The Flash Who’s the Better Thawne: Tom Cavanagh or Matt Letscher?

[Dark Raven]

The Flash was renewed for Season 6 recently wasn't it? I don't know what Cavanagh is going to do next season. I don't think anyone wants to see Sherloque Wells stick around. None of the Wells have lasted for more than a season except Harry Wells, who was two straight seasons in a row.

I don't feel like seeing another caricature of Wells again though. I'd rather they bring back Harry Wells or don't have a Wells at all. Or the only other acceptable one would be the original Harrison Wells before Thawne stole his face. Just someone normal and not goofy. Although I don't know if Cavanagh knows how to play him not goofy anymore. I think that is his default personality in real life and he can't keep up the seriousness, so he keeps reverting to the goofiness.

 

[Gaultheria]

I think you're confusing his behaviour with Tom's acting.

Not at all. We haven't established that the acting is an issue, and while speculation is interesting, it isn't strong evidence. Besides, even disregarding the portrayal of Wells-in-the-cage, we still don't know that that's Eobard, and we've seen enough identity fake-outs and twist reveals on this show already (Wells in season 1; Zolomon; Jay being an alternate Henry; Savitar) that we know they're pretty much inevitable in the Arrowverse (if not this season, then the next).

 

[Flash525]

I don't feel like seeing another caricature of Wells again though. I'd rather they bring back Harry Wells or don't have a Wells at all. Or the only other acceptable one would be the original Harrison Wells before Thawne stole his face. Just someone normal and not goofy. Although I don't know if Cavanagh knows how to play him not goofy anymore. I think that is his default personality in real life and he can't keep up the seriousness, so he keeps reverting to the goofiness.

I'm hoping the next Wells we meet will be the original one that Thawne killed. Cavanagh has had his fun portraying all these other versions of Wells, and it's not time (I feel) to reel it back a bit and focus on a singular character moving into Season 6 (and beyond). We virtually know nothing about [the original Wells], so it's a fresh slate for him to create a character that we know has, did (and probably currently should) exist.

Not at all. We haven't established that the acting is an issue, and while speculation is interesting, it isn't strong evidence. Besides, even disregarding the portrayal of Wells-in-the-cage, we still don't know that that's Eobard, and we've seen enough identity fake-outs and twist reveals on this show already (Wells in season 1; Zolomon; Jay being an alternate Henry; Savitar) that we know they're pretty much inevitable in the Arrowverse (if not this season, then the next).

You're aware that you're literally the only person thinking that Thawne isn't actually Thawne, right? I don't get what reasons you're using to justify to yourself that future Thawne might not be who he claims to be. All evidence indicates that he is, indeed, who we all see him to be, and that is Eobard Thawne.

On what basis are you claiming otherwise? Short of thinking (or speculating) well and truly out of the box?

 

[Gaultheria]

You're aware that you're literally the only person thinking that Thawne isn't actually Thawne, right? I don't get what reasons you're using to justify to yourself that future Thawne might not be who he claims to be. All evidence indicates that he is, indeed, who we all see him to be, and that is Eobard Thawne.

On what basis are you claiming otherwise? Short of thinking (or speculating) well and truly out of the box?

Habit from a science background; I distinguish between observation and interpretation.

Would you like to discuss the evidence that I've pointed out? It's fine if you don't want to, but in that case you should move on to the next post. Personal attacks such as suggesting that a poster is confused for not supporting the majority interpretation (as if "majority" has much significance with such a small sample size) are off-topic and inappropriate.

 

[Flash525]

Habit from a science background; I distinguish between observation and interpretation.

Would you like to discuss the evidence that I've pointed out? It's fine if you don't want to, but in that case you should move on to the next post. Personal attacks such as suggesting that a poster is confused for not supporting the majority interpretation (as if "majority" has much significance with such a small sample size) are off-topic and inappropriate.

It wasn't an attack. I made an observation, and interpreted it. I personally think you're looking into these scenes far too much, and that your reasons are based around Tom's portrayal of Thawne (now) when he's been juggling too many characters to keep his Thawne persona focused.

I'm all for discussing your reasons, but I just don't see them leading anywhere. The producers of the show have said that Thawne is a focus this series, and that he'll come into it more toward the end of this season. I literally can't think of any reason why Thawne in the cage isn't Thawne. I don't see how you're drawing a different conclusion.

Your reasons (seemingly) are because we've seen reveals happen differently before, with Thawne (initially) then Zoom, then Savitar. Neither DeVoe or Cicada have had such a shock reveal though, nor have the likes of Grodd. Thawne is already an established villain. There's no need to put a mask on him.

 

[Dark Raven]

It wasn't an attack. I made an observation, and interpreted it. I personally think you're looking into these scenes far too much, and that your reasons are based around Tom's portrayal of Thawne (now) when he's been juggling too many characters to keep his Thawne persona focused.

I'm all for discussing your reasons, but I just don't see them leading anywhere. The producers of the show have said that Thawne is a focus this series, and that he'll come into it more toward the end of this season. I literally can't think of any reason why Thawne in the cage isn't Thawne. I don't see how you're drawing a different conclusion.

Your reasons (seemingly) are because we've seen reveals happen differently before, with Thawne (initially) then Zoom, then Savitar. Neither DeVoe or Cicada have had such a shock reveal though, nor have the likes of Grodd. Thawne is already an established villain. There's no need to put a mask on him.

How do we know Thawne with Wells's face in last year's Crisis crossover was really Thawne?

 

[Gaultheria]

How do we know Thawne with Wells's face in last year's Crisis crossover was really Thawne?

Well, even I'm inclined to take things at face value once the showrunners are finished with a storyline.

 

[Flash525]

How do we know Thawne with Wells's face in last year's Crisis crossover was really Thawne?

We don't know it's the same (version of) Thawne, though it's a fair assumption based on his appearances. The only Thawne that we've met who hasn't met a grizzly end is the one from Crisis; the one that Barry foolishly let go. He was wearing Wells' face, and here we are again, meeting with a Thawne who has Wells' face.

It seems logical to conclude that future Thawne is what becomes of Crisis Thawne. I'm confident in saying that he is Thawne though. I'm also confident in saying that whatever he's doing with Nora is going to backfire drastically. Thawne (at least in the comics, and further according to that newspaper article) plays a huge part in the Infinite Earth Crisis, so whatever he's doing with Nora, it ain't good.

Well, even I'm inclined to take things at face value once the showrunners are finished with a storyline.

Is that a pun?

 

[Dark Raven]

We don't know it's the same (version of) Thawne, though it's a fair assumption based on his appearances. The only Thawne that we've met who hasn't met a grizzly end is the one from Crisis; the one that Barry foolishly let go. He was wearing Wells' face, and here we are again, meeting with a Thawne who has Wells' face.

It seems logical to conclude that future Thawne is what becomes of Crisis Thawne. I'm confident in saying that he is Thawne though. I'm also confident in saying that whatever he's doing with Nora is going to backfire drastically. Thawne (at least in the comics, and further according to that newspaper article) plays a huge part in the Infinite Earth Crisis, so whatever he's doing with Nora, it ain't good.

I was kidding about Crisis Thawne.

Of course, we don't know if the Wells we saw in the previous episode to the week before is still the same Wells, or if it's a different one each week.

 

[JubalDroad]

Cavanaugh!

 

[jolldan]

Tom Cavanaugh for me, his first season as Reverse-Flash is still the best villain the show has done imo.

His version of Reverse Flash also has had some of my absolute favorite moments of the show.

1. Season 1 Episode 15 when Cisco discovers that it was him who messed with the containment field and we have that incredible first time of him being the real Reverse-Flash before killing Cisco.
2. Season 1 Episode 22 When he took on Flash, Arrow and Firestorm all at the same time that was just epic.
3. Season 1 Episode 23 The final fight between him and Flash is something else.
4. Season 1 Episode 9 The showdown in the stadium was awesome not sure if the is Tom though.

Also loved Lester's version of the character with his appearance in Season 2 Episode 11 being my personal Flash highlight and his work in LOT his overall best work.

 

[Dark Raven]

Thought I'd bump this thread since we've been seeing Cavanagh as Thawne again recently. He still hasn't managed to capture his season 1 menace and seems to have lost his touch. Yes, he has been a threat to the likes of Cisco or Nash Wells, and even tried to provoke Barry into using his speed while in Nash's mind, but there's something missing there.

I think he's played too many versions of the character that it's hard to see him as the deadly villain from season 1 now because all these other versions have overtaken that.

 

[Pennywise]

Thought I'd bump this thread since we've been seeing Cavanagh as Thawne again recently. He still hasn't managed to capture his season 1 menace and seems to have lost his touch. Yes, he has been a threat to the likes of Cisco or Nash Wells, and even tried to provoke Barry into using his speed while in Nash's mind, but there's something missing there.

I think he's played too many versions of the character that it's hard to see him as the deadly villain from season 1 now because all these other versions have overtaken that.

Agreed. I’m thinking based on the end of the last episode, they’ll have Thawne with a new face next time.

Then again, they’d probably just find a way to bring Cavanagh back. Would remind me of how he teased in Earth X what face he would have next time, but they didn’t follow up on that.

 

[Dark Raven]

I don't see why Letscher couldn't show up for the odd episode. It's not like he's being asked to commit to the whole season. Thawne doesn't even play all the time. Lots of other actors are on other shows but guest star in the Arrow Verse or elsewhere.

 

[Gaultheria]

We could have a Thawne versus Thawne episode, with older and wiser Thawne trying to set proud younger Thawne onto the best evil path. Imagine poor Barry having to choose a side in that fight.

 

[Flash525]

Whilst I'm kinda tired of seeing Tom portray Thawne, as I much prefer Matt in the role (at least after Flash Season 1) I'm not sure how I'd feel if someone else played him now, cause that new actor would have a lot to live up too, and to be quite honest, I don't want the character of Thawne to end up in a new body with a new face each season.

 

[The Caped Knight]

This isn't even a debate Tom Cavanaugh hands down!

 

[NotGoodAtNames]

I've grown tired of Tom as Thawne. It's the fault of the show making too many Wells. He was fine in season 1, but now he's awful. Tom is playing Thawne as just another Wells.
My vote is going to Matt. Matt's Thawne is closer to the comic book

 

[WhoMani]

One of the most disappointing things about the Flash is we've seen very little of Matt Letscher as Eobard Thawne. I wish we actually seen his origins on the show. I'm going with Tom purely for his performance in season 1 even though I admit he's not as good as he was in season 1 and you can tell that now Tom is phoning in a bit.

 

[Pennywise]

The Flash Showrunner Teases Surprise Guest Stars, Show's Biggest Battle Yet

The other day, Barry Allen actor Grant Gustin mentioned the season originally had "a big Thawne cliffhanger." I understand plans have obviously changed, but will we see any remnants of that in the lead up to the new season finale?

No. Sadly, because of the pandemic and because of changes we had to make, that Thawne cliffhanger -- which really starts in Episode 15, "The Exorcism of Nash Wells," because now we've gotten Thawne to his next stage. He's out there Voldemorting. We're now no longer able to do [our original plan] in the last two episodes of the season.

But don't worry! No fear! That gets rolled into next season. So we'll have to finish the Black Hole storyline and find a different way to weave in the Thawne stuff. Now, having said that, I know what you're thinking, "Well, I'm disappointed, Eric. I love Reverse-Flash. I love Thawne. There's got to be a way to give us what we want this season!" Well, I am happy to report we did come up with a very crazy solution that now, in the -- how shall I say it? Not in the season finale, but perhaps soon thereafter. It gets resolved in a way that I think fans of the Reverse-Flash are going to just giggle with delight.

 

[The Sarge]

Matt Letscher did a great job, but does anyone else wish they casted someone closer to Grant in age?
Actually, picture this- It's the scene from Latschers reveal, but this time he reaches up and pulls it back- and it's Barry. Reverse Flash taking Barry's face is a storyline from the comic- and if you integrate it this way, it means a few things- Cavanaugh is playing an older Barry, we still don't know what Thawnes true face looks like, and at any point you can drop the now foreshadowed RF doppleganger story.
Plus Thawnes original comic book motivation IS to replace Barry, so that leads into that more.

Yeah mystery motivation is kinda fun, but we all know the writers don't have a clue, they're not gonna slowly reveal it in small breadcrumbs, and it's questionable if they are capable of having a satisfying reveal.

 

[Flash525]

Matt Letscher did a great job, but does anyone else wish they casted someone closer to Grant in age?
Actually, picture this- It's the scene from Latschers reveal, but this time he reaches up and pulls it back- and it's Barry. Reverse Flash taking Barry's face is a storyline from the comic- and if you integrate it this way, it means a few things- Cavanaugh is playing an older Barry, we still don't know what Thawnes true face looks like, and at any point you can drop the now foreshadowed RF doppleganger story.
Plus Thawnes original comic book motivation IS to replace Barry, so that leads into that more.

Yeah mystery motivation is kinda fun, but we all know the writers don't have a clue, they're not gonna slowly reveal it in small breadcrumbs, and it's questionable if they are capable of having a satisfying reveal.

God no. Thawne has switched his face already, and we've also had Barritar. I don't quite care for Gustin to be playing a villain at this point. Mask or otherwise.

 

[Dark Raven]

After Cavanagh having played all these version of Wells, no-one would ever take him seriously as an older version of Barry. He would just seem like yet another Wells. And we've already had the future Barry in Savitar.

 

[The Sarge]

My made up scenario was replacing Matt Letschers reveal, so it would've been back in season one, and predated Savitar, council of Wells, or any of that ****.

I don't want them doing that now. God no.

 

[Flash5000]

Tom Cavanaugh of course.