Homecoming What should they do with the Spidey franchise?

[Frodo]

The one thing alot of fans don't realize about Hollywood is that nothing is set in stone. Above all its a business, one in which contracts can be bought out, deals can be struck, and plans change when the opportunity arises.

That's why when people have argued that Sony can't replace Garfield because he signed a contract for two more films , they don't realize that, among other things, contracts can be bought out and that Sony could replace them if they wanted to. For example , Val Kilmer and George Clooney both signed on to several Batman films and we clearly didn't get multi Kilmer/Clooney Bat adventures.

Its the same thing with film announcements. Studios can announce anything they want but if the project development stalls or the studio changes its mind they aren't bound to make a Venom or female lead film just because they announced a release date and writers.

 

[spiderman2]

The one thing alot of fans don't realize about Hollywood is that nothing is set in stone. Above all its a business, one in which contracts can be bought out, deals can be struck, and plans change when the opportunity arises.

That's why when people have argued that Sony can't replace Garfield because he signed a contract for two more films , they don't realize that, among other things, contracts can be bought out and that Sony could replace them if they wanted to. For example , Val Kilmer and George Clooney both signed on to several Batman films and we clearly didn't get multi Kilmer/Clooney Bat adventures.

Its the same thing with film announcements. Studios can announce anything they want but if the project development stalls or the studio changes its mind they aren't bound to make a Venom or female lead film just because they announced a release date and writers.

Agree that is why even with video games you will see trailers and hear about a game being made and then the game gets caned and never comes out. Heck the tim burtant superman movie even had some stuff like a suit and consecpt art and yet the movie was never made and don't forget at one time we thought we where going to get a sm4 and maybe even sm 4 and 5 with tobey getting payed I think 40 million for the 2 combind.

 

[spider-neil]

The messiness of ASM2 is proof that Sony doesn't know what theyre doing.

IM2, IM3 and TDW are pretty messy. Maybe Marvel don't know what the are doing either but luck out of good directors from time to time.

 

[spider-neil]

With regards to S6, I think the worst thing that can happen is a lukewarm reception.
I think the movie either needs to big success (critically or financially, either will do) or the movie needs to bomb. That way Sony will have a clear idea how to proceed with ASM 3 or cut their losses. A middle of the road return and so so reviews wont tell them what to do next.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

IM2, IM3 and TDW are pretty messy. Maybe Marvel don't know what the are doing either but luck out of good directors from time to time.

IM3 wasn't a mess. I'll give you the others, but even then all 3 of those movies at least had clear, concise (although in IM2, and TDW's case, underwhelming) plots.

 

[spider-neil]

IM3 wasn't a mess. I'll give you the others, but even then all 3 of those movies at least had clear, concise (although in IM2, and TDW's case, underwhelming) plots.

I thought they were a mess. Each to their own. To be fair to Marvel, their last two movies have at least had tighter scripts and plot threads so Marvel can at least justifiably claim they have learnt from their mistakes.

 

[JOE]

The MCU is every studio's dream. They're not all amazing movies, but none of them are losing Marvel money and the two movies in 2014 were both critically acclaimed. Wasn't really a fan of TWS, but I loved GOTG as far as 2014 goes.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

I think IM 2 and TDW were cases of directors clashing with Marvel. When everything gels you get stuff like Iron Man, Avengers, Winter Soldier and GOTG. IM 3 was a case of Marvel letting the director have a little too much free reign. I think an Edgar Wright Ant-Man would have been a bit like IM 3. You need to find the happy medium. I think after 10 movies Marvel's knows what they're doing now. They have a vision and they know how to bring it to fruition. (The key of course if finding the right directors who can still stretch their legs without feeling hampered by that vision.)

Contrast that to Sony. They don't seem to have any kind of vision. I thought Raimi had vision and they tinkered with his third film too much shoehorning in Venom and causing a potentially great series of films to die a quick death. Rather than give the man who gave us SM 2 a shot at redemption, SM 4 got cancelled because of the fan backlash. Suddenly the Dark Knight hits the scene and now it's time to go DARK! So we get ASM. Then The Avengers hits the scene and now it's time to go BRIGHT! And create a "cinematic universe" while you're at it too! So then we get ASM 2.

I'm not saying I loved organic web shooters, the power rangers Goblin and some of the other nonsense from the first Spider-Man films but I think they had something special going there. With Raimi at the helm Sony's Spider-Man franchise set the standard for CBMs. (Spider-Man 2 is still one of the greatest CBMs ever in my mind.) Now Sony seems clueless as they try to follow everyone else's lead. And whatever box office revenue they may continue to rake in on the Spider-Man franchise is solely because of strength of the brand and by coasting on past successes. But if they continue on this track they will destroy this brand and those past successes will quickly be forgotten.

 

[UltimateWebhead]

That makes sense.

I just figured they had solid plans for their spinoffs since they kind of dropped the hammer down with their news of S6, Venom, and female lead movies all at once.

If you have definitive plans, why not wait to sell the rights after they're done? Their faith has obviously been shaken in their own work. Maybe these rumors are the reason why we haven't received any real news.

Well, if you remember the announcement of the spin-offs, minus the female driven one, were announced when ASM2 was still in principal photography. It's still just a business and even though ASM2 was profitable, there's no doubt that Sony has been shaken by it's less than expected profit, poor reviews, and audience decline/negative reviews. The one thing that proves this, is their immediate push back of ASM3's release date. If they had no concerns, that wouldn't have changed. IMO, there's definitely some truth to these rumors.

 

[Spider-Ranger]

I'm still holding on to my crazy idea
And I've developed it further after reading about the recent rumors. Everything would fit really well...

Here's part two of it: http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=29279417&postcount=1

 

[W/ Great Power]

Well, if you remember the announcement of the spin-offs, minus the female driven one, were announced when ASM2 was still in principal photography. It's still just a business and even though ASM2 was profitable, there's no doubt that Sony has been shaken by it's less than expected profit, poor reviews, and audience decline/negative reviews. The one thing that proves this, is their immediate push back of ASM3's release date. If they had no concerns, that wouldn't have changed. IMO, there's definitely some truth to these rumors.

I actually was not aware of that, probably because I wasn't that in tune with the boards then (where I get most of my Spidey news). But that leads me to another point I've made here, which is how an argument can be made that the decision to expand the universe was abrupt on Sony's part. I genuinely am starting to believe that it was only after TASM1 that they decided to make the spinoffs, otherwise TASM1 would have been a completely different movie than it was.

If this really is the case, then I wouldn't be surprised if these rumors are true. Sony reminds me of an impulse buyer; except, in this regard, they are impulse producers. I was expecting within 48 hours of the rumors being released, we would have someone come forward and denounce them. However, because Sony has remained silent, the arguments supporting the validity of these rumors are only becoming more believable.

 

[Green Goblin]

I'm not sure but wasn't Sinister Six written during ASM2 post production?!? I'd have thought that for a film filming in January the script is finnished so why would it be a reboot if they were writing it pre ASM2? Also did Badass Digest not say Spider-Man would play a big part when Garfield said Spidey's not in it?

I want to believe the Avengers rumours but we get them every year lol.

 

[JOE]

It does seem like we do get one every year, however, now knowing the direction the MCU is taking... This is definitely Spidey's best shot to sneak in there.

 

[HarryOsborn]

I'm not sure but wasn't Sinister Six written during ASM2 post production?!? I'd have thought that for a film filming in January the script is finnished so why would it be a reboot if they were writing it pre ASM2? Also did Badass Digest not say Spider-Man would play a big part when Garfield said Spidey's not in it?

I want to believe the Avengers rumours but we get them every year lol.

Marc Webb and Drew Goddard have both gone on record to say the line up of the Sinister Six isn't finalized as late as June of this year.

Garfield has also gone on record to say Miles Morales should takeover and Mary Jane should be a boy. Lately he's just been saying things that indicate he's not looking for long term commitment.

Also given that sinister six was rumored for a 2017/2018 release, with Amazing 3 having a confirmed June 2016 date, it's clear the studio has changed it's plan. Last Avi Arad said (which was pre AMS2) he said the only way Spider-Man would go into the MCU is if he had a starring role.

Since then both parties have come into a position to benefit off of such an arrangement.

Marvel would benefit by further snuffing out fox (who they have been having a private war against).

Sony would benefit by being able to reintroduce Spider-Man to the mainstream which may have jumped ship (Thor and Cap jumped 300-400 mil after the first avengers picture, while ironman jumped roughly 600 mil).

Also an arc such as Civil War would allow Spider-Man to have said pivotal role Sony demands, without necessarily taking away screen time from big profile MCU roles like Ironman and Cap.

Personally I think it's going to happen this time.

 

[Mrs. Sawyer]

Garfield has also gone on record to say Miles Morales should takeover and Mary Jane should be a boy. Lately he's just been saying things that indicate he's not looking for long term commitment.

Those were both jokes.

 

[Green Goblin]

Marc Webb and Drew Goddard have both gone on record to say the line up of the Sinister Six isn't finalized as late as June of this year.

Garfield has also gone on record to say Miles Morales should takeover and Mary Jane should be a boy. Lately he's just been saying things that indicate he's not looking for long term commitment.

Also given that sinister six was rumored for a 2017/2018 release, with Amazing 3 having a confirmed June 2016 date, it's clear the studio has changed it's plan. Last Avi Arad said (which was pre AMS2) he said the only way Spider-Man would go into the MCU is if he had a starring role.

Since then both parties have come into a position to benefit off of such an arrangement.

Marvel would benefit by further snuffing out fox (who they have been having a private war against).

Sony would benefit by being able to reintroduce Spider-Man to the mainstream which may have jumped ship (Thor and Cap jumped 300-400 mil after the first avengers picture, while ironman jumped roughly 600 mil).

Also an arc such as Civil War would allow Spider-Man to have said pivotal role Sony demands, without necessarily taking away screen time from big profile MCU roles like Ironman and Cap.

Personally I think it's going to happen this time.

The Miles thing and the Gay MJ things were jokes though. I get that they didn't 100% know the line up but DG left freakin Daredevil to focus on the film which to me shows that the project was alot further along than most thought.

I do think Sony will close the deal as I think a civil war story makes the most sense.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

IM2, IM3 and TDW are pretty messy. Maybe Marvel don't know what the are doing either but luck out of good directors from time to time.

i'd add TIH to that too.

 

[HarryOsborn]

Marvel was pretty confused up until Disney bought them out. At first Hulk was being set up as the villain for Avengers (as noted by Norton in the commentary of TIH). Iron Man 2 was essentially a reset button. Iron Man 3 wasn't a mess, it was received reasonably well, and had minimal universe building. The twist just pissed off some fans and there was a large plot hole.

Iron Man 2 was a huge slip and The Dark World was rather forgettable, but neither were as bad as TAMS2.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Iron Man 2 was essentially a reset button.

I'm not sure what you mean by this. While I understand many of the criticisms of IM2 and it is definitely one of the lesser MCU films, there is a clear progression in story from IM1 to IM2. It is basically the aftermath and repercussions of Tony announcing to the world that he is Iron Man.

 

[Green Goblin]

I'm not sure what you mean by this. While I understand many of the criticisms of IM2 and it is definitely one of the lesser MCU films, there is a clear progression in story from IM1 to IM2. It is basically the aftermath and repercussions of Tony announcing to the world that he is Iron Man.

It's not a reset button but it did pave the way most of the MCU films came out in terms of humour and what it adds to the universe except for possibly TWS and maybe GOTG. IM1 and TIH kinda felt more standalone and less cartoonish.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

It's not a reset button but it did pave the way most of the MCU films came out in terms of humour and what it adds to the universe except for possibly TWS and maybe GOTG. IM1 and TIH kinda felt more standalone and less cartoonish.

I don't see this big change in tone between Iron Man's sequels and the first film. It was pretty cartoony too. And they weren't really standalone. Stark himself appears in TIH along with the Super Soldier serum, and IM1 kicked off the whole build towards Avengers with SHIELD being heavily involved (and of course the stinger with Fury).

The expanded Marvel Universe was there from the beginning.

 

[JOE]

I'd love to see Sony sell the movie rights to Disney/Marvel for a royalty. That way they can work on all these movies based off their high selling Play Station games while steadily having income from every time Spider-Man is on the big screen in the MCU. You guys think Marvel would ever bite on that?

 

[UltimateWebhead]

I'd love to see Sony sell the movie rights to Disney/Marvel for a royalty. That way they can work on all these movies based off their high selling Play Station games while steadily having income from every time Spider-Man is on the big screen in the MCU. You guys think Marvel would ever bite on that?

So, essentially Marvel would be leasing Spider-Man with an option to buy at some point in the future, maybe? Yeah, I can see them doing that. But the difficult part would be the 'future' plans--Spidey stays at Sony and they just keep getting rent from Marvel but then what?? How many films does this last for and once those are over, they renegotiate the terms...it could work I suppose.

 

[JOE]

So, essentially Marvel would be leasing Spider-Man with an option to buy at some point in the future, maybe? Yeah, I can see them doing that. But the difficult part would be the 'future' plans--Spidey stays at Sony and they just keep getting rent from Marvel but then what?? How many films does this last for and once those are over, they renegotiate the terms...it could work I suppose.

It wouldn't be renting. They would own the film rights, but pay a royalty to Sony. It's like someone inventing something and selling it to a big company for a royalty. Every time that company sells that product, they pay a small percentage (royalty) to the person that created it. They can still use that product and sell as many as they want, they just pay a certain percentage to the guy that sold it to them every time they sell/use it.

Marvel would be able to use Spidey in their MCU as much as they want, but every dollar Spidey brings in, Sony gets their cut. Marvel makes money, Sony makes money, fans are happy.

 

[smashmode]

I Like Andrew Garfield, So I say just add Garfield and whatever else you want from the TASM world into MCU. I really don't think it would be that hard of a transition.