The Dark Knight The Rachel Dawes thread

[NewYorkSpider]

Maggie did a tremendous job as Rachel. I prefer her over Holmes.

I stayed spoiler free for this movie and Rachel dying surprised the hell out of me. Never saw it coming.

 

[Dagoods]

QUESTION regarding her death in the movie...

DID the JOKER give BATMAN the wrong address of her location on purpose? As he was leaving the police station, he said he was going to look for RACHEL but instead ends up rescuing Mr. Dent...

 

[Dagoods]

QUESTION regarding her death in the movie...

DID the JOKER give BATMAN the wrong address of her location on purpose? As he was leaving the police station, he said he was going to look for RACHEL but instead ends up rescuing Mr. Dent...

 

[NewYorkSpider]

He switched the locations on purpose.

 

[DaRkVeNgeanCe]

Maggie was always going to be better than Katie, that was fact!

 

[Raiden]

He switched the locations on purpose.

Yeah, Joker did that because he knew he'd try to save Rachel first (he saw that Batman had an affection for Rachel because he saved her at the party, I think). It was a cruel joke, but very appropriate for Joker. I think it was also because Joker had a plan for Dent to survive, so he can become Two Face.

 

[terry78]

Though it would have been very Batman-like for him to end up actually saving her because he deduced that he would switch addresses, the way it did happen makes it a little more tragic and "Gwen Stacy-ish".

 

[Bim]

Count me in among those dissapointed with Maggie... i thought she would do a lot better than Katie, but i found Katie more believable as annoying Rachel than Maggie

I'm just going to believe that this character was badly written or something, if two actresses just couldnt nail it in my book

 

[NewYorkSpider]

Yeah, Joker did that because he knew he'd try to save Rachel first (he saw that Batman had an affection for Rachel because he saved her at the party, I think). It was a cruel joke, but very appropriate for Joker. I think it was also because Joker had a plan for Dent to survive, so he can become Two Face.

I think Joker knew that Batman would save Dent, but Gordon and the police would fail in saving Rachel. This would send Dent into madness and blame Batman. Then it would send Gotham out of control.

 

[batmaluco]

Maggie was great.

 

[JP]

She was fantastic.

 

[honest george]

I was surprised at how much empathy I had for the character in this film. The new actress seemed like a real person and not a "movie star" actress or Dawsen's Creek underwear model. I was upset to see her get "offed" the way she did.

 

[Raiden]

Count me in among those dissapointed with Maggie... i thought she would do a lot better than Katie, but i found Katie more believable as annoying Rachel than Maggie

I'm just going to believe that this character was badly written or something, if two actresses just couldnt nail it in my book

Rachel was annoying in BB, when she lectured to Wayne, but she wasn't annoying in TDK.

 

[the_monk]

I thought Maggie did a decent job acting-wise. However, and I know this is shallow, the one criticism I have of the cinematography relates to Maggie. I know she doesn't look that bad in real life. She looked really bad in a bunch of scenes. The only time I thought she looked decent was in the interrogation scene with Lau. At the party, she was lit horribly. It's very strange.

 

[Crook]

Light isn't the issue there.

But yeah, she was decent. Still leagues above Katie, but wasn't all that necessary in the overall scheme of things, imo. Her only true breakout moment was when she was about to die. Powerful acting there accompanied by some great and tense music.

 

[Johnny Drama]

I am watching Batman Begins now. I really don't see what the Katie hate is about. I love Maggie and I favor her performance, but Katie wasn't terrible (and she IS hotter than Maggie)

 

[Johnny Drama]

I am watching Batman Begins now. I really don't see what the Katie hate is about. I love Maggie and I favor her performance, but Katie wasn't terrible (and she IS hotter than Maggie)

 

[David Rice]

I am watching Batman Begins now. I really don't see what the Katie hate is about. I love Maggie and I favor her performance, but Katie wasn't terrible (and she IS hotter than Maggie)

Thank you.

 

[Marx]

I prefer Maggie...it's a shame she wasn't cast in BB.

 

[gooner_88]

To be honest I couldn't stand either of them and I'm thankful the a quite unnecessary character has been done away with.

Beckinsale as Selina please!!!

t:

 

[Heretic]

This Katie hate has got to be some weird hate for teen drama queens or something...I dont think she did any worse in the role than maggie did. In fact, I hardly bought Maggies performance at all.. That "Jim Gordons a friend" line was not well delivered.

You can blame the fact that Maggie was having to pretend to be a character that was started by a bad actress, but Maggie wasnt really that good. Katie wasnt winning any awards either, but she was far and away better looking...and I think that Katie fits the part she was given better...

 

[The Guard]

Maggie wasn't that good, but the role wasn't either. It's just not that interesting a character. Rachel was written with far more depth and relevance in BATMAN BEGINS.

 

[I Am The Knight]

This Katie hate has got to be some weird hate for teen drama queens or something...I dont think she did any worse in the role than maggie did. In fact, I hardly bought Maggies performance at all.. That "Jim Gordons a friend" line was not well delivered.

You can blame the fact that Maggie was having to pretend to be a character that was started by a bad actress, but Maggie wasnt really that good. Katie wasnt winning any awards either, but she was far and away better looking...and I think that Katie fits the part she was given better...

I agree. That was the moment where I felt she was "acting."

But overall, she acted leagues around Holmes, even if the character had less to do in this movie than in BB.

 

[DACrowe]

I like the casting of Maggie because she is a more believable Assistant DA. I believe her as a woman in that position more. The problem is she only has two short scenes to play that part (the opening courtroom scene for her character and the interrogation scene of Lau). Otherwise she is more of a foil between Bruce and Dent and a catalyst for Harvey to go over the edge beyond his facial scarring.

The only real scene that I thought let Maggie flex her acting muscles a little bit was the bomb scene. I thought she was very moving in her last conversation with Harvey and I do not think that Katie Holmes would have done nearly as well in that scene. Other then that though, there was nothing there that katie really couldn't handle. Especially as Rachel Dawes is more a catalyst in this movie and had a lot more to do in the first movie. I actually thought Rachel was an intergal player in BB and an important character to represent what Bruce gave up to be Batman and to connect him from his youth to his adulthood with someone other than Alfred.

For that reason I wish Katie Holmes had continued to play Rachel. I think Maggie played the part better while Katie was just passable/adequate (though hotter, not that that matters much in TDK), but it would be for continuity's sake. Rachel's death was sad in TDK but more for Harvey Dent imo. Though she was the same character with the same history in this movie, the fact that Bruce's complicated romance with her was set-up in the last film with Katie Holmes there is a disconnect for the viewer that it is played out here with another actress. Sure it is the same person, but you don't sense that history that was built in the first movie because it isn't the same face. Even if Holmes couldn't have done the death scene as well, the fact that it is a character we have known for two films that is getting killed off...I think it could have had a larger impact.

I wish Maggie had done both films and think she is an upgrade, but that is what I wish would have happened given the circumstances. I wonder why Katie REALLY didn't come back. I wonder if she just didn't want to play "the girl" again in a superhero movie (htough one of the better written ones) or it was Tom Cruse and his crazy cult forcing/brainwashing her not to do it. I don't know.

 

[I Am The Knight]

I'm positive it was Cruise's fault.