BvS All Things Superman and Batman: An Open Discussion - Part 2

[shallbecomeabat]

I would actually bet money on it that the movie will begin with a scene with Bruce winessing Zod's message in the batcave. He is in detective mode and all of a sudden the lights go out and the batcomputer is hijacked by Zod.

"You are not alone."

After that, maybe his reactions on the big battle in Metropolis, which will be THE main reason he will go after Supes in the beginning and come to Metropolis.

At least, I hope they begin with that, or at least show a flashback later on. It would be bad not to show Bruces reaction.

 

[Binker]

This is funny and serious at the same time.
[YT]WrrjWz_CrXE[/YT]

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

Those descriptions sound... Suboptimal, if I am being charitable. But then again if I was told all the stuff in MOS second hand I would most likely hate it too. Actually watching it I came away loving it to peices (I now await the inevitable posts that attemp to change my mind about MOS and how EVERYTHING in it is terrible, from script to acting to VFX to the colors to Cavil's hair to production design to how Crowe pronounced "Krypton"...)

Flyby would have made a very good opening film. The first draft took many liberties, Krypton was dying, not dead being the biggest, then Luthor being one of Kata-Zor's agents but with amnesia being the next, but successive drafts improved them greatly.

If Flyby's elements of Clark's growth from a toddler to college and his establishment in the Daily Planet with Man of Steel's exploration of Clark's saving people in private saves and overall story arc and we would have had the film that was sold to us in the trailers, and much less negative criticism from fans and critics alike.

 

[Tempest]

Superman Lives was the Tim Burton Doomsday film, killed by Doomsday resurrected by Eradicator, zombie suits etc.

Superman Reborn was the very short lived film where Superman dies and and his soul impregnates Lois and she gives birth to him and he ages rapidly.

Superman Flyby is the one where the first draft has Lex Luthor as a Kryptonian.

The second one reminds me of the "Superman's Girlfriend Lois Lane" comics from days gone past. Those were creepy as **** too.

 

[afan]

I would actually bet money on it that the movie will begin with a scene with Bruce winessing Zod's message in the batcave. He is in detective mode and all of a sudden the lights go out and the batcomputer is hijacked by Zod.

"You are not alone."

After that, maybe his reactions on the big battle in Metropolis, which will be THE main reason he will go after Supes in the beginning and come to Metropolis.

At least, I hope they begin with that, or at least show a flashback later on. It would be bad not to show Bruces reaction.

Don't see it. Bruce Wayne is all about Gotham, don't see why he would care enough to launch a crusade to protect Metropolis.

To be honest, I don't see any "ordinary" scenario that would make Batman and Superman combatants. A team-up rife with disagreement re. the methods used to resolve conflict sure, but Batman going after Superman, or Superman going after Batman, never, under ordinary circumstance(i.e. bereft of mind control, or Frank Miller's "elseworld" The Dark Knight Returns type scenario, etc.)

I recall a post a month or so back that proposed Bruce Wayne/Batman going after Superman on the behalf of Lex Luthor. The poster claimed to have insider info. He said that Wayne and Luthor were friends and Wayne was ignorant of Luthor's "dark side". If so this rationale for a Batman /Superman throwdown would be horrible!

 

[The Infernal]

Yeah, I can't see Batman being tricked by Luthor working either. Though I wouldn't mind it if Bruce Wayne and Lex Luthor were friends or had a shared history in the movie.

 

[smallville fan]

Hey guys here's an interesting thought that came up in AMC Movie Talk today and check out the question from about 33:05:

[YT]Dn2vczo6Vgc[/YT]

John Campea raised an interesting idea. So people were complaining that Superman wasn't really saving anyone in Metropolis etc etc, what if somebody was already doing that so Superman could fully deal with Zod & the World Engine? What if somehow that somebody already knew what could potentially arise when an alien invasion of that magnitude and told Clark from afar, "You stop the big guys, I'll save the people"? It seems plausible, I mean a hero like that wouldn't just simply sit by while something like this is happening. If so then good for you and you already scored points in my book.

 

[Binker]

Warner Bros CEO Kevin Tsujihara told investors at the Bank of America Merrill Lynch Media, Communications and Entertainment Conference, a little tidbit about Batman in MOS2 that has to be put here because, well, I'm not too sure of... yet.

He said this: the Dark Knight in the unnamed sequel to Man Of Steel is “kind of tired and weary and seasoned and been doing it for a while."
Now, that could be presented in a number of different ways, and we have known we're dealing with a Batman who has been operating for a while, but that "tired" bit seems to make Batman older than even Affleck, like DKR old. Probably not, I'm sure, and we've had history where studio CEOs present a vague take on a character or film that a more detailed explanation later fixes it, but still it is something to talk about.

Another thing that he said, which isn't questionable at all, was this: Ben Affleck — a controversial choice to play Batman among many fans — “is perfect for the vision….We think it’s going to be huge.” Tsujihara says the film is one example of how his DC Comics unit “really does tie to all parts of our business.” The company has three animated TV shows based on DC characters, and “think about the direct to videos we do with DC and the games. This year we have two huge games.” The CEO added that “I love the way our slate is positioned going forward.” With opportunities in television and home video, “we’re confident we can grow this business.”

Source: Deadline New York http://bit.ly/160D17t

 

[mclay18]

If IMDB is to be believed, three art directors have joined the production:

- Lorin Flemming (Twilight Saga: Breaking Dawn)
- Tom Frohling (X-Men: First Class, Transcendance)
- Gregory S. Hooper (The Avengers, Transcendance)

All three worked on Transcendance, where Chris Seagers (X-Men: First Class) was production designer. It's possible Seagers could be taking over Alex McDowell's duties as PD.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Alright, someone from TA

If anything DC related should have a TA type tone, I think it should be a Superman/Batman movie. I want JLA to be a hardcore mythological epic drama. So put Affleck on that, and if he feels weirded out by the CGI/greenscreen let Zack co-direct. Or just get Del Toro

 

[Jekecy]

He said this: the Dark Knight in the unnamed sequel to Man Of Steel is “kind of tired and weary and seasoned and been doing it for a while."

Bleh. I sincerely wish I'm wrong with how I'm reading the bolded, because that is a total downer considering where they could've taken Ben. He's got the physicality down, why hamper it with this weariness nonsense? I got a taste of that with TDKR and it did nothing but make me anxious to see Bruce come back to form. It made sense in Miller's book because of how old he was, but Ben could easily be in his prime. This is merely the beginning of the DC movie universe, how can they possibly think to already place Batman at a disadvantage instead of growing?

Anyhoo, this isn't coming from Snyder, Goyer, or Affleck. So here's hoping this isn't the case. I was genuinely excited for a more proactive and pensive take on the character.

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

I think that might be the point. They can't link Ben's Batman to Christian's narratively, but can do so thematically, so he isn't a huge "culture-shock" to the audience following only 3 years. But we'll see him transition hopefully to a more traditional- for want of a better word- Batman.

 

[Malcolm Reynold]

I think that might be the point. They can't link Ben's Batman to Christian's narratively, but can do so thematically, so he isn't a huge "culture-shock" to the audience following only 3 years. But we'll see him transition hopefully to a more traditional- for want of a better word- Batman.

True, I mean just because he is "tired and weary" in this film doesn't mean he will always be that way. It's like the Daniel Craig Bond trilogy, where the first two films were sort of a pseudo origin story for how he becomes classic Bond because it's a reboot. But then in Skyfall they act like Bond has been in the business for too long, he is the old dog. Now this doesn't make much sense when looking at the other two movies but it makes sense for the story they wanted to tell and in Bond 24 it's likely he will go back to a more youthful Bond again. I feel like this approach could be what they are doing for Batman, where the character's state is subtly changed in different movies to suit the individual story they want to tell rather than the other way round.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Don't see it. Bruce Wayne is all about Gotham, don't see why he would care enough to launch a crusade to protect Metropolis.

To be honest, I don't see any "ordinary" scenario that would make Batman and Superman combatants. A team-up rife with disagreement re. the methods used to resolve conflict sure, but Batman going after Superman, or Superman going after Batman, never, under ordinary circumstance(i.e. bereft of mind control, or Frank Miller's "elseworld" The Dark Knight Returns type scenario, etc.)

I recall a post a month or so back that proposed Bruce Wayne/Batman going after Superman on the behalf of Lex Luthor. The poster claimed to have insider info. He said that Wayne and Luthor were friends and Wayne was ignorant of Luthor's "dark side". If so this rationale for a Batman /Superman throwdown would be horrible!

I don't want Wayne and Luthor being friends. But I'm surprisingly okay with Bruce being duped by Luthor.

It feeds into Batman's ability to be blinded by paranoia. And it would only serve to make Bruce want to take Lex down.

 

[samsnee]

The fact that this Batman will be seasoned makes me think the sequel takes place a few years after MoS, and he didn't actually reveal himself until after the events of MoS.

 

[Hypestyle]

Who are highly (super)powerful Batman foes that can be included in these films? Clayface? Killer Croc? Poison Ivy? Blockbuster?

 

[samsnee]

If you really want to let people know this isn't Nolan's Batman, then all of them. Embrace the fantastic elements.

 

[TheFlamingCoco]

Start by changing the Batsuit/voices. Hint at Robin, reference someone like Mr Freeze..

But show this Batman is different by giving him a completely different personality. I think that's the most effective thing.

Make him SCARY. Not just 'kind of' scary, or a little unsettling. Make him a horror character who HAPPENS to be the good guy (and doesn't kill)

Long ears are best

 

[Loki882]

Tired and weary could simply mean that's he's been rendered jaded and cynical by all the corruption and crime in the world, it doesn't have to be physical, but mental and spiritual. It would contrast nicely with a young, somewhat idealistic Superman.

 

[Dk1201]

Ok so are Thursdays "release info about Batman/Superman" day it seems every Thursday since Ben Affleck's casting there has been a new news item on thrusday

 

[TX85]

If you really want to let people know this isn't Nolan's Batman, then all of them. Embrace the fantastic elements.

Agreed!

 

[TX85]

This is funny and serious at the same time.
[YT]WrrjWz_CrXE[/YT]

Very sad but true!

 

[TheBat812]

Don't see it. Bruce Wayne is all about Gotham, don't see why he would care enough to launch a crusade to protect Metropolis.

To be honest, I don't see any "ordinary" scenario that would make Batman and Superman combatants. A team-up rife with disagreement re. the methods used to resolve conflict sure, but Batman going after Superman, or Superman going after Batman, never, under ordinary circumstance(i.e. bereft of mind control, or Frank Miller's "elseworld" The Dark Knight Returns type scenario, etc.)

I recall a post a month or so back that proposed Bruce Wayne/Batman going after Superman on the behalf of Lex Luthor. The poster claimed to have insider info. He said that Wayne and Luthor were friends and Wayne was ignorant of Luthor's "dark side". If so this rationale for a Batman /Superman throwdown would be horrible!

I think it might be more about Bruce realizing his mission to save Gotham means nothing when the whole Earth is at the mercy of Gods like Superman. Luthor might actually seem like a pretty worthwhile partnership to Bruce in terms of minimizing that threat and being preemptively ready to deal with such a threat until Lex's obsession with bringing Superman down starts toeing that moral line that guides Bruce, and he starts to realize that Superman, despite his incredible potential for dominance is really the opposite in mindset. Really would be a great intro to Bruce's idea of having 'a contingency for everyone' like he does in the JL. Just a guess, but would definitely be an angle I'd support, and it makes a lot of sense considering all he probably has seen of Superman is his extraordinary abilities and that he will kill another being. We all know how cautious Bruce is when it comes to things like that.

 

[TheBat812]

Well I wish they would officially clarify as such since every other news site keep reporting this film as a sequel to MOS and before someone brings up the example with "The Avengers" and the films that came before it, not once do I recall "The Avengers" being labeled as a follow up or "sequel" to either Thor, Iron Man 2, TIH, or CA.

I honestly don't think they know or want to label it in either direction. It's a story that involves both characters that continues the world left off from MOS. It's not necessarily as simple as "it's this guy's movie and this other guys' just a guest." If they're doing their job right, it shouldn't really be either way. Wanting it to be labeled one way or the other feels like fanboy hubris getting in the way.

 

[Herolee10]

Tired and weary could simply mean that's he's been rendered jaded and cynical by all the corruption and crime in the world, it doesn't have to be physical, but mental and spiritual. It would contrast nicely with a young, somewhat idealistic Superman.

I would hope that if this film does take place from Superman's POV, that by the end of the film, Superman's heroics and action instills a renewed hope for humanity in batman, which would further tie in with what Superman is supposed to be all about.