BvS The Unabashed SPOILER Thread. ENTER AT OWN RISK. - Part 5

[Sleiek]

EXACTLY.

Batman didn't stop fighting Superman just because their mothers have the same name.

It was for multiple reasons.

Hearing the name Martha triggered a lot for Bruce.

- It made him remember his own mother and that he was never able to save her. Which must drive him mad because as an adult, that mugger would have posed zero threat to the Batman.

- It humanized Superman. Made him not a God but a man. A man who had a mother. A man who wanted to do what Bruce always dreamed of being able to do: Protect his mother.

- It gave Bruce the chance to save Martha. Yes, it isn't his Martha, but it's symbolic to him. That's why he makes the promise to Superman that Martha will not die tonight. He is essentially saying, "Tonight won't end like that night in 1981. Tonight, I'll succeed and protect her."

It's a powerful scene.

-R

Damn it, reading those points really makes me want to like the movie more. I didn't think of all of those points.

 

[Robin91939]

Did anyone else find the party sequence to be incredibly lazy?

There was literally no danger at all for Bruce's espionage. Mercy just asks him what he's doing in the server room (Which for some reason is located right next to the kitchen, a kitchen that produces steam, steam which is kryptonite to servers) and he laughingly says he's going to the bathroom.

And Mercy never brings it up with Luthor, Bruce is never called on it.

There was no tension or fear of Bruce getting caught at all. He just walks into a server room that looks like a phone booth in a casino and plugs in his device.

Bruce stealing the Kryptonite was PART OF LEX'S PLAN.

Lex WANTED Bruce to get that information.

-R

 

[Primal Slayer]

I was not a fan of Lex knowing everyones identities.

Bruce stealing the Kryptonite was PART OF LEX'S PLAN.

Lex WANTED Bruce to get that information.

-R

Lex being 5 steps ahead of everyone just made things a bit boring.

 

[Sleiek]

I was not a fan of Lex knowing everyones identities.

But isn't he supposed to be one of the smartest people on the planet. Correct me if I am wrong!

This all sounds great, but none of it is in the movie.

This is what is so wrong with the movie (with the exception of it reminding him of his own mother). People are doing Snyder's work for him.

Really now? How can you be so sure that Snyder didn't intend it to be those things? Could be, could be not. It is all open to interpretation. This is one of the beauties of art and by the way he went to art school.

 

[Robin91939]

It was more than that. Superman was the victim, the boy Bruce in this situation, and Bruce was turning into the mugger that would cause Martha's death. That's what made Bruce throw the spear away in rage and disgust. He was becoming the very thing he hates.

This is a great point.

-R

 

[RadioSha]

As a person who gives this movie a 4.5/10, I will always defend the Martha connection. A very powerful scene between both heroes.

 

[LostSon88]

I was not a fan of Lex knowing everyones identities.

Does anyone honestly believe that a man like Lex Luthor with his resources wouldn't be able to figure out who Batman and Superman was?

I thought it was great that he knew.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Lex will be the one who brings the JL together.

****ing hell Snyder. SMDH

 

[RadioSha]

Lex will be the one who brings the JL together.

****ing hell Snyder. SMDH

Pisses the hell out of me.

You make the weakest, worst fleshed-out character in the entire DC movie universe the Nick Fury of this franchise. Damn you, Snyder.

 

[Rapunzel]

Whaaaa? Lex is not bringing the JL together! That's just nonsense!! He might be putting them on each other's scent, but he's no Nick Fury. He didn't come up with the idea or anything. If there's a nick fury-- it's flash.

 

[Wise]

Bruce stealing the Kryptonite was PART OF LEX'S PLAN.

Lex WANTED Bruce to get that information.

-R

How does that matter though? The audience don't know that, so it's not an excuse to make it a boring scene. In fact making it harder would make the twist that it's part of Luthor's plan more shocking.

Making it that easy kind of makes Batman look like a dumb rube.

 

[Rapunzel]

And on the Martha thing, I was okay with that plot....but dangit, the way Jeffery dean Morgan said Martha in that montage sounded like "Marla" Annoyed the heck outta me.

 

[Primal Slayer]

But isn't he supposed to be one of the smartest people on the planet. Correct me if I am wrong!

What does that have to do with anything? Bruce is suppose to be the worlds greatest detective, Superman the most powerful man on the planet. Yet neither of them really showcased either of their greatest skills that much. Bruce got punked by Luthor, Supes couldn't even detect anything wrong in the courthouse, those two were heavily flawed, so why not Lex?

Does anyone honestly believe that a man like Lex Luthor with his resources wouldn't be able to figure out who Batman and Superman was?

I thought it was great that he knew.

I thought it was to much for him to know Bruce Wayne was Bats, Clark/Superman, Diana was Wonder Woman, and Apocalypse was coming. Especially when he has had no encounters with ANY of them that we know of before this film, it's just a waste for him to know right off the bat imo.

 

[The Guard]

Pisses the hell out of me.

You make the weakest, worst fleshed-out character in the entire DC movie universe the Nick Fury of this franchise. Damn you, Snyder.

The hell?

 

[The Guard]

It's almost like Luthor has resources beyond the norm...

 

[Wise]

Whaaaa? Lex is not bringing the JL together! That's just nonsense!! He might be putting them on each other's scent, but he's no Nick Fury. He didn't come up with the idea or anything. If there's a nick fury-- it's flash.

He did design some snazzy logos for them though.

 

[redhawk23]

Lex knows that Batman is tracking his men who are looking for the Kryptonite. And Lex knows that Bruce Wayne and Batman are the same person.

Why else would Batman be looking for the Kryptonite if not to avenge the deaths of countless Wayne Enterprise employees? Lex even twists the knife more by sending the letters on Wallace's behalf (without his knowledge).

-R

Its not as if the Wayne building was the only one destroyed by the Zod fight.

 

[Clark-Kent]

I feel currently that Lex just plain did not work. Forget the motivation for why he is against Superman. Did not need Martha kidnapped and the "countdown" timer for drama in order to have them face off. Did not even need Lois taken to get them to square off. Batman and Superman could have squared off without Lex at all. He said not to shine the light, and Batman did. They had enough motivations that could have been worked out between them, without Lex needing to do THAT much.

Lex should have been responsible for Doomsday, in order to destroy Superman. The rest I didn't feel made a ton of sense. The whole kryptonite spear with Lois throwing it in the water, then going back, then getting stuck.... liiikke? Kind of messy mixed bag towards the end is how I'm feeling at moment. I did like a lot of the first hour or so of the movie, and had higher hopes at that time. It had some unnecessary choices though imho. I didn't think I'd be disappointed but at same time feel the actors were spot on very weird to feel that

 

[redhawk23]

I was not a fan of Lex knowing everyones identities.



Lex being 5 steps ahead of everyone just made things a bit boring.

Particularly because he didn't really have much of a motive for anything. Much of Lex's traditional role and reasoning for hating Superman was given to Bruce.

 

[The Guard]

No, he had the same issues. Remember his defense talk?

 

[Donner]

I'm just wondering if anyone other than hardcore fans could figure any of this out? I get that all comic book movies are supposed to be pleasing for the fans and the general audience, but this movie definitely confuses more than it pleases. I feel like it was made for the hardcores and the people who turn off their brains completely. And everyone in the middle is going "huh?"

The general audience, from what I gather, just didn't get it.

Was going for all of this secret imagery (like in Bruce's nightmare scenes) really worth the confusion?

 

[Sleiek]

What does that have to do with anything? Bruce is suppose to be the worlds greatest detective, Superman the most powerful man on the planet. Yet neither of them really showcased either of their greatest skills that much. Bruce got punked by Luthor, Supes couldn't even detect anything wrong in the courthouse, those two were heavily flawed, so why not Lex?

Your question was why Lex saw through them. I remember he has genius level intellect on record, not particularly in the film, and that's why I posted. What do you mean by what it has to do with anything. It has to do with the question you asked. LOL

 

[The Guard]

I'm just wondering if anyone other than hardcore fans could figure any of this out? I get that all comic book movies are supposed to be pleasing for the fans and the general audience, but this movie definitely confuses more than it pleases. I feel like it was made for the hardcores and the people who turn off their brains completely. And everyone in the middle is going "huh?"

The general audience, from what I gather, just didn't get it.

Was going for all of this secret imagery (like in Bruce's nightmare scenes) really worth the confusion?

You're not supposed to "get it" yet. The tease stuff was just a tease.

Why do people not understand this?

 

[redhawk23]

You're not supposed to "get it" yet. The tease stuff was just a tease.

Why do people not understand this?

The fact that its bad story telling and uninteresting in the context of the nearly 3 hour movie they paid to see?

 

[Donner]

Because people dont understand what the eff was going on. How can something be a tease if people don't even know what the tease is. The Flash being in Bruce's dream was hard enough to figure out. If people don't know that was the Flash, what is the point?