All Things Superman: An Open Discussion - Part 3

[Sabaoth]

Especially today, it is hard for audiences to relate to his simplistic views on morality and moral issues,

I have a strong feeling that audiences won't have to, because the Superman in MOS will not harbor those simplistic views, that while appealing in the old days, have now made him appear as a dinosaur in the modern world.
Nolan said they are approaching Superman in a manner that makes him relevant to to-day's world, that has never been done before.
I'm sure the new Superman will not disappoint.

 

[Sabaoth]

Hey, here's something scary I found on Newsarama.

"Does Flashpoint: Project Superman hold any clues to the DCnU Superman and the future of DC? Here's an exclusive preview."

I dunno. What clues could this hold to the new Superman origin?
Looks like some Steve Rogers type becomes Superman in a military experiment?

 

[TheIncredibleSk]

Don't worry about that. That wont be his origin in the new Universe.

 

[HighFivingMF]

Why am not like Bizarro purple?

 

[Sabaoth]

The Kryptonian rocket heading towards Metropolis, along with the meteor storm, on the cover of Project Superman is blue and red. Reminds me of the pre-Crisis rocket that brought baby Kal-El to earth.
What if the new Superman armor is made out of pieces of the rocket?
It would not be the first time that Superman creates objects from his rocket's wreckage.

 

[GreenKToo]

I hope there isnt any armor on him in the film.

 

[Wheels]

I hope there isnt any armor on him in the film.

You and me both.

 

[WeasleyIsRKing]

I have a strong feeling that audiences won't have to, because the Superman in MOS will not harbor those simplistic views, that while appealing in the old days, have now made him appear as a dinosaur in the modern world.
Nolan said they are approaching Superman in a manner that makes him relevant to to-day's world, that has never been done before.
I'm sure the new Superman will not disappoint.

In Nolan We Trust.

Seriously, though...Superman's morality in MoS is likely to be determined by the decisions he makes while interacting with the villians...namely Luthor and Zod. Will Nolan and Goyer make him the Boy Scout? Or something new, something different...

 

[Rowsdower!]

Hey, here's something scary I found on Newsarama.

"Does Flashpoint: Project Superman hold any clues to the DCnU Superman and the future of DC? Here's an exclusive preview."

I dunno. What clues could this hold to the new Superman origin?
Looks like some Steve Rogers type becomes Superman in a military experiment?

What the f***, DC...

 

[Wheels]

What the f***, DC...

What? You don't think this is awesome?

 

[merced]

You need not worry.
The "no sequel because WB loses the right story" is just a rumor peddled by a few who don't have Superman's interests at heart, and hope to confuse the fanbase into thinking that there may not be any sequels.
Just ignore them.

Not really.

The 9th Circuit is expected to rule on this probably in 2013. The guess is that the ruling will be in favor of the heirs.

In any case one or both sides will immediately appeal to the SCOTUS.

In this type of case where the right to use a product is being rules on, the 9th Circuit will probably stay it's ruling until a final Supreme Court ruling.

As a rule stays usually enjoin the winning party from using their court victory till a higher court affirms it. So the heirs will likely not be able to do anything with Superman as well as WB/DC until the Supreme Court appeal is done. That could take 5 - 10 years.

Bottom line, there is a good chane Superman will be frozen in 2013 and no product - movie or comic - will be allowed to be made by the heirs or WB/DC until a final Supreme Court ruling.

 

[HighFivingMF]

What the f***, DC...

Alternate Universe. Things Different. Not Like Real Comics.

 

[Sabaoth]

Alternate Universe. Things Different. Not Like Real Comics.

Yeah, but the blurb from Newsarama says there may be clues to the new Superman from this story.
I hope not.
If it's true then everyone has more to worry about than if Superman wears or does not wear armor anymore.
From a conspiracy standpoint, if like some of us have suggested, that the real reason for the new Superman is to distance the character from the Siegel & Shuster version as much as possible in case no agreement can be reached with the heirs, then perhaps there are strong clues in _Project Superman_.
This story could set up an alternate secret identity that could be used in the post 2012 DC Superman.
Think it over, it is late 2012, and the heirs get their rights back and refuse to license their character to WB/DC.
I think DC already has something planned in case this happened.
Here's my prediction,
In mid-2012, in the comics, some villain, likely Kryptonian, discovers Clark is Superman and kills Lois or sends her to another universe.
During a final battle with the villain who killed Lois, Superman is affected by some mutation of Gold Kryptonite and loses some of his powers (speed, bulletproof skin.)
At the end of the story, in Jan 2013, Superman decides never to speak about his Kryptonian origin or Smallville ever again and decides to drop the Clark Kent secret identity in favor of a new one.
Superman now depends on the alien armor he was already wearing, for a symbolic purpose, for invulnerability. While he no longer has super-speed, he retains his heat vision and flying power.
He is now referred to as the Man of Steel instead of Superman.
That becomes the status quo until the WB is able to come to an agreement with the heirs. And when that time does come, Lois will return as will Clark Kent.
If Lois dies in MOS and or in the comics, we will know why.
Maybe that is why they picked a thirty six year old actress for MOS, because they only needed Lois for one film.

 

[HighFivingMF]

Yeah, but the blurb from Newsarama says there may be clues to the new Superman from this story.

It doesn't. The cover to Action #1 proves he still grew up on the farm.

 

[merced]

Yeah, but the blurb from Newsarama says there may be clues to the new Superman from this story.
I hope not.
If it's true then everyone has more to worry about than if Superman wears or does not wear armor anymore.
From a conspiracy standpoint, if like some of us have suggested, that the real reason for the new Superman is to distance the character from the Siegel & Shuster version as much as possible in case no agreement can be reached with the heirs, then perhaps there are strong clues in _Project Superman_.
This story could set up an alternate secret identity that could be used in the post 2012 DC Superman.
Think it over, it is late 2012, and the heirs get their rights back and refuse to license their character to WB/DC.
I think DC already has something planned in case this happened.
Here's my prediction,
In mid-2012, in the comics, some villain, likely Kryptonian, discovers Clark is Superman and kills Lois or sends her to another universe.
During a final battle with the villain who killed Lois, Superman is affected by some mutation of Gold Kryptonite and loses some of his powers (speed, bulletproof skin.)
At the end of the story, in Jan 2013, Superman decides never to speak about his Kryptonian origin or Smallville ever again and decides to drop the Clark Kent secret identity in favor of a new one.
Superman now depends on the alien armor he was already wearing, for a symbolic purpose, for invulnerability. While he no longer has super-speed, he retains his heat vision and flying power.
He is now referred to as the Man of Steel instead of Superman.
That becomes the status quo until the WB is able to come to an agreement with the heirs. And when that time does come, Lois will return as will Clark Kent.
If Lois dies in MOS and or in the comics, we will know why.
Maybe that is why they picked a thirty six year old actress for MOS, because they only needed Lois for one film.

Interesting theory.

In terms of MOS and assuming the Court rules in favor of the heirs then Clark and the Kents can't be used in a sequel. In point of fact it would not be a sequel but a totally different film. No Lara, Jor-El, Knmts, Lois, Clark or Jimmy.

The probablility is the Court will freeze any use of Superman for an indefinite period after 2012.

Even if they don't and WB wanted to make a film using the rights they keep you know the heirs will file lawsuits to block the film claiming copyright violations - even if the violation is not all that apparent.

As far as I know Cavill has not signed longterm options - 4 or 5 years - as Routh had to sign. I think tha is significant and shows WB is seeing this film as a one-off stand alone with little chance for a sequel.

 

[Sabaoth]

Then it's in the best interest of the heirs to come to an agreement with the WB before 2013.
I don't think it's either parties interest to let Superman be "frozen".
There is no logical reason to believe the heirs will not come to some agreement with the WB.
We don't know all the details of Cavill's contract with the WB, and have no evidence that the WB is seeing this as a "one-off".
The $$ they are pumping into this strongly suggests they are planning a franchise here.

 

[Godzilla2014]

I just don't think it does. I don't think there is anything simple about knowing right from wrong with such confidence.

I am not a hero. I try to be a good person, but my morals are very shakey. It's hard to know right from wrong. That's not simple at all.

If you want to see Superman questioning his morals, that's what Red K is for. But I think it'd kind of be dissapointing to have Superman be imperfect morally in this film. To me, that's more important to keep in tact than all his powers.

I do agree with you, I'm mostly talking from the viewpoint of audiences without an intimate knowledge of the character.

I have a strong feeling that audiences won't have to, because the Superman in MOS will not harbor those simplistic views, that while appealing in the old days, have now made him appear as a dinosaur in the modern world.
Nolan said they are approaching Superman in a manner that makes him relevant to to-day's world, that has never been done before.
I'm sure the new Superman will not disappoint.

I agree.

 

[TheIncredibleSk]

Jesus. These theories are ridiculous.

 

[merced]

Then it's in the best interest of the heirs to come to an agreement with the WB before 2013.
I don't think it's either parties interest to let Superman be "frozen".
There is no logical reason to believe the heirs will not come to some agreement with the WB.
We don't know all the details of Cavill's contract with the WB, and have no evidence that the WB is seeing this as a "one-off".
The $$ they are pumping into this strongly suggests they are planning a franchise here.

But don't forget it's far more complicated now.

Based on the papers which were stolen from Toberoff's office (very suspicious) Toberoff gets 48% or so of the rights that the heirs win. That is how they are paying him.

So assuming a win by the heirs there will be 3 owners of Superman rights.
Even if the heirs were to licsense the rights to WB/DC, WB/DC would still have to licsense them from Toberoff to use them.

True we don't know the details about Cavill's contract but prior to SR WB was up front about the long-term option they'd taken on Routh. Curious there is no indication of such a deal with Cavill. That we re hearing nothing may mean something or it may not.

 

[TheIncredibleSk]

Jesus we haven't heard anything yet except for casting. You dont talk sequel before you give out some plot details for the first film. We haven't heard from Snyder or Cavil for awhile so when they do talk maybe they'll give some details. Also your crazy if you think Henry and Amy aren't locked up for sequels.

 

[dark_b]

interesting............

''and as of right now nobody is completely confident in the script they have.''

http://www.badassdigest.com/2011/06...s-saying-theyre-making-a-green-lantern-sequel

 

[HighFivingMF]

I thought Devin = Bull ****?

 

[TheIncredibleSk]

I take it with a grain of salt but Im not surprised. I still think its a good script. Nolan would be a idiot to put his name on it if it wasn't. I think their scared it may not have enough action or something like that.

 

[Lead Cenobite]

That sounds like old news. I remember something about problems with the script months ago.

 

[BlueLantern]

It seems like a slightly flippant statement that's been thrown in. Either way, we shall see what happens. I'd be more concerned about the wider scale of things if I was in at WB.

Right now it seems WB are panicking like mad since they've got only Batman to look forward to as a successful franchise considering Harry Potter's almost done and nothing else seems to be on the horizon.

Maybe they should consider trying to support up and coming filmmakers instead of depending on franchises consistently. I mean this is the studio that gives Eastwood, Nolan and Scorsese (on a lesser scale) free reign.

Surely instead of just following the superhero trend and handing out paychecks on demand they should work on finding more talented directors, letting them get developed through smaller films and groom them to become blockbuster directors.