Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Season 1 Episode 21 "Ragtag"

[David_99]

I think she's fascinated by things that are strange or paranormal. This was just an example of that.

Even though she has qualms with Garrett, he is also her boss. Testing to see if it works is one example of that.

She obviously has a second batch somewhere and was hoping Garrett would use it on himself or another test subject so she could witness the reaction. She's definitely hiding something. Look at the little smirk on her face when Ward grabs her arm and says "You can tell me [about Skye's blood]" before she turns around. She's playing them both.

 

[Dregride]

She obviously has a second batch somewhere and was hoping Garrett would use it on himself or another test subject so she could witness the reaction. She's definitely hiding something. Look at the little smirk on her face when Ward grabs her arm and says "You can tell me [about Skye's blood]" before she turns around. She's playing them both.

She's a chess master
Coulson is also one
Perfect adversary's

 

[Katsuro]

OMG....Ward did *not* shoot the damn dog!
If he was so wuss that he couldn't shoot the dog face to face, then why the hell take the extra steps of walking up TO the dog, firing a pistol in the air to chase it off, then walking all the way back to a sniper position to finish it off? Just to brag about it? If he wanted to snipe the dog, he would've sniped the dog to begin with.

Are you joking? He obviously didn't plan out all the steps like that. He was just gonna shoot the dog, then found it too difficult. Then, either he scared it off purposefully to shoot it from a distance, or he scared it off, then changed his mind and realized he had to do it.

Garrett had the rifle. They broke camp; Garrett picked up the rifle; said, "Oh yeah, kill Buddy....you got a problem with that?" Then went back to set up a sniper position on the poor dog when he surmised correctly that Ward would wuss out. Cut and dried....this ain't that hard to figure out.

The scope on that rifle was very, very long range. 1800 meters is how far away Ward said the deer was. How long do you think it took Ward to walk back to the truck?

Most of all, it makes no sense to randomly transition a flashback to another character's point of view. Those flashbacks were all centered on Ward. We didn't see Garrett sitting in the room before Ward enters, we didn't follow him when he left him in the woods. The action always focused on Ward. To suddenly give us a scene from the first-person POV of another character... that's insane! If you wanna show that Garrett did it, you show Ward approach the truck to see Garrett firing the rifle. Or show him standing there watching the dog run as he hears a shot go out.

 

[cherokeesam]

^Yeah, good luck with that scenario, Katsuro.

 

[hoy-small-fry]

Skye, Tripp, get ready for a large file transfer

Still brilliant

 

[BuddyTheDog]

Skye, Tripp, get ready for a large file transfer

Still brilliant

Excellent Download speeds. Upload not so good.

 

[cherokeesam]

Excellent Download speeds. Upload not so good.

Aren't you supposed to be dead?
And who shot you, anyway?
("Who Shot Buddy?" is the new "Han Shot First." )

 

[BuddyTheDog]

Aren't you supposed to be dead?
And who shot you, anyway?
("Who Shot Buddy?" is the new "Han Shot First." )

I learned to play dead.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

I learned to play dead.

Will be interesting to see how long it lasts.

 

[afan]

I don't get a flashback vibe at all in this episode....more just backstory....Character flashbacks are stimulated by a present event. .....A classic example of a character driven flashback is in Casablanca when Rick recalls thru a haze of cigarette smoke his time in Paris with Ilsa. Meeting Ilsa in his café gives rise to the flashback. Buddy's demise is told before Garrett's order to Ward to take care of Fitz and Simmons so that stimulus did not create a flashback.

Also the episode started in the Ward /Garrett backstory, and then in present time with the team in the motel. If the opening backstory where a flashback, present time should have immediately featured Ward or Garrett.

I'm surprised at the lack of discussion/speculation about Skye's background....her "monster" parents destroying a village in their search for her........I'm late to the party and perhaps it's covered in a previous post.... anyone have any speculation about Skye based on this backstory? Assuming "monster" is more myth/lore driven than fact.

 

[Mike Murdock]

Well, I'd quibble with that definition of flashback slightly. I don't think the character has to actually be recalling the events. Just that the events have to, in some way, relate to the modern events.

 

[hopeless]

The real question is who called them a monster and why that SHIELD Agent told them otherwise?

Now if this was a fight between the Skrulls and the Kree with the Skrulls hunting down the survivors since most Kree aren't as good at hiding what they look like, like the Skrulls can...

Hmm we need a scene where someone is either killed or knocked out reverting to their true form... now imagine that as a twist for the end of the last episode maybe explaining where the Red Skull ended up?

 

[Matarreyes]

That was definitely not a pure flashback episode. People are claiming that Ward was the one pointing the rifle at Buddy because all the past scenes were all from Ward´s point of view seem to have missed at least 2 scenes definitely presented from Garrets point:
- in the juvie, we stay with Garrett as he is waiting for Ward to be let in
- in the "6 month later" moment, we accompany Garrett as he wanders about the campsite and gets ambushed by Ward

On another note, I have seen some posts claiming that the backstory is "underwhelming", because they seemingly have expected more hardcore stuff to justify Wards attachment. I think Garrett´s brainwaching was beatifully written and executed, and was all the more creepy for its understatedness. He takes a promising youth right at the rock bottom of his existence, promises him a new future, but then proceeds to basically make him a wanted fugutive (notice how Ward is worried that the police could be looking for them). That right there explains why he had to stay in the wilderness however long Garrett let him there. Along with "of course you can run away as the weakling everyone thinks you are. But for all its worth, I think you can do it." Of course Ward stayed put. I bet it was the first encouragement words he had heard in forever.

Then Garrett comes back and he is all "I could not be more proud if you were my own". How can Ward even think about complaining after that? He is left eagerly explaining how he overcame his ordeal. Cue Garret taking out a pistol and purposefully making him think he´s gonna shoot him right there. After that he is all smiles again, young Grant is happy to graduate to firearms and the two casual cruelities completely go over his head.

And they continue to go over his head as Garrett alternatively prises him and puts him down ever since.
"Don´t thank me, you have earned everything yourself" <-> "put down that dog, you weakling".
"Yes I gave orders to have you almost killed as a ruse" <-> "It worked, why can´t you be happy for me?"
And my favourite: "You are angry because I almost had the girl you love killed" <-> "Your own fault for not informing me about growing attached to her". Talk about emotional blackmail.

It seems like Ward spent 15 years being abused by his family, then 5 years mistaking Garrets lack of physical abuse and ocasional praise for kindness, then 10 years as a sleeper agent inside SHIELD. He literally never had a chance to bond with another living soul, not even with fellow HYDRA agents for a drink and a relaxing evening of evildoing. And of course his marks at SHIELD (an organisation that, lets not forget, left his surrogate father to die, talks world peace but fabricates weapons of mass destruction) could never become his friends. You cannot betray someone you were never faithful to. Ward, curiously, is not a traitor. If anything, he is way too loyal to the set of fabricated beliefs he was given early in life. One has to be blind to not see a long and winding redemption arc in the making.

 

[Potts]

Excellent post Mattarreyes. I think you are right on.

 

[Mask&Cape]

On another note, I have seen some posts claiming that the backstory is "underwhelming", because they seemingly have expected more hardcore stuff to justify Wards attachment. I think Garrett´s brainwaching was beatifully written and executed, and was all the more creepy for its understatedness.

Exactly. Garret was grooming Ward just like the Third Reich did with Nazi Youth - right done to killing their dogs that they raised themselves.

Ward had experienced a lifetime of physical and emotional abuse - you van't break a guy like that with more of the same.

That being said, I am disappointed with the revelation that Ward didn't kill Buddy. This has brought closer the fear I had that Whedon and company wouldn't have the stones to go through with Ward being an all out bad guy.

He is a good character on the show and became much more interesting as two faced Hydra agent. My fear now is that in season 2, he will be back on the team trying to redeem himself and working for the good guys.

I would prefer Ward as an enemy.

Now I could be wrong and maybe the scene of Ward not killing Buddy was mixed with Ward ejecting FitzSimmons from the Bus to show that Garrett has finally broken him.

I just think that the show should put itself out there as being brave and not afraid to mix it up.

 

[Mask&Cape]

I'm surprised at the lack of discussion/speculation about Skye's background....her "monster" parents destroying a village in their search for her........I'm late to the party and perhaps it's covered in a previous post.... anyone have any speculation about Skye based on this backstory? Assuming "monster" is more myth/lore driven than fact.

It could pretty much be anything.

A small town in China twenty something years ago…

an alien dropping out of the sky, an Asgard, a couple with out of control telekinetic powers, pyrokinetics, …

Coulson and May learned from the surviving agent of Skye's rescue that the villagers where killed trying to protect her.m The fact that Skye is human, I'm guessing that one one of her parents was a villager and one was a foreigner (I'm assuming the writers chose China due to Chloe Bennet's background).

So, Skye is the child of two "miracles" - assuming that the story Rayna recounts to Ward is accurate since she herself has only heard the story from others and since there were no known survivors who is to say there was really two "monsters" and not one, or that the were actually her parents and not something hunting her because she was special.

I think they won't get into this story until season 2.

Too much to do with Garrett and Ward on the loose, but I'd wager the final teaser scene will be about Skye's origin.

 

[Matarreyes]

Upon watching the scene myself, my gut reaction was that he indeed killed the dog. After reading way too many metas, I have absolutely no clue. I can live with it being either way. Whatever happened obviously broke him a little further.

What stood out for me in the present were the emotions Ward was suddenly telegraphing all over the place. I never imagined he had a panic voice, but when he tells Raina that Garrett is dying, he sounds openly terrified. When he is about to eject Fitzsimmons he all but admits it is killing him inside. I mean, you can go on about what an souless evil assassin he is because you have seen him off "neutral" and "positive" characters, but this is not a behaviour of a specialist who is accostumed to kill people on abstract orders. How he managed to retain a soul at all is a wonder to me, but he obviously did.

To compare: May has been deep undercover in Coulson´s team, spying on him and perfectly prepared to put him down if he started to act funny. She would have done it, and she would not have shed a tear about it. And I am OK with it. She is a specialist, it made sense in her head, or maybe not, but she would have followed her orders anyway. Ward is following his own orders, except by now he is protesting every step of the way, and a time will come when the situation will blow up.

I don´t see him on the team in the next season, he has done too much too recently for that. He will probably stay a free agent (I hope for a Garrett-less existence for him from now on). Watching him come into his own agenda and interact with his ex-team members would be an absolute delight, when done right, and his character growth can potentially be very satisfying. I also expect an episode dwelving deeper on his family situation, as it´s been hinted that they are rich and prosperous and have written him off. If there is a season 3, I will be expecting him back on the "team" on a sort of probation. People expect him to die have no clue about storytelling, and people who expect him to be thrown in jail have forgotten that he, just as every other member of the team, does not exist anymore on any known record.

 

[SonOfIvaldi]

Ward feels much like Angel felt in Buffy

 

[ThePowerCosmic]

Nope...that's a negative.

 

[Human Torch]

I don't get how anyone thinks the dog was shot by anybody.

I was wondering though,when Garrett kept calling Ward worthless and weak,if Ward wasn't gonna suddenly start singing "We're not gonna take it!"

 

[kosh33]

The dog will reappear in the finale.. he was in safekeeping at the Triskellion

 

[David_99]

The dog will reappear in the finale.. he was in safekeeping at the Triskellion

They kept him on ice the past 10 years and gave him a robotic leg.
Marvel's next One-Shot: The Winter Pooch.

 

[Dark Raven]

They kept him on ice the past 10 years and gave him a robotic leg.
Marvel's next One-Shot: The Winter Pooch.

That's what happens when people overeat and fail to exercise when it's not spring or summer.

 

[Demileto]

On another note, I have seen some posts claiming that the backstory is "underwhelming", because they seemingly have expected more hardcore stuff to justify Wards attachment. I think Garrett´s brainwaching was beatifully written and executed, and was all the more creepy for its understatedness. He takes a promising youth right at the rock bottom of his existence, promises him a new future, but then proceeds to basically make him a wanted fugutive (notice how Ward is worried that the police could be looking for them). That right there explains why he had to stay in the wilderness however long Garrett let him there. Along with "of course you can run away as the weakling everyone thinks you are. But for all its worth, I think you can do it." Of course Ward stayed put. I bet it was the first encouragement words he had heard in forever.

Then Garrett comes back and he is all "I could not be more proud if you were my own". How can Ward even think about complaining after that? He is left eagerly explaining how he overcame his ordeal. Cue Garret taking out a pistol and purposefully making him think he´s gonna shoot him right there. After that he is all smiles again, young Grant is happy to graduate to firearms and the two casual cruelities completely go over his head.

And they continue to go over his head as Garrett alternatively prises him and puts him down ever since.
"Don´t thank me, you have earned everything yourself" <-> "put down that dog, you weakling".
"Yes I gave orders to have you almost killed as a ruse" <-> "It worked, why can´t you be happy for me?"
And my favourite: "You are angry because I almost had the girl you love killed" <-> "Your own fault for not informing me about growing attached to her". Talk about emotional blackmail.

It seems like Ward spent 15 years being abused by his family, then 5 years mistaking Garrets lack of physical abuse and ocasional praise for kindness, then 10 years as a sleeper agent inside SHIELD. He literally never had a chance to bond with another living soul, not even with fellow HYDRA agents for a drink and a relaxing evening of evildoing. And of course his marks at SHIELD (an organisation that, lets not forget, left his surrogate father to die, talks world peace but fabricates weapons of mass destruction) could never become his friends. You cannot betray someone you were never faithful to. Ward, curiously, is not a traitor. If anything, he is way too loyal to the set of fabricated beliefs he was given early in life. One has to be blind to not see a long and winding redemption arc in the making.

Upon watching the scene myself, my gut reaction was that he indeed killed the dog. After reading way too many metas, I have absolutely no clue. I can live with it being either way. Whatever happened obviously broke him a little further.

What stood out for me in the present were the emotions Ward was suddenly telegraphing all over the place. I never imagined he had a panic voice, but when he tells Raina that Garrett is dying, he sounds openly terrified. When he is about to eject Fitzsimmons he all but admits it is killing him inside. I mean, you can go on about what an souless evil assassin he is because you have seen him off "neutral" and "positive" characters, but this is not a behaviour of a specialist who is accostumed to kill people on abstract orders. How he managed to retain a soul at all is a wonder to me, but he obviously did.

To compare: May has been deep undercover in Coulson´s team, spying on him and perfectly prepared to put him down if he started to act funny. She would have done it, and she would not have shed a tear about it. And I am OK with it. She is a specialist, it made sense in her head, or maybe not, but she would have followed her orders anyway. Ward is following his own orders, except by now he is protesting every step of the way, and a time will come when the situation will blow up.

I don´t see him on the team in the next season, he has done too much too recently for that. He will probably stay a free agent (I hope for a Garrett-less existence for him from now on). Watching him come into his own agenda and interact with his ex-team members would be an absolute delight, when done right, and his character growth can potentially be very satisfying.

You wrote these so perfectly that I had to register on SHH just to praise your analysis of Ward. I agree wholeheartedly, Ward is not your black and white evil for evil's sake: his life with his family was so messed up that he mistakes Garrett's few and small compliments as genuine caring for him and thus has come to see him as a father figure. He's a broken man who lacks social skills because those who should've given that to him didn't, I couldn't have asked for a more fascinating character to follow his journey to forge true relationships with people who really cares for him.

I also expect an episode dwelving deeper on his family situation, as it´s been hinted that they are rich and prosperous and have written him off.

I too am expecting them to delve deeper into his conflict with his family, I'm just not as confident that it'll be for just an episode, because I think these hints about his family may point to his father either being, or be inspired by, an obscure Marvel villain, Senator Ward:

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix5/stewrtwardspdrmn.htm

The original character itself was a Spider-Man villain with a convoluted history that has a few continuity issues, but it's worth of note that he HAD connections to both SHIELD and HYDRA, so it's entirely possible that his name came up in a list of characters from the Marvel Universe that had been associated with either of these two organizations, a list that the producers and writers would be using when creating characters for the show. His story also involved an alien threat, which could also be adapted to work with either Skye's backstory, the alien that provided the serum that ressurected Coulson or a Guardians of the Galaxy tie-in if they so wish. Finally, finding that his father also has ties to HYDRA could make up for an interesting character centric moment for Ward, especially if it also turns out it was actually dearest daddy who had Garrett get him to be the latter's apprentice.

Hopefully season 2 will allow me to see how right or wrong I am in my speculation.

If there is a season 3, I will be expecting him back on the "team" on a sort of probation. People expect him to die have no clue about storytelling, and people who expect him to be thrown in jail have forgotten that he, just as every other member of the team, does not exist anymore on any known record.

Agreed. Inprisonment or capital punishment may be the go-to procedure for real life cases like Ward's, but this is a show, and a fantasy one at that. They're less concerned about following real-life procedures than just tell a good story, and a redemption story for a character CAN lead to more satisfying storytelling that just simply outright murdering him/her depending on the groundwork that had been layed out beforehand.

I've seen some people compare Ward to Buffyverse's Angel; I can see why, but I think the better comparison would be with Faith Lehane. Both Faith and Ward:

* are broken people who come from troubled homes;
* were trained to be unstoppable killing machines;
* got attached to the wrong people (Mayor Wilkins for Faith, Garrett for Ward) because they provided something they craved, a father figure;
* betrayed people that cared for them and did some nasty things for the sake of said father figures.

Faith's road to redemption was done very well IMO: she's now a character that the heroes have come to accept as an ally again, but one that feels compelled to atone every single day for the wrongs she did. More or less what I expect for a redemption arc for Ward.

 

[Matarreyes]

AWWW, Demileto, now I am blushing...

I have no idea of comics, but the stuff you wrote with Senator Ward sounds like it could be dead on. My pet theory goes back to a very throwaway comment from Tripp about Ward´s family being like "the cable version of the Kennedys". Can´t say I understand very well what it was supposed to mean, but there being a Senator Ward in the comics is sorta awesome in that it would give a political angle to the show while tying into personal stories of the characters.

Also completely agree on the potential of well developed redemption stories over real-life punishments AND momentous fan rage. Collective memory is a short thing; over summer all online outcry over Ward´s "lowlife murdering nazi betrayals" will be settled and almost forgotten. And on a more female-oriented note, Ward and Skye/Ward shipping just got promoted from "telegraphed and forced" to "cult status" on Tumblr, as all damaged boy pairings usually do. The writers know exactly what they are doing, and killing off Ward are they not.