The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion & Speculation Thread - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 32

[Sharkboy]

That's the thing though: Batman ISN'T a symbol of hope. That's Superman.

That pretty much goes against everything in the first two films. Bruce started Batman as a symbol of inspiration and hope...as well as fear. What do you think is the whole point of Harvey Dent in the film. You need to eschew those preconceived notions of what you think a character is or what he should do, because in the context that Nolan has created...him being a symbol of hope, rallying the troops is perfectly appropriate. If you have an issue with it, you have an issue with the entire character that Nolan has created (which is perfectly fine) but don't pick things that don't line up with the comics and say it doesn't fit when it fits perfectly with the "MOVIE CHARACTER" as opposed to the "COMICS CHARACTER"

 

[Yurka]

"Memorable villain"

Probably will have about as much screen time as the girl who was Maroni's arm candy who everyone thought was Harley when she was announced.

 

[Boom]

This is going to be Anthony Michael Hall all over again.

 

[KalMart]

That's the thing though: Batman ISN'T a symbol of hope. That's Superman.

I think a point that these movies are making so far is that any true hero is ultimately a symbol of hope. Wayne himself said that he wants to inspire people....not just scare everyone. It's no longer just revenge etc... The methods may be different, but a lot of that depends on how they became heroes. Now...Bats will never be Superman....atop a hill smiling confidently in the sun, etc. It's more about the struggle with Batman, and maybe even sacrifice at the end. This Batman yearns for the day that the city won't need him...in a good way. The struggle is whether he'll be able to recognize it and let go...or will it have to take his life to happen?

This Batman may begin as an instrument of punishment...but end as, yes, a symbol of hope. Would that be so bad?

 

[Nevincer]

I was being quite serious. I thought we knew Black Mask was in this film to a certain degree.

I don't believe you. That's too many villains after Egghead and Crazy Quilt.

 

[TheDragonator]

Harvey was the symbol of hope. The whole thing about Bats and Harvey was that Batman never COULD be a symbol of hope, at least that's how I saw it as.

 

[Travesty]

This is going to be Anthony Michael Hall all over again.

I hear he played The Riddler.

 

[Sharkboy]

He looks like league of shadows member #7

 

[AnneFan]

I don't even know who on earth that actor is. *shrug*

Me either. "Until we find out, keep a lid on it."

 

[Nevincer]

This is going to be Anthony Michael Hall all over again.

"Memorable villain"

Probably will have about as much screen time as the girl who was Maroni's arm candy who everyone thought was Harley when she was announced.

Lol, pretty much. Didn't Alon Aboutboul (Dr. Pavel) already overhype and pretend he was some major villain? I guess he's focal to the plot in some sense, but he's still not a major player

 

[The_Raganork]

I don't believe you. That's too many villains after Egghead and Crazy Quilt.

well...I won't say anymore about it then.

 

[TangerineKnight]

Edit

 

[The Caped Knight]

That's the thing though: Batman ISN'T a symbol of hope. That's Superman.

Actually that's not true, to the people of Gotham Batman is a symbol that they both fear but also respect .

 

[Yurka]

Lol, pretty much. Didn't Alon Aboutboul (Dr. Pavel) already overhype and pretend he was some major villain? I guess he's focal to the plot in some sense, but he's still not a major player

Nah, Bilal confirmed he was Dr. Strange months ago.

 

[TheDragonator]

Hopefully it's just a minor cameo that he's making sound like a major villain. Otherwise we have 4 main villains.

 

[The_Raganork]

Lol, pretty much. Didn't Alon Aboutboul (Dr. Pavel) already overhype and pretend he was some major villain? I guess he's focal to the plot in some sense, but he's still not a major player

No...WE did.

His wife said he played a mad scientist. PEople went crazy thinking he was Hugo Strange or the Doctor that experimented on Bane.

 

[Sharkboy]

Harvey was the symbol of hope. The whole thing about Bats and Harvey was that Batman never COULD be a symbol of hope, at least that's how I saw it as.

And that's the point, you hit the nail on the head! The whole thing is about Batman being a symbol of hope, despite everything, despite what people think of him, despite him always being attached to fear, destruction, death (after TDK) his rise to BE a symbol of hope. I always thought this film will make bruce wayne AND Batman to be the symbol that harvey should have been but never could be.

 

[Mako]

So I take it nothing new on the news front?

 

[Sharkboy]

No it's Bane, Talia and Catwoman (to a degree) everyone else is minor leagues.

 

[Nevincer]

No...WE did.

His wife said he played a mad scientist. PEople went crazy thinking he was Hugo Strange or the Doctor that experimented on Bane.

Pfft... but he is Hugo Strange. Nolan wouldn't have created a foreign name as phoney as Leonid Pavel if it was his true identity

 

[KalMart]

Harvey was the symbol of hope. The whole thing about Bats and Harvey was that Batman never COULD be a symbol of hope, at least that's how I saw it as.

He couldn't at the time...not yet...and there was Harvey in the sweet spot. But that wasn't to be...now it's up to him....with Gordon, etc.

That 'never could' stuff was just the obligatory internal self-doubting struggle that antagonists go through in these things. Move along.

 

[the dmg]

This is going to be Anthony Michael Hall all over again.

It's fun to speculate.

 

[Just_Human]

He's The Penguin, obviously.

He sounds like a clown

 

[kvz5]

Nah, Bilal confirmed he was Dr. Strange months ago.

Oh you're right! I personally can't wait to see Clayface. Didn't Bilal spot him on set too?

 

[TheDragonator]

Actually that's not , to the people of Gotham is a that they both fear but also respect .

Respect =/= hope.

I've always been of the opinion that the people of Gotham view him like people view the X-Men. They're feared, even though they do good. People KNOW they do good, but they're more afraid than they respect them.