Go back and read my post. I said that if people are interested in the character, they will go look them up, which = post-movie. I never before suggested anyone to do their homework before, which isn't a bad idea in itself, but isn't something to be expected. Someone who wants to complain and doesn't want to look for the answers themselves isn't going to remember half of it anyway. I know because that's what I do for films I don't care for. Anything that I watch and find interesting, I will do the work myself without complaints.
That's great for you, but it's bad storytelling to expect your audience to A. pay for a movie, B. sit through a 2.5 hour movie, and C. go home and do research to understand said movie.
A lot of the "Explanations" for the various plot holes aren't in the film and are things that people are making up out of thin air or trying to explain away with excuses or things that happened in the comics.
A movie should have a "flow" to it. Scenes moving in a logical manner consistent with time. BvS is very choppy, with quick cuts that don't seem to have a plan to them or logic behind them.
One example:
]Batman turns on the bat signal to basically call Superman out. Okay... then you have Lois talking to Luthor, Superman saving Lois, Superman talking to Luthor, Lois at the daily planet, Wonder Woman looking at an email that Batman was somehow able to send while standing their waiting THEN you have Superman show up. So Bruce was just standing their this whole time? No police to show up and arrest him (seeing as how Batman is, in this universe, a wanted vigilante)
Another example:
Bruce is in the cave and just stares for a long period at the Bat suit. No particular reason in the story, he just stares at it.
One more example:
The beginning of the movie is literally a chopped up montage of clips but there is no really flow behind it. You're just jumping around spastically when you should be establishing the story.
Once again, these are just my opinion, but I spent 4 years at SCAD studying film and Snyder makes some of the same mistakes that the teachers harped on repeatedly.
This is why the movie is so aggravating. It fails to do its job on a very basic level. The dream sequences come out of nowhere and feel awkwardly placed in the story.
It's two comics series (DOS and TDKR) mashed together with three separate movie plots (MOS sequel, Batman origin, Justice League prelude). No **** it's a mess.
some of you folks must have been a lot of fun to tell bedtime stories to...
M: Once upon a time, there were three bears...
S:Why three bears mommy?
M:I'm getting to that baby.
M:...But the porridge was too hot so they went out for a walk in the forest to let the porridge cool.
S:What's porridge mommy?
M:It's like oatmeal sweetie.
S:Why did they need to let it cool?
M:Because it was too hot .
S: How hot was it mommy?
M:Too hot to eat baby.
S: Why didn't they just put some milk in the porridge to cool it.?
M:Well, I guess they could have.
S: Or they could have blown on it...right mommy?
M: I guess.
S: Why would they go out for a walk to let it cool anyway, by the time they got back it would be too cold to eat... This doesn't make any sense mommy.
M:Well the porridge isn't the point of the story baby, Let me finish and you will understand.
S: But mommy, if there are three different size bowls, each will cool at a different rate and therefore the smallest bowl will be ice cold while the largest one will retain most of its heat due to the laws of thermal dynamics...
I am being serious. There's no logical reason why that character as he's portrayed in that film wouldn't gather as much Intel as possible on someone he perceived to be a threat. If he was incapable of gathering that intel for whatever reason that'd be one thing, but he obviously didn't even try.
So yeah, that counts as a plot hole unless you want to argue that this version of Batman is stupid or lazy.
Its hurting financially because critics had problems with the movie and anybody on the fence about seeing it isn't likely to see it after seeing that it has a 28% on RT. Anybody that has already seen the movie has already paid for it. So unless they are all asking for refunds and getting them, its hurting because people are just not going to see it, at least not as many people as they wanted to.
It's hurting because people who saw it didn't want to see it again, and people on the fence about seeing it are saving their money because the WOM all over the internet and from people they know is toxic. Don't blame critics. Blame the movie. It didn't find an audience.
You mean how could Bruce have known that Lex blew up the Senate even though lowly investigative report Lois Lane figured it out?
And how is Lex NOT a threat by stealing the Kryptonite, the only substance on Earth that can harm or kill the most powerful being on Earth? Not like he could use that stuff to control him or anything right?
Lois pieced it together because she was literally AT the firefight in the dessert. And she was investigating it. Bruce wasn't investigating it, all he saw was a Superman that didn't stop the bomb.
Okay but Bruce wants the Kryptonite for the VERY SAME REASON. Lex and Bruce have very similar motives. Obviously Lex is a bad guy, but again, Bruce doesn't have a reason to go after him. Bruce doesn't trust Superman, Lex doesn't trust Superman. Why would Bruce focus on Lex when they are both after Superman?
lol you and Poni aren't even reading my posts correctly. That actually says a lot. And to add to it, Mad Max: Fury Road was meant to be a standalone, not a continuation. BvS is a continuation to MoS, and it was the filmmaker's intent to tell Bruce's story from somewhere in the future (since we've heard his beginnings SOOOO many times before), and slowly move backwards. So that's not a good comparison at all.
Do you honestly believe half of the audience wasn't paying attention? What, they were completing a Sudoku puzzle while exposition was happening? If it were clear as day there wouldn't be this many complaints about it. The movie is hurting financially because it has problems, but you think people just brought it upon themselves?
Seriously. If 10-20% or so of people complained it was hard to understand like Tree of Life then, fine, it's on them. But it's kind of a running theme with this, MOS, Sucker Punch, that owl movie and Watchmen. Maybe it's not the audience. Maybe it's the storyteller.
It's two comics series (DOS and TDKR) mashed together with three separate movie plots (MOS sequel, Batman origin, Justice League prelude). No **** it's a mess.
The thing though is, with a better director and better runtime, this could work.
Think about how complicated the LOTR movies were, as well as the big ensemble in the Star Wars trilogy. If BvS were split in two movies, the grand scope of the story could work, while having more humane moments. Both elements were sacrificed in putting it all in one movie.
It's hurting because people who saw it didn't want to see it again, and people on the fence about seeing it are saving their money because the WOM all over the internet and from people they know is toxic. Don't blame critics. Blame the movie. It didn't find an audience.
k. Well it found me and that's really what I care about. It ended up being exactly what I wanted out of this movie. The only reason I care about other people seeing it is because I want to DCEU to be as successful as possible, because its going in the direction that I want it to go for. And if they start copying Marvel then they will have lost me.
Actually both of those things make sense within the context of both films.
What was he supposed to do, Fight the government over Zod's body and the ship? Him taking Zod's body and the ship really would have made him seem like a threat.
some of you folks must have been a lot of fun to tell bedtime stories to...
M: Once upon a time, there were three bears...
S:Why three bears mommy?
M:I'm getting to that baby.
M:...But the porridge was too hot so they went out for a walk in the forest to let the porridge cool.
S:What's porridge mommy?
M:It's like oatmeal sweetie.
S:Why did they need to let it cool?
M:Because it was too hot .
S: How hot was it mommy?
M:Too hot to eat baby.
S: Why didn't they just put some milk in the porridge to cool it.?
M:Well, I guess they could have.
S: Or they could have blown on it...right mommy?
M: I guess.
S: Why would they go out for a walk to let it cool anyway, by the time they got back it would be too cold to eat... This doesn't make any sense mommy.
M:Well the porridge isn't the point of the story baby, Let me finish and you will understand.
S: But mommy, if there are three different size bowls, each will cool at a different rate and therefore the smallest bowl will be ice cold while the largest one will retain most of its heat due to the laws of thermal dynamics...
Once upon of time there were 3 bears...3 bears? That's stupid and boring! How about there were 3 Lions. Yeah, that's edgy, realistic and mythical. Then they get some porridge...porridge? Who the f*** likes porridge?! Let's put some raw meat in there. Yeah!!!
Wait...what was the story about again? Ah well, the 3 lion fight. The end.
Once upon of time there were 3 bears...3 bears? That's stupid and boring! How about there were 3 Lions. Yeah, that's edgy, realistic and mythical. Then they get some porridge...porridge? Who the f*** likes porridge?! Let's put some raw meat in there. Yeah!!!
Wait...what was the story about again? Ah well, the 3 lion fight. The end.
Once upon of time there were 3 bears...3 bears? That's stupid and boring! How about there were 3 Lions. Yeah, that's edgy, realistic and mythical. Then they get some porridge...porridge? Who the f*** likes porridge?! Let's put some raw meat in there. Yeah!!!
Wait...what was the story about again? Ah well, the 3 lion fight. The end.
A movie should have a "flow" to it. Scenes moving in a logical manner consistent with time. BvS is very choppy, with quick cuts that don't seem to have a plan to them or logic behind them.
One example:
]Batman turns on the bat signal to basically call Superman out. Okay... then you have Lois talking to Luthor, Superman saving Lois, Superman talking to Luthor, Lois at the daily planet, Wonder Woman looking at an email that Batman was somehow able to send while standing their waiting THEN you have Superman show up. So Bruce was just standing their this whole time? No police to show up and arrest him (seeing as how Batman is, in this universe, a wanted vigilante)
Nothing to do with editing, this is how the story was written. Batman stood out there for a long time. Superman wasn't getting petty. And it also explained that "they shine your light in the sky" so this isn't the first time his batsignal has graced the Gotham skyline. Police never arrested him before. And who is the "they" that Superman said shines his light in the sky?
This isn't an example of bad editing, it's a lack of attention from the viewer.
This scene was explained by Alfred telling Bruce that he's done more good in this instance as Bruce and not Batman. He had to go to Lex as Bruce and not what he wanted, as Batman. So he gave his alter ego a long stare down before going off to Lex as Bruce Wayne. Again, not bad editing but more a lack of attention from the viewer.
The beginning of the movie is literally a chopped up montage of clips but there is no really flow behind it. You're just jumping around spastically when you should be establishing the story.
Are you talking about the opening montage of the [BLACKOUT]Wayne's murder[/BLACKOUT]? The dream an adult Bruce was having? You have a problem with the way that was edited? It was a mugging gone bad. Bruce then dreamed of his pain and how bats lifted him.
Once again, these are just my opinion, but I spent 4 years at SCAD studying film and Snyder makes some of the same mistakes that the teachers harped on repeatedly.
k. Well it found me and that's really what I care about. It ended up being exactly what I wanted out of this movie. The only reason I care about other people seeing it is because I want to DCEU to be as successful as possible, because its going in the direction that I want it to go for. And if they start copying Marvel then they will have lost me.
What does "copying Marvel" mean exactly? Does it mean taking their time making entertaining movies that fit the tone/style of their diverse characters which are accepted critically, financially successful, and create a bigger fanbase that helps grow a cinematic universe?
Because, yeah, WB should definitely copy Marvel then.
What does "copying Marvel" mean exactly? Does it mean taking their time making entertaining movies that fit the tone/style of their diverse characters which are accepted critically, financially successful, and create a bigger fanbase that helps grow a cinematic universe?
Because, yeah, WB should definitely copy Marvel then.
Actually both of those things make sense within the context of both films.
What was he supposed to do, Fight the government over Zod's body and the ship? Him taking Zod's body and the ship really would have made him seem like a threat.
Once upon of time there were 3 bears...3 bears? That's stupid and boring! How about there were 3 Lions. Yeah, that's edgy, realistic and mythical. Then they get some porridge...porridge? Who the f*** likes porridge?! Let's put some raw meat in there. Yeah!!!
Wait...what was the story about again? Ah well, the 3 lion fight. The end.
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