong enough to hand gods their fair share. Pretty sure he'd have that "power" look. I'm kind of sad they didn't implement some of it into the new design (kind of, it's not needed since this is all make believe anyway).

But the sheen was definitely where it ages. The skin in ILMs first attempt in 2003 is where it fails too. In the first it looks like silly puddy, the second looks... gross. Like, oily/glossy. I guess we could make the argument for super sweat glands... but I'd rather not go that far.

In the end I liked them all, but dang if Ruffalo doesn't have the look and if ILMs latest isn't a masterpiece.

 

[Lantern Venom]

I think the Avengers' Hulk has the best-looking body. He has good symmetry and thickness in the muscles, but with more definition than the '03 Hulk.

I'm still not a fan of Hulk looking like the actor portraying Banner, but at least he has a more prominent brow this time.

 

[BigThor]

TIH Hulk is in no way too skinny. He's just not got the "power-lifter" physique. You know what? That makes more sense to the Hulk's abilities than a stocky power-lifter anyway. There's a difference between strength and power (i.e. the power it'd take to jump 3-freaking-miles). And explosive athletes tend to look more like TIH (albeit not as inhumanly cut) than our old dear Hulk. Seeing as I am no purist, that's okay with me. Ironically Feige's "this is an older Hulk" makes a lot of sense. Banner's gotten "thicker" (no I'm not calling Ruffalo fat, but compared to puny Norton, he's a bigger guy) with age and the Hulk looks softer, but has also grown bigger in mass. He also uses far more of his abilities (such as the leaping) due to being more in-tune with his powers.

I love TIH's take, honestly. A man so packed with muscle that his skin stretches and bounds tightly against him his metabolism transforming every inch of his framework into lean powerful mass. Striations are cut into every part of him, and as you watch his movements you see them pulse and bend with every step and roar. It may not be the most realistic CG (only the Avengers Hulk looks "real" to me, most CG doesn't), but it's sure impressive. It's different, but it makes sense and accentuates his power to me all the more.

Agreed

 

[Mjölnir]

Couldn't have said it better, and I've tried at least 300 times. The Banner portrayals thus far have used the repressed emotions angle to a fault. Bixby is the gold standard in that regard because his Banner simply had more range.

He could still flirt, joke, be charismatic. He felt like a real, tangible person with a problem that made the audience care. This was all in the Pilot, which is what I base the comparisons on. Until a solo Hulk film accomplishes that, it still won't work on a higher level regardless of the quality of the f/x.

Banner did show some similar emotions in TIH but if you start getting a flirty and joking Banner then you're taking away from that you're building up a character that's living in constant fear and has to put a strain on his emotions to keep the monster trapped.

The Bixby character was from a time when it would never have worked to have a darker character on TV like that so we got a more light hearted Hulk story. Now we got someone that was on the edge of killing himself and we move on to some very big character development into the Avengers.

 

[Vulklin]

Not gonna lie, I liked all three and I bet Ruffalo will be better than Norton when I see Avengers, but I'm a huge fan of Norton and a huge fan of The Incredible Hulk. I get the complaints of the "surfer"-like look of Hulk in TIH, but I enjoyed everything about the film.

Hulk would've been a great movie with the Hyde/Jekyll idea...although the idea of Banner fighting his father wasn't needed; Hulk vs the military would've been perfectly fine.



Lol.

Just....lol.

Did you watch The Incredible Hulk?

Yes I watched it and its the worst comic book movie I have seen apart from Batman and Robin

 

[Obi-Ron]

Now you're just getting nasty.

 

[BigThor]

Now you're just getting nasty.

It's a good movie in my opinion, I don't care how many people decide to s*** on it because of Avengers Hulk it's still going to be good in my books.

 

[Hmarrs]

Yes I watched it and its the worst comic book movie I have seen apart from Batman and Robin

I know I wrote alot but please don't skip if you care about the Hulk.

You know I think when it came out people just wanted to like it so much that they tried to convince themselves that it was really good.
While it wasn't the worst I just could not no matter how hard I tried and I tried very hard see past the CG.
The story was engh as was Ang Lee's Hulk however there were some scenes in Angs version that really took me back.
The problem with the Hulk is that his story is so simple that they keep complicating it.It's as if they say to themselves"No it can't be that simple" and end up overthinking it.
It's a simple Jekyll and Hide story that's it.
Everyone is stuck on the Bill Bixby take when they should be looking for the source that Bill Bixby took from which was obviously Jekyll and Hyde.
However by going to Bixby it's like getting a photo copy of a photo copy.
What made Bixby stand out in his take was that.He was a person that cared he cared about other people over himself.Even though he was walking around the world for a cure he couldn't help but put other people before himself that's what the show was about.That's what made him a hero and so endering was his selflessness.
However you Bana and Nortons take basically being all about them and their issue.
It's like Waaa waa waaa sombody get either of these guys a pacifier please.
People care about people who care about people.
He cared for the person so much in every episode that you think ok but who is caring about you so you wind up caring about the guy yourself.

Here is this guy with all these issue's and he is not even thinking of himself.
He was calm,patient,kind,generous,caring,compassionete,endering,even charming at times.
Do you see any of this in Bana or Norton????No both were cold with no depth or warmth so basically who gives a crap and he is only good as a supporting character.There were times that looked Norton hinted toward it but came up short.
Also all of these above virtues stands to amplfy the Hulk character as it is in stark contrast to the Hulk Smashing,Breaking Screaming,Roaring,Agressive however they were smart enough to show that side of the Monster when he was calm.Thus linking Banner and him.
The Monster is to be linked to Banner not Banner to the monster.
Even in looks contrast was and is everything.

Bixby was a charming looking person however Ferrigno in make-u was somthing else.
Contrast in personality,character,looks ,stregnth in everything was and is the key both in the comics and the T.V show,however in the movies they kept trying to mesh the two together thus destroying the entire premis of the character deffeating your whole perpose.
Even in the begging he was banner during the day and Hulk at night.
Banner and Hulk need to played like night and day revealing a mystery between dusk and dawn that's what made the show such a sucess.

There were times you didn't know who you had more comappsion for Banner or the Hulk.Bill and Lou clinched it and made you care.Even Lou with his facial expressions there was an episode I want to say it was the second one when he was crying as the Hulk.They keep trying to play the hulk in one stage meshing the two characters so you get a Hulk/Banner or
a Banner/Hulk the Hulk is to played in Four stages making the character 4 dimensional almost with 4 personnas.
1.Banner 2. Banner/Hulk 3.Hulk 4.Hulk/Banner.Each stage has his own personna and personality.You can only mesh acts 2 and 4.a good example of this was the Incredible Hulk Promethious.It was an episode where Banner and Hulk were stuck in mid transformation.Watch it.The acting was amazing.

Again:
Banner and Hulk need to played like night and day revealing a mystery between dusk and dawn that's what made the show such a sucess.

 

[El Payaso]

the people who say TIH hulk's strength wasn't linked to his anger shouldv'e payed more attention, you can clearly see his eyes flicker and glow brighter when he over powered the sonic cannons, and when he was pinned against the wall by abomy.

Ah yes, you're right. I've always wondered what program did they use for that green eye glow... Paint?

Banner did show some similar emotions in TIH but if you start getting a flirty and joking Banner then you're taking away from that you're building up a character that's living in constant fear and has to put a strain on his emotions to keep the monster trapped.

That was a bummer for me. The 'funny' Banner. jokes about purple pants or not being able to have sex. I don't get the necessity of having jokes peppered all over when they're not necessary. But if the joke goes at the expense of the character's dignity then it makes me sick.

The Bixby character was from a time when it would never have worked to have a darker character on TV like that so we got a more light hearted Hulk story. Now we got someone that was on the edge of killing himself and we move on to some very big character development into the Avengers.

Even so, he was about to commit suicide once he thought the Hulk had killed a man. "This is not suicide, this is an execution."

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Ah yes, you're right. I've always wondered what program did they use for that green eye glow... Paint?

 

[Doc Samson]

Banner did show some similar emotions in TIH but if you start getting a flirty and joking Banner then you're taking away from that you're building up a character that's living in constant fear and has to put a strain on his emotions to keep the monster trapped.

The Bixby character was from a time when it would never have worked to have a darker character on TV like that so we got a more light hearted Hulk story. Now we got someone that was on the edge of killing himself and we move on to some very big character development into the Avengers.

I disagree. Bixby's Banner was darker to me than either of the previous two. He was shown as having anger problems long before his experiment. In fact he came across as more unhinged because of what I said, he showed more emotion. Bixby himself was a very intense individual prone to outbursts of anger, he definitely sold the distress without having to be a bore. Its all in the eyes.

By the way, when I mention flirting or joking, it made him more interesting and well rounded, but he and Elaina never even touched each other sexually once, and their relationship still was more believable than anything in the films. I actually think its one of the most convincing relationships in a comic based property ever, all achieved without a single kiss. I enjoy Bana and love Norton, but neither was interesting, dark or particularly intense in comparison to Bill. Not even close.

Ruffalo speaks of his Banner's relationship with Stark, and I guess that its partially why people have warmed to his portrayal. He's getting to show depth, his ability to help other people, and reminds the audience that this guy was an accomplished professional at one point in his life. He really is a human with a full range of emotions. Sounds like the right approach so that we're engaged with Banner first, not just marking time for the Hulk.

 

[Gamma Ra]

I was was just recalling how many years ago there was some debate on this board about whether Hulk would look silly being able to speak in a live action film. I think even Stan Lee once held this opinion too. Hulk has said his famous "Puny human" line in the 2003 film as well as his calling cards "Hulk Smash" "Leave me alone" and "Betty" lines in the 2008 film. IMO...those were some of the best scenes.

I wonder with Hulk being a bit more vocal in the Avengers movie if the same posters will feel the same way, which is something I never understood considering many weird looking creatures are able to speak in films?

 

[terry78]

Apparently it was the same reasoning as to why Spider-Man rarely spoke.

 

[Doc Samson]

I was was just recalling how many years ago there was some debate on this board about whether Hulk would look silly being able to speak in a live action film. I think even Stan Lee once held this opinion too. Hulk has said his famous "Puny human" line in the 2003 film as well as his calling cards "Hulk Smash" "Leave me alone" and "Betty" lines in the 2008 film.

I wonder with Hulk being a bit more vocal in the Avengers movie if the same posters will feel the same way, which is something I never understood considering many weird looking creatures are able to speak in films?

TBH, I was one of those hesitant about it, still am depending on how frequent.

 

[terry78]

Well, in EMH he doesn't constantly talk, just making one-liners and being somewhat of a grouchy mother****er when someone does talk to him. He's pretty quiet.

 

[Drummerdude7]

Curious question:

If there are any posters who are averse to Hulk speaking, could you explain why?

Not looking for any battles...I'm simply curious to understand the other side of the fence

 

[Gamma Ra]

Apparently it was the same reasoning as to why Spider-Man rarely spoke.

I never heard this before. What was it?

TBH, I was one of those hesitant about it, still am depending on how frequent.

It's an honest assessment...I'm just curious what it will be after the movie is seen. I haven't seen any complaints from the GA who has seen it so far.

 

[terry78]

^They claimed it would just be weird having someone in a mask or with non-human looking constantly carrying on conversations. Treating them more as a special effect. I noticed that Iron Man rarely spoke in the first one when he goes on his first mission to the Middle East.

 

[Doc Samson]

Curious question:

If there are any posters who are averse to Hulk speaking, could you explain why?

Not looking for any battles...I'm simply curious to understand the other side of the fence

Personally I'm of the mind that everything in comics don't necessarily translate. IMO, if he were to talk, just let him talk, it doesn't have to be constantly in third person, EMH handles that well and I wouldn't be opposed to that. But the incessant third person routine would become grating to me.

 

[Gamma Ra]

Well, in EMH he doesn't constantly talk, just making one-liners and being somewhat of a grouchy mother****er when someone does talk to him. He's pretty quiet.

When it comes to Hulk in the movies, and my constant references to what I like of him in the comic books, I'm only holding to the things that I think should be utilized that keep him true to who he is. Hulk in any incarnation is not much of a talker except maybe his Mr. Fixit, Merged/Professor and Banner Hulk versions. TheEMH is my favorite incarnation called Gravage by fans and Green Scar in the comic books, he's not a unique Hulk. He's the same as in the comics today. Not that you don't know that.

 

[Drummerdude7]

Personally I'm of the mind that everything in comics don't necessarily translate. IMO, if he were to talk, just let him talk, it doesn't have to be constantly in third person, EMH handles that well and I wouldn't be opposed to that. But the incessant third person routine would become grating to me.

I agree. I love EMH hulk...talks in first person but still has a brutish and rugged mentality...not the sharpest tool in the shed but far from a stupid monster.

 

[Gamma Ra]

^They claimed it would just be weird having someone in a mask or with non-human looking constantly carrying on conversations. Treating them more as a special effect. I noticed that Iron Man rarely spoke in the first one when he goes on his first mission to the Middle East.

OK, but they must have threw the idea out the window too because he spoke a lot in Spider-Man 2 and 3.

This is why we need more Joss Whedons directing these types of films.